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Author Topic: Alternate DTS Tracks?
Greg Anderson
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 766
From: Ogden Valley, Utah
Registered: Nov 1999


 - posted 03-18-2002 11:03 PM      Profile for Greg Anderson   Author's Homepage   Email Greg Anderson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
A part of me doesn't want to touch this particular topic. After all, Utah is now notorious for having theatres which censor movies. (It only happened at one theatre which was showing Titanic, but from the press they received you'd think it was state-wide in 1997-98). Then there was more than one video editor "cleaning up" copies of Titanic on VHS and I thought... Come on! Either the movie is good enough to watch or it isn't. There are other movies (including a wonderful A&E documentary) about the Titanic and you don't need to watch this one... especially if you already think there's something wrong with it. Let it go! It's only a movie (...with a really silly love story between all the neato digital effects).

The best thing you can do if you're opposed to the offensive material in a movie is to not watch it, not rent the video, not watch it when it's been edited for network TV, not recommend it to your friends and stop telling yourself that "it was really good except for that one part."

It's no secret that movie attendance has gone down in the last few years and that a large percentage of the available movies haven't been very good. Maybe Hollywood will get the message. Maybe not. But by this time next year we'll be asking ourselves which movies made the most money during the previous 18 months and we'e going to see Star Wars, Monsters Inc, two Harry Potters and two Lord of the Rings movies. Combined, the grosses will be in the billions yet you'll be able to count the profanities without taking off your socks. There will be plenty of complaints about violence but nobody's going to be whining that "these movies weren't artistic enough because there wasn't enough profanity." And... Hollywood will still be planning another Scary Movie sequel.

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Mike Spaeth
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1129
From: Marietta, GA
Registered: Jul 2000


 - posted 03-19-2002 01:13 AM      Profile for Mike Spaeth   Author's Homepage   Email Mike Spaeth   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The funniest TV edit has to be Pulp Fiction. It's nothing like the original ... almost looks like a foreign dub job.

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Josh Kirkhart
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 165
From: Austin/Houston, TX, USA
Registered: Nov 2001


 - posted 03-19-2002 02:38 AM      Profile for Josh Kirkhart   Email Josh Kirkhart   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I'm sorry but screw this. Yes, DTS offers cool solutions as far as alternate language tracks. But to happily overdub language so we can get more kids in theatres I say again, screw this!

Anyone in the biz has been assaulted with kiddy fare like no other in the last year. I'm sorry, I like the foul language, I like the lack of children in my auditoriums(I must confess I tech most things so I don't have to put up with anyone who I don't wanna). Our busiest days are around kids movies and adventure movies, fine. I love checking I.D.'s at the door(my hobbie at work) and kicking kids out, or pointing them to other movies. I love informing the parents of the rude language and sex they were about to let thier children see, although sad to say they don't care. The only time most parents stand up and say no to thier kids is when we inform them they must see the film with thier child.

I'm ranting and falling away from subject. Use DTS discs to give us great dubs, if those exist, so more audiences will take in that artsy fanfare. Don't get me wrong I love cheesy adventure flicks, I just enjoy them not so PC.

Since I'm rambling. Mirimax blows the big one. Horrible dubs. Making cuts of films to make them generic enough for america. Bad title changes-Kung Fu Soccer- anyone. Terrible campains. Give these movies to Sony, they atleast have a idea of what to do.

Ok, I'll stop but damn I'm pissed, I even edited myself in this post.


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Jon Bartow
Master Film Handler

Posts: 287
From: Massachusetts
Registered: Nov 1999


 - posted 03-19-2002 06:51 AM      Profile for Jon Bartow   Email Jon Bartow   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
OK, getting back to the topic title:
Alternate DTS tracks??? If one had different sets of DTS discs for the same movie (i.e. one in English rated-R, one in English rated-PG and the same in French and Spanish) what would prevent the regular analog rated-R sound track from playing if the DTS unit failed for some reason during a show (no offense Karen, just making a point)? The distributors would have to have dual inventories. (Dual inventories to accomidate any theater wanting the PG version with SR-D or SDDS too.)
Having a theater dictate what they will and will not show (i.e. requesting the PG version over the R-version) sounds like an invitation for First Ammendment lawsuits.

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Dave Bird
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 777
From: Perth, Ontario, Canada
Registered: Jun 2000


 - posted 03-19-2002 07:06 AM      Profile for Dave Bird   Author's Homepage   Email Dave Bird   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
OK, dumb idea duly noted, BUT it is still my opinion that there is no good reason to market a film that is R-rated as opposed to PG just because of language. It ain't a moral thing either, that's just stupid marketing.

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Barry Floyd
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1079
From: Lebanon, Tennessee, USA
Registered: Mar 2000


 - posted 03-19-2002 12:01 PM      Profile for Barry Floyd   Author's Homepage   Email Barry Floyd   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I liked the idea, then after reading everyone's post... I think the two track versions could survive in the proper setting. If indoor theatres offered the Saturday morning kiddie matinee's that they did long ago, it would work. The other venue that it could work... the drive-in.

I don't know how many Film-Techer's frequent drive-ins, but if you did - you would see that the MAJORITY of the clientel is young families with young children. Sure, you may say... if you don't like what being said in a particular film... don't see it, and don't bring your children with their "innocent ears" to the theatre. One of the sole reasons people DO still go to the drive-ins is the fact that you CAN bring your kids to the movies and not have to worry about disturbing the people sitting next to you.

Why could you not have two DTS tracks playing simultaneously, but broadcasting on different frequencies? Adults tune their radios to channel "X" and families tune to channel "Y".

If you could get the remaining 400+ drive-ins in the country to offer an alternative, it might catch on. I would willing to think that a drive-in that caters to the family-types would even pay a small premium to offer such a service. I know I would.


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Steve Kraus
Film God

Posts: 4094
From: Chicago, IL, USA
Registered: May 2000


 - posted 03-19-2002 03:38 PM      Profile for Steve Kraus     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Greg Anderson claimed:
>It's no secret that movie attendance has gone down in the
>last few years

It has? Not according to the MPAA which states that not only did boxoffice $$ set a record but to dispute that this was entirely due to rising ticket prices, says that more tickets were sold last year than any year since 1959.

From the MPAA web site:
---
To bolster his observations, Valenti announced that "2001 was the greatest box office year in film history" with total receipts of $8.41 billion. He noted that "a record twenty films released in 2001 soared to more than $100 million box office, with a record five films reaching the rarefied air of $200 million box office."

In addition to the success of the box office receipts, Valenti reported that admissions in 2001 came to 1.5 billion, a 5% increase from the previous year and a 30% increase from since the beginning of the decade. "It was," said Valenti, "the largest ticket buying total since 1959!"
---

I presume you can cite a source for your data which you claim refutes this.

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Gordon McLeod
Film God

Posts: 9532
From: Toronto Ontario Canada
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 03-19-2002 03:51 PM      Profile for Gordon McLeod   Email Gordon McLeod   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Actually attendance in Canada according to the stats can report is up

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Karen Hultgren
Master Film Handler

Posts: 492
From: Agoura Hills, CA, USA
Registered: Mar 2000


 - posted 03-19-2002 03:54 PM      Profile for Karen Hultgren   Author's Homepage   Email Karen Hultgren   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
You guys bave some really good ideas. Maybe someone from the studios is reading and, if they are, DTS is ready to support it.

Karen at DTS

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Tom Fermanian
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 101
From: Sainte Adele, Quebec, Canada
Registered: Dec 2001


 - posted 03-19-2002 04:09 PM      Profile for Tom Fermanian   Email Tom Fermanian   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hey in Quebec, we get DTS discs in english for English prints, french for french prints, actualy It's the same time code for all versions, did a test discs work fine with any print! Here is the snag , it is illegal to run an English soundtrack on a french print or vice-versa, the reason, local classification board (read hidden taxation departement) gets so much per foot of film "classified", they would lose out revenue on an extra print if you they would accept to use different language discs on prints!

------------------

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Greg Anderson
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 766
From: Ogden Valley, Utah
Registered: Nov 1999


 - posted 03-19-2002 04:27 PM      Profile for Greg Anderson   Author's Homepage   Email Greg Anderson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Well, nuts! I read an article just a few days ago about lower movie attendance but I can't remember where I saw it... so I'll have to stand corrected for now.

Meanwhile, for those of you who don't appreciate unnecessary profanity in the movies, you're never going to convince Hollywood to change its standards so long as people are paying money to watch movies which they still find offensive.

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Dave Bird
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 777
From: Perth, Ontario, Canada
Registered: Jun 2000


 - posted 03-19-2002 05:18 PM      Profile for Dave Bird   Author's Homepage   Email Dave Bird   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Well BINGO Barry! We could test your system at a Cine-Parc in Quebec! One frequency for french, one english. Or, can that be done?
Two sets of DTS discs running off ONE timecode? That would be a neat option for you Tom, those wishing to hear the movie en englais could tune in to a low-power FM with their walkmans!

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Steven Gorsky
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 146
From: Frederick, MD, USA
Registered: Sep 2000


 - posted 03-20-2002 01:14 AM      Profile for Steven Gorsky   Author's Homepage   Email Steven Gorsky   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I believe you can use two players with one reader using the 70mm "failsafe" board. Although in this case you need two sound processors.

Steven Gorsky

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Karen Hultgren
Master Film Handler

Posts: 492
From: Agoura Hills, CA, USA
Registered: Mar 2000


 - posted 03-21-2002 12:43 PM      Profile for Karen Hultgren   Author's Homepage   Email Karen Hultgren   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
In regards to what DTS offers in playing back films in multiple languages, we make feature discs in languages selected by the studios. It is very common for them to have us make French Canadian discs at almost the same time domestic (English) discs are made. Then, after a week or so, they may ask us to do other langages.

We do have 70mm failsafe boards to run DTS 70mm shows. The board connects two DTS players to one CP and reader. Multiple readers can be used but it's more common for the system to use one reader. Either way will work. Anyway, each DTS player has a priority. One is the main player and the other is the "backup." So, if the main player has a problem, the failsafe board will look at the fallback pulse from the main player and use that to switch in the "backup" player. Only one player feeds audio to the CP at a time.

To run two languages at the same time, you'd need two players and feed the center channel of tbe "alternate" langage to a transmitter picked up by patrons wearing headsets. We do this for special venue but it is not generally used at "regular" neighborhood cinemas.

The DTS-CSS system has this feature built in and if it's used with a DTS player, you have many possibilites - you'd have the versatility of running different presentations for each show time. You could play the film in French with English subtitles at noon and then run in Spanish with French translation on headsets for the 3pm show. It's a pretty cool system.

If you'd like more info on the DTS-CSS system, please visit our web site a www.dtsonline.com once there, click on 'cinema'.

Karen at DTS
khultgren@dtsonline.com


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