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Author Topic: Xenon lamp cooling
Jerry Chase
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1068
From: Margate, FL, USA
Registered: Nov 2000


 - posted 04-26-2001 01:12 PM      Profile for Jerry Chase   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Burnt mustiness is an appropriate metaphor. That is exactly what the ozone is doing, "burning" or oxidizing the dust and mold in the air. I'm not sure that the actual pure ozone has an odor as much as an acrid sensation. I can verify the effects though. Most of the time when I visited the radio station (another ozone generator) as a kid, I'd smell the difference in the air and get a headache.

If trying John's transformer trick, keep one hand behind your back. I'm sure this goes without saying to the active participants, but you never know who could be lurking.

One of the _absolute dumbest_ tricks I ever heard of anyone pulling was one female projectionist, who decided that she looked a little pale and the xenon lamp would give her a quick tan. She got away with it, but she was the one who later had the low power bulb explode on her. I only learned of her "tanning booth" after the bulb explosion. Some people are accidents waiting to happen.

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 04-26-2001 01:46 PM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Unprotected viewing of a xenon or carbon arc, even for a few seconds, is likely to permanently damage your eyes. If you're lucky, you'll see the after-image of the arc that was burned into your retinas for the rest of your life. If you're unlucky, you could lose your eyesight entirely. NEVER open the lamphouse while the lamp is lit (or hot), and NEVER look directly into the "business end" (lens) of the running projector.

------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Eastman Kodak Company
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7419
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: 716-477-5325 Cell: 716-781-4036 Fax: 716-722-7243
E-Mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Web site: http://www.kodak.com/go/motion


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Gordon McLeod
Film God

Posts: 9532
From: Toronto Ontario Canada
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 04-26-2001 08:05 PM      Profile for Gordon McLeod   Email Gordon McLeod   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Ozone is an unstable molicule it is O3
All Xenon lmaphouses produce some ozone on ignition from the spark gap. Even with Ozone free lamps
Some of the smaller compact ignitors have seal sparkgaps that help prevent ozone generation
I remember working in a small 5 screen booth with 700 watt lamps that were vented into the room and the lingering smell of ozone for about 1/2 after all 5 shows started
Small amounts of Ozone are helpfull as an air purifer

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Chris Erwin
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 195
From: Olive Hill,KY
Registered: Oct 1999


 - posted 04-26-2001 09:27 PM      Profile for Chris Erwin   Email Chris Erwin   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Ozone....memories of model train transformers come to mind. Some of the older ones...whoa, you get a whiff of ozone.

When I was really young, I just thought it was just a added feature of the train. (realistic smell choo-choo)

I'd figure a way to at least vent it away from the immediate operating area. (Dryer hose?) I've seen some places run the vent to the attic, or others into/through a wall. At 500w and you're not running a daily grind (4 or more shows per day) you shouldn't have any big problem...but it's a good way to save $$$ on lamps.

--Chris

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Randy Stankey
Film God

Posts: 6539
From: Erie, Pennsylvania
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 04-27-2001 01:11 AM      Profile for Randy Stankey   Email Randy Stankey   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I would describe the smell of ozone as that "electricity smell" you get after a good lightning storm.

I had a General Manager who opened the lamphouse door. The lamp failed during the show and he came running into the booth and opened her right up. Tha lamphouse hadn't even been off for a minute. The projectionist on duty was already at the machine. When that clown opened the door he just ran the other way! (I found out about this the next morning after it happened.)

When people ask me how bright the xenon lamp is I tell them, "Well I don't know for sure, I've never actually looked at it. That's why I'm not blind."
Kidding aside; I have always told people that it's something like ten times brighter than looking at the sun. Then I tell them that it's so bright that if you look at it (without protection) that you'll be blind even before you "see" the light... you'll just look in and the next thing you'll notice is that you can't see anymore.


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Bernard Tonks
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 619
From: Cranleigh, Surrey, England
Registered: Apr 2001


 - posted 04-28-2001 07:49 AM      Profile for Bernard Tonks   Email Bernard Tonks   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
30 years ago I did a days relief projection at the old Classic Kilburn when xenon bulbs were not ozone free. The smell was most putrid and I did suffer from severe headache. How the chief operator coped with this I never did find out. I know I was glad to get back to my own show with Peerless carbon arcs.

Worthing beach in the UK can be extremely bad from ozone with the seaweed, the sort of place to go if you want the experience, and maybe good for your health as it is by the sea ?

I changed to xenons 19 years ago, first 1.6k, now 2k. Can someone please tell me the year ozone free lamps were first introduced, and was this a health and safety issue.

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Jan Hackett
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 148
From: Albuquerque, NM, USA
Registered: Apr 2002


 - posted 06-04-2002 01:08 PM      Profile for Jan Hackett   Email Jan Hackett   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
HELP... I am smelling a pungent odor in my booth right now. Is it my superior quartz bulb 7kw bulb leaking.?????

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Jan Hackett
Theater Operations Manager
Extreme Screen Dynatheater
NM Museum of Natural History Foundation

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 06-04-2002 01:42 PM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Jan said: "HELP... I am smelling a pungent odor in my booth right now. Is it my superior quartz bulb 7kw bulb leaking.?????"

AFAIK, xenon gas is odorless and would not have a "pungent" odor.

Here is an MSDS:
http://www.praxair.com/praxair.nsf/0/85a2707fb21e443c85256a86008221b2/$FILE/P4677C.pdf

Anyway, loss of xenon pressure would quickly cause lamp failure.

The odor may be ozone. In a xenon lamphouse, ozone may be generated by high voltage "corona" discharge (lamp ignition system) or by breakdown of oxygen molecules by intense ultraviolet energy from the lamp (not using an "ozone free" lamp that has additives to the quartz envelope to reduce ultraviolet energy). Are your lamps well vented to the outside?

Pungent odors could also be caused by excessive heating or burning of materials, such as plastic wire insulation. Obviously you need to find the source.

I assume you are familiar with the characteristic "pungent" odor of prints "rejuvenated" with UV-cured overcoats?

------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7525A
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: +1 585 477 5325 Cell: +1 585 781 4036 Fax: +1 585 722 7243
e-mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Web site: http://www.kodak.com/go/motion


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Frank Angel
Film God

Posts: 5305
From: Brooklyn NY USA
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 06-05-2002 05:02 AM      Profile for Frank Angel   Author's Homepage   Email Frank Angel   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
But isn't ozone supposed to be a kind of air purifier? or disinfectant? I remember they used to sell these devices that had untraviolet bulbs in them and a small fan and supposidely this "cleaned" the air. I remember the hype on the box saying just what Tom said about the thunderstorm -- "You can smell the freshness it brings to the room because it smells just like country air after a thunderstorm." I always thought it was a good thing. Like it's bad when we deplete it, as in the hole in the ozone layer. Or am I confusing it with something else?

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 06-05-2002 06:11 AM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Although upper atmosphere ozone helps protect the earth from excessive ultraviolet radiation, high levels of ozone at ground level are harmful to the health. Ozone is a major component of "smog" that pollutes the air of major cities.

Here is something I found on the Internet:

"OSHA regulates employee exposure to ozone gas through its Air Contaminants Standard, 29 CFR 1910.1000. The permissible exposure limit (PEL) is listed in Table Z-1 as an 8-hour, time-weighted average value of 0.1 part of ozone per million parts of air (ppm). Rule 29 CFR 1910.1000(e) requires that administrative or engineering controls must first be identified and implemented whenever feasible to achieve compliance with the PEL. When such controls are not feasible to achieve compliance, personal protective equipment, respirators, or any other protective measures shall be used to keep the exposure of employees to ozone gas within the PEL."
http://www.kesmist.com/oz1.htm

Here's the EPA word on ozone "air purifiers":
http://www.epa.gov/iaq/pubs/ozonegen.html

Health Canada agrees:
http://www.odatus.com/doc70.html

------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7525A
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: +1 585 477 5325 Cell: +1 585 781 4036 Fax: +1 585 722 7243
e-mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Web site: http://www.kodak.com/go/motion


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Brian Tristam Williams
Film Handler

Posts: 93
From: Johannesburg, South Africa
Registered: Apr 2002


 - posted 06-05-2002 12:34 PM      Profile for Brian Tristam Williams   Author's Homepage   Email Brian Tristam Williams   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Just as I was about to ask, I read John's response. For ten years or more now, I've wondered if this was ozone, and I've just gotten my answer: A friend and I were having a look at a black-and-white TV that had lost its vertical retrace. While looking at the PCB, I accidentally touched the insulation on the cable from the flyback transformer to the tube. A purple plasma-like 'aura' glow connected my fingertip to the wire when my hand was an inch or so from the wire, but there was no touch sensation to it, and there definitely was a scent involved.

For some reason, I always thought that that must be ozone. As to whoever asked if their lamp was 'leaking', I don't think that ozone is something within the lamp that can leak out. It is something that is created, externally to the lamp.

[Edited because I read the answer in John's .PDF link. Xenon is not toxic, a gas, and almost totally inert, is the answer I sought.]

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"One man can make a difference."


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