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Topic: Start Cue for ORC Automation?

Scott Norwood
Film God

Posts: 8146
From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas)
Registered: Jun 99

posted 08-29-2002 02:32 PM

How much damage to the motor and gears is really caused by motoring the leader down to "7" (or whatever)? This is common practice in reel-to-reel booths and I've seen plenty of _old_ equipment that runs fine even though it has been used to motor the leader down several times per feature (once each reel) every night for many years.

I agree, though, that the concept of having a start cue is pretty obvious and I'm surprised that it isn't more widely used. The only automations that I've worked with are the Maxi-10 (and a couple of newer Kelmar models which are basically the same thing) and TA-10, neither of which (as far as I know) supports start cues. With the Maxi-10, the operator needs to manually press "start" as the 7-second mark runs through the gate; the Kelmar automations work similarly, except there's a button for "interlock cue" or something like that that one uses instead of "start." The TA-10 uses a start cue for interlock, but I'm not exactly sure how it works, having never run an interlock show with the TA-10.

On the automations which use start cues, is there a way to bypass this function and use the regular 7-second delay? When running once-only shows on platters, I usually just add a light cue at the start of the credits and an end-of-show cue at the tail and then start the show manually. Obviously this precludes the use of timers for show start, but it saves time during print inspection/makeup.

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Ken McFall
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 615
From: Haringey, London.
Registered: Apr 2001

posted 08-29-2002 02:56 PM

Must admit I have no problems with running down to a START point clearly marked on a leader. I lace up without film touching the floor and I'd expect my staff to do the same.
As for wear on the mech, many newer projectors use inverters so smooth slow starts are built in by design.
The TA10 can easily be set to use a 'start' cue. I use it often. We have a 1 min break between our adverts & trailers as we have manual lens changes. This also allows easy removal of adverts & trilers on a thursday evening. We break the show at a clearly marked break point on the 1 min leader. Then we run the feature onto a large take up ring. When we restart the show all we do is press the interlock button on the TA10, blue led lights up and press start. The projector motor starts and the TA10 'Find's' the start cue and puts the show back on. This saves the stop start running down of the leader.

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Jon Bartow
Master Film Handler

Posts: 287
From: Massachusetts
Registered: Nov 1999

posted 08-29-2002 08:28 PM

Joe, another thought... Assuming that you just have an inboard and outboard cue and no cross cue...
It should be possible to create a circuit so that the outboard cue serves dual purpose.
press the start button - motor/xenon on
outboard cue - starts PO timer (with seven second delay)
PO timer (timer #2 I think) will trigger PO relay, connect one side of a DP latching relay parallel with the PO relay so when it switches it reconnects the outboard cue to the normal circuit path
inboard cue -lights down/up or however you have it
outboard cue - starts PF timer (timer #4 I think) also a seven second delay (although it is adjustable for longer). When the timer ends it triggers the PF relay. Connect the other side of the DP latching relay in parallel with the PF relay. this would switch the outboard cue for show start function again.
*one note you probably would want to make sure that the "Stop" button would reset the latching relay for show start operation and you might also want a SPDT momentary toggle switch to manually control the latching relay.
I may not be making any sense but you should be able to do it...
Jonathan bartow

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Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

Posts: 12859
From: Denver, Colorado
Registered: May 99

posted 08-30-2002 11:32 PM

Just for the record I checked today and the automation is the 101, not the much-coveted 301.

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Oscar Neundorfer
Master Film Handler

Posts: 275
From: Senoia, GA
Registered: May 2000

posted 08-31-2002 11:59 AM

When I designed the SMART automation, I used a start cue configuration. I could never really understand why that was not a standard way to do things anyway. Of course, I have basically zero booth experience to go on, but it sure made logical sense to me.

(Don't you guys just LOVE someone with no booth experience designing equipment for the booth? Many thanks to ALL who have kept me from making many more mistakes than I have.)

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Jon Bartow
Master Film Handler

Posts: 287
From: Massachusetts
Registered: Nov 1999

posted 08-31-2002 03:07 PM

Joe, even though I have never worked on a VA-101 I believe that the 101 and 301 are very similar. The manual in the archives has a schematic but it is almost impossible to read. If you have a copy of the manual it should have the print in it. Have fun! I'm sure it can be done at a minimal (or no) cost.
Jonathan Bartow

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Richard Fowler
Film God

Posts: 2392
From: Ft. Lauderdale, FL, USA
Registered: Jun 2001

posted 08-31-2002 05:06 PM

Joe,
you just don't have the proper tool for the start function....a 5 pound ( 2.27Kg ) sledge hammer applied liberally.....

Richard Fowler
TVP-Theatre & Video Products Inc. www.tvpmiami.com

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Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

Posts: 12859
From: Denver, Colorado
Registered: May 99

posted 08-31-2002 05:20 PM

Well if these automations keep acting the way that they do, I think that'll be the only tool that can fix them!

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Richard Fowler
Film God

Posts: 2392
From: Ft. Lauderdale, FL, USA
Registered: Jun 2001

posted 08-31-2002 05:37 PM

I have 8 used Kelmar automation systems in our warehouse...at least you can get parts and factory support.
Richard Fowler
TVP-Theatre & Video Products Inc. www.tvpmiami.com

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