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» Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE   » Operations   » Film Handlers' Forum   » disposing of xenons? (Page 2)

 
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Author Topic: disposing of xenons?
Jonathan Worthing
Master Film Handler

Posts: 384
From: Hereford, UK
Registered: Apr 2001


 - posted 03-11-2002 06:42 AM      Profile for Jonathan Worthing   Email Jonathan Worthing   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
GOOD GOD

Is your insurance up to date.


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Gerard S. Cohen
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 975
From: Forest Hills, NY, USA
Registered: Sep 2001


 - posted 03-11-2002 09:00 AM      Profile for Gerard S. Cohen   Email Gerard S. Cohen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 

Doesn't ANYONE save the tungsten anodes and cathodes?
Or the attractive stainless steel end shells?

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Leo Enticknap
Film God

Posts: 7474
From: Loma Linda, CA
Registered: Jul 2000


 - posted 03-11-2002 09:42 AM      Profile for Leo Enticknap   Author's Homepage   Email Leo Enticknap   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Yes - the anode cores make lovely paperweights.

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Brad Haven
Master Film Handler

Posts: 300
From: fremantle, West Australia
Registered: Aug 2001


 - posted 03-11-2002 10:11 AM      Profile for Brad Haven   Email Brad Haven   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
thank's for all your replies!
i'm going to have some SAFE fun this week!
joe, was that a typo when you said 9000 hrs ?, we struggle to get 4000 hrs (2k and a 1.6k xenons) from ours!, (ushio and super lume-x)


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Jerry Chase
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1068
From: Margate, FL, USA
Registered: Nov 2000


 - posted 03-11-2002 11:46 AM      Profile for Jerry Chase   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Leo, your film/video could be done many ways. Replacing the side panel of a lamphouse with a double layer of lexan would be simple, and a metal occlusion circle could be glued in the direct line of sight between camera lens and arc, with layers of ND material surrounding it to cut the contrast range with the rest of the lamphouse. A small hole in the lamphouse directly over the envelope could admit a few drops of water...

I might place a melon in the lamphouse for added effect, or maybe add a rubber face mask and one of those rubber hands used on Halloween.


Joe may have been joking about the 9,000 hrs, but I have heard rumors that there was one theatre that had an early conversion to xenon and didn't replace the lamp for a fantastic number of hours. I don't know how true it was.

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Ken Lackner
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1907
From: Atlanta, GA, USA
Registered: Sep 2001


 - posted 03-11-2002 03:57 PM      Profile for Ken Lackner   Email Ken Lackner   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I pack my bulbs in their original cartons, with protective cover in place, seal up the box with duct tape, and toss 'em off the balcony in the back of the building. Or I throw the box hard on the floor. The latter is probablly safer. Although the anode would make a nice paper weight, I wouldn't want to be the one to open the box with all that borken glass. I can do without.

I've heard of wrapping the bulb up in a 50lb popcorn seed bag and smashing it with a happer. That doesn't sound like as much fun as throwing it down the stairs.

------------------
This one time, at Projection Camp, I stuck a xenon bulb....

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Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

Posts: 12859
From: Denver, Colorado
Registered: May 99


 - posted 03-11-2002 04:16 PM      Profile for Joe Redifer   Author's Homepage   Email Joe Redifer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Yeah, I was joking about the 9,000 hours. I was poking fun at how cheap some cinema owners are.

About the video/film, how could you do it "no cuts" and have near-perfect exposure when the bulb is on and when it is off (before it strikes) and during the explosion (there will only be a quick flash) and afterwards to see the damage it caused? Does slow film have that kind of range?


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Richard Fowler
Film God

Posts: 2392
From: Ft. Lauderdale, FL, USA
Registered: Jun 2001


 - posted 03-11-2002 04:16 PM      Profile for Richard Fowler   Email Richard Fowler   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Victor Nicelli of Cinemeccanica told me of customers running bulbs 9000 - 12000 hours in their older CX vertical lamphouses in Africa.
Richard Fowler
TVP-Theatre & Video Products Inc. www.tvpmiami.com

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Gordon McLeod
Film God

Posts: 9532
From: Toronto Ontario Canada
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 03-11-2002 05:17 PM      Profile for Gordon McLeod   Email Gordon McLeod   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
At the Penn Center cinema in St Catherines Ontario they had the zeis xenosol III's with 2500 watt verticle lamps on a MG set and due to the very high impedance of the MG and filtering they got over 7 years on one lamp and the hour meter had stopped working (it was a grind house) When we removed the lamp (and lamphouse to install some new strong superlumex's) the lamp was clear but very brittle

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Jon Bartow
Master Film Handler

Posts: 287
From: Massachusetts
Registered: Nov 1999


 - posted 03-11-2002 05:32 PM      Profile for Jon Bartow   Email Jon Bartow   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Quoted from Osram/Sylvania Document # DQ4-144-059

WARNING:
In accordance with ANSI/IESNA Standard RP-27, this XBO bulb is a Risk Group 3 product.
Read and understand this warning before using this bulb!
XBO lamps are at high internal pressure when cold (up to 35 bar
or approximately 525 psi) and at operating temperature (up to 80
bar or approximately 1200 psi at bulb wall temperatures of 600°C
to 800°C). Therefore, XBO lamps may unexpectedly rupture
resulting in the discharge of hot fragments of quartz and/or glass
and metal . In the event of such a rupture, there is a risk of
personal injury, burns and fire. Only handle lamps with their
protective covers in place. Do not handle lamps without their
protective covers unless government-approved (OSHA-approved
in the U.S.A.) safety glasses, facemask (with neck protector),
chest protector, and gauntlets are worn.
RUPTURE & RADIATION (UV-VISIBLE-IR) HAZARDS:
1. Intense ultraviolet (UV), visible, and infrared (IR) radiation is also generated during operation. This
radiation can cause permanent damage to the eyes (including blindness) and serious injury to the skin
(including burns and blistering). Some operating lamps also generate ozone (O3). Others, designated
“OFR,” are constructed of materials that prevent the generation of ozone. See the “Ozone
Generation” section below.
2. To avoid eye damage, other personal injury and/or property damage, the lamp MUST be operated in
a suitable fixture. A suitable fixture is one that will prevent the arc from being viewed directly while
operating. It is ventilated to the outside for those lamps that produce ozone and, in the event of a
rupture, will prevent hot (up to 800°C), flying fragments of quartz and/or glass or metal from escaping
into the surrounding area.
3. To minimize the risk of a lamp rupture, the lamp must be replaced at or before the end of rated life
(see catalog for rated life) or when the lamp shows signs of advanced blackening or quartz
devitrification (recrystalization, a white, frosted appearance).
4. XBO lamps are constructed of quartz glass, tungsten electrodes and either tungsten support rods or
molybdenum foils. High wattage XBO lamps used for cinema film projection have nickel-plated end
caps (bases). Reflectorized XBO lamps have a dichroic-coated borosilicate glass reflector.


LAMP DISPOSAL:
1. There is a risk that a lamp could rupture because of its high internal pressure (both hot and at room
temperature). A lamp rupture could result in personal injury or property damage from flying
fragments of glass and/or metal. Therefore, spent (end-of-life) lamps should ALWAYS be stored in
the protective covers and packaging in which they originally came, and ultimately de-pressurized
before release for disposal. The following is one example of a de-pressurizing method for XBO
lamps prior to disposal, but it may not be the most suitable or appropriate method depending on the
circumstance:
· The operator must wear government-approved (OSHA-approved in the U.S.A.) safety glasses,
facemask (with neck protector), chest protector, and gauntlets during this entire procedure.
· With protective lamp covers in place, place lamps1 into steel drum2 and lock down cover with
bolt ring and bolt.
· Drop drum onto solid surface (concrete floor) from at least five feet. Increase height as needed
to ensure all lamps are de-pressurized.
· Wait for dust to settle (about 5 minutes) before opening drum. Loosen bolt and allow gas to
escape before complete removal of cover.
1 The lamps should not exceed the half-full point in the drums. Adjust the maximum number of lamps
accordingly.
2 8, 20, or 30-gallon drums, depending on quantity of lamps to be de-pressurized, are available. Drums of 20-
gauge steel are recommended and are available from many safety supply companies.
2. Disposal of spent lamps must be in accordance with applicable federal, state/provincial, and local
regulations. State laws differ in their disposal requirements.
3. U.S. lamp users may obtain information concerning relevant agencies and disposal regulations from
the Federal Superfund Hotline (Resource Conservation & Recovery Act) at 800-424-9346.
Information may be available as to the appropriate state agencies to contact regarding disposal issues.
4. OSRAM SYLVANIA Products Inc. cannot advise lamp users as to general or specific disposal
regulations for federal, state/provincial, and/or local municipalities.

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Jerry Chase
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1068
From: Margate, FL, USA
Registered: Nov 2000


 - posted 03-11-2002 06:32 PM      Profile for Jerry Chase   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
"I've heard of wrapping the bulb up in a 50lb popcorn seed bag and smashing it with a happer. "

Hey Ken, what the H--- is a happer and where can I get one?

Joe, film has an incredible range. A. Adams "zone" system was (and probably still is) the best way to exploit this with large format negatives. The concept is to tweak the exposure and developer to match the contrast range you want and place it correctly on the curve.

Check out this for a better explanation of development tweaking.

There could be a no-cuts taking of the film, but using a time code marking the different events so the various sections of the film could be processed differently for perfect exposure range. Adding fill light would eliminate the need for extreme low light imaging.

We expect you to have this project completed under budget within the week.


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Gerard S. Cohen
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 975
From: Forest Hills, NY, USA
Registered: Sep 2001


 - posted 03-11-2002 08:29 PM      Profile for Gerard S. Cohen   Email Gerard S. Cohen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 

Possible uses for xenon bulb parts:

TUNGSTEN CATHODES--Reloaders might fit them to high-power cal.23 or .223 cartridges as A.P. projectiles (with increased wear on the
rifle barrel's lands, however) I think tungsten is heavier than lead.
TUNGSTEN ANODES--Use as balance scale weights for use by reloaders,
chemists or darkroom photographers. Or make into chess pieces by
painting or grinding designs to differentiate the ranks.
---Since tungsten is valuable, they might be sold to a metal reclamation company.
XENON BULB ENDCAPS-- Wire with sockets and a dimmer to make a hanging
chandelier for your home theatre. All needed parts available at Home Depot lamp center. Five or seven in a circle on a barrel hoop would
be a minimum-cost approach, but your creative sense can do better.
Or use seven for a menorah, or nine for a hanukia, using candles or
decorative electric bulbs.

Since my last steady job was at a single screen, the bulbs accumulated on the shelf in their plastic safety enclosures within cardboard boxes rather slowly. But when I needed shelf space, I would
don the OSHA protective gear, wrap each bulb in an entire newspaper, put it into a leg cut from a pair of jeans, and hit it with a hammer,
on a concrete floor, resulting in a muted "pop." After removing the
parts to recycle, I would package the glass in the newspapers, pack
them in a corrugated carton marked Caution! Broken Glass! seal it with
duct tape and place it next to the trash barrel for the porter to
dispose of.

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Aaron Sisemore
Flaming Ribs beat Reeses Peanut Butter Cups any day!

Posts: 3061
From: Rockwall TX USA
Registered: Sep 1999


 - posted 03-11-2002 08:58 PM      Profile for Aaron Sisemore   Email Aaron Sisemore   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Jeez, Jon!

Those guys at Osram must be totally trying to cover their asses with that form!!

C'mon guys-its just a xenon bulb, not a nuclear weapon. Superfund disposal site? All thats in a xenon is quartz, tungsten, ceramic and xenon gas. None of which are toxic or unstable.

Additionally, anyone that tries to handle a HOT xenon is just plain STUPID.

-Aaron



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Paul G. Thompson
The Weenie Man

Posts: 4718
From: Mount Vernon WA USA
Registered: Nov 2000


 - posted 03-11-2002 10:04 PM      Profile for Paul G. Thompson   Email Paul G. Thompson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Gerald, take one of those 20mm anodes from a large xenon lamp and set it on the steps of the local doughnut shop (errrrr....police station) steps. I'll bet the cops would have a cow wondering what it is, where it came from, and how did it get there....


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Ken Lackner
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1907
From: Atlanta, GA, USA
Registered: Sep 2001


 - posted 03-12-2002 09:59 AM      Profile for Ken Lackner   Email Ken Lackner   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Quote "'I've heard of wrapping the bulb up in a 50lb popcorn seed bag and smashing it with a happer.'
Hey Ken, what the H--- is a happer and where can I get one? "

Oops, I mean hammer!

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