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» Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE   » Operations   » Film Handlers' Forum   » Lab splices for the inexperienced (Page 2)

 
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Author Topic: Lab splices for the inexperienced
Mark Maxwell
Film Handler

Posts: 55
From: Tyler, TX, USA
Registered: Jul 2002


 - posted 07-20-2002 11:48 PM      Profile for Mark Maxwell   Email Mark Maxwell   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Also, I wasn't trying to be sarcastic when I said I would't ask any more dumb questions, every reply I got was an obvious solution when I read it, I just didn't think about it at the time. Pluss I believe the anwers to most of my questions are already in these forums. You guys Know alot and I hope I Know I will gain from that. Hopefully my coworkers that i pass this along to will so I don't come on a shift and have to deal with mistakes that can obviously be avoided.

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Darryl Spicer
Film God

Posts: 3250
From: Lexington, KY, USA
Registered: Dec 2000


 - posted 07-21-2002 01:36 AM      Profile for Darryl Spicer     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
<<My print of Stuart Little II not only had two lab splices in reel one, but the color was all screwy just before the splice.>>


That is caused by the darkroom light being held to close to the raw print stock during the splicing phase.

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Kenneth Wuepper
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1026
From: Saginaw, MI, USA
Registered: Feb 2002


 - posted 07-21-2002 05:37 AM      Profile for Kenneth Wuepper   Email Kenneth Wuepper   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Mark,
The only "dumb" question is the one that is not asked.

I am happy to share any constructive knowledge that I can with anyone who wishes it.

I have retired from many occupations but, as my wife says, "You can get the boy out of the theatre but you'll never get the theatre out of the boy!"

KEN

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Peter Kerchinsky
Master Film Handler

Posts: 326
From: Seattle, WA, USA
Registered: Jan 2002


 - posted 07-21-2002 06:23 AM      Profile for Peter Kerchinsky   Email Peter Kerchinsky   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I was told once in this biz........there is no such thing as a dumb question.
Question on man, we are here to help.

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Jeffry L. Johnson
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 809
From: Cleveland, Ohio, USA
Registered: Apr 2000


 - posted 07-21-2002 09:48 AM      Profile for Jeffry L. Johnson   Author's Homepage   Email Jeffry L. Johnson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
If the color is all screwy then you should request a replacement reel.

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Brian Tristam Williams
Film Handler

Posts: 93
From: Johannesburg, South Africa
Registered: Apr 2002


 - posted 07-21-2002 12:58 PM      Profile for Brian Tristam Williams   Author's Homepage   Email Brian Tristam Williams   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Dumb questions are ok?

1. Why do they even need to splice the film? I understand the need to splice it in the theater, where you get damage, and have to lose a frame or 10. But these lab splices don't have any missing material. What was the need for the splice, then?

2. We wouldn't mind the splices so much if they weren't done in frame. Is there an actual reason why the splice has to be done at random points?

------------------
"One man can make a difference."

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Josh Jones
Redhat

Posts: 1207
From: Plano, TX
Registered: Apr 2000


 - posted 07-21-2002 01:05 PM      Profile for Josh Jones   Author's Homepage   Email Josh Jones   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The reason labs splices exist is because(as already stated) rolls of raw(or blank) stock come in predetermined lengths, usually 2000 or 6000 feet. Every reel printed at the lab is not 2000 feet in length, so to prevent waste, the laboratory uses the short pieces of stock to save cost.

The reason a lot of lab spices are out of frame is because the splices are made in raw, not processed stock. Because there are no framelines in blank stock, as well as the fact that the splice must be made in near darkness, it is impossible to hit the frameline 100% of the time.

Hope I helped answer a few questions

Josh

------------------
"Film is made of silver, video is made of rust"
'nuf said

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John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000


 - posted 07-22-2002 08:32 AM      Profile for John Pytlak   Author's Homepage   Email John Pytlak   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Nice summary Josh!

Most of the labs making release prints purchase the film as either 4000-foot or 6000-foot lengths. Few reels are exact increments of these lengths, so there is usually a "short end". Several release print labs now use printers that "loop" the picture and sound negatives, and use feed-on and take-off "elevators" to allow splicing on raw stock print film without stopping the printer. These ultrasonic "lab splices" are made in darkroom conditions, and may fall anywhere within a reel. Assuming 2000-foot reels printed onto 6000-foot raw stock rolls, on average, one reel out of three will have a lab splice. If you receive a reel with more than one lab splice, it may be that the "short ends" were spliced together off-line before being printed on a non-loop printer.

Here is what the Association of Cinema and Video Laboratories (ACVL) has to say about lab splices:
http://www.acvl.org/4c.htm

Discoloration around a raw stock splice is caused by excessive exposure to the "safelight" used to help the operator see the splicing operation. Safelight "fog" is usually cyan or blue in color. Request a replacement reel if there is excessive fogging (visible on screen or interferes with reading soundtracks).

------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7525A
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: +1 585 477 5325 Cell: +1 585 781 4036 Fax: +1 585 722 7243
e-mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Web site: http://www.kodak.com/go/motion

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Manuel Francisco Valencia
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 151
From: Oklahoma City, OK, USA
Registered: Dec 2000


 - posted 07-22-2002 04:22 PM      Profile for Manuel Francisco Valencia   Email Manuel Francisco Valencia   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Brian

Some lab splices are actually decent but some you look at and think to yourself "What the F#@*!" And on some rare occasions some of the frames leading up to that splice might have damage. If you are ever in a movie and notice one go through then compare that with the splice you could make and decide which one would be better. That is why some lab splices are cut out.

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Ken Lackner
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1907
From: Atlanta, GA, USA
Registered: Sep 2001


 - posted 07-22-2002 11:47 PM      Profile for Ken Lackner   Email Ken Lackner   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote:
The reason a lot of lab spices are out of frame is because the splices are made in raw, not processed stock. Because there are no framelines in blank stock, as well as the fact that the splice must be made in near darkness, it is impossible to hit the frameline 100% of the time.

How is the image printed with the splice already in the stock??

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Steve Kraus
Film God

Posts: 4094
From: Chicago, IL, USA
Registered: May 2000


 - posted 07-23-2002 12:00 AM      Profile for Steve Kraus     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
They just run it through the printer and processor as though the splice wasn't there.

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Brian Tristam Williams
Film Handler

Posts: 93
From: Johannesburg, South Africa
Registered: Apr 2002


 - posted 07-23-2002 05:49 AM      Profile for Brian Tristam Williams   Author's Homepage   Email Brian Tristam Williams   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Well, you said dumb questions were allowed!

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