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Topic: framing: which way is up?

Edward Jurich
Master Film Handler

Posts: 305
From: Las Vegas USA
Registered: Jul 2003

posted 11-06-2003 08:12 PM

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And SPLICE in frame, of course. Film Done Right
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Sometimes you get surprised when someone else spliced the print one sprocket hole off, and threads with the frame knob off center, then asks you to watch out for the bad spot where the paper towel is sticking out of the middle of the platter. [Big Grin]

Actually, the person in question is a perfectionist and miss-spliced on a fade-out. I always kept a strip of leader on the side of the rack to check those fade out splices. [Wink]

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Carl Martin
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1424
From: Oakland, CA, USA
Registered: Feb 2002

posted 11-07-2003 05:19 AM

my reason for asking was that we do need to re-frame for lens changes. it's inevitable since we have movable top masking (and side masking) but not movable bottom masking, so the different apertures are offset from each other. when a flat and scope print alternate on that screen, it must be reframed every show. i made a reminder note saying frame up for flat, frame down for scope, and just didn't want to go against convention.

i use the same trick as steve et al. the image moves the same direction as the far side of the framing knob on our centurys.

carl

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Stephen Furley
Film God

Posts: 3059
From: Coulsdon, Croydon, England
Registered: May 2002

posted 11-07-2003 06:18 AM

quote:

Daryl, I think they should lose the teeth and use pinch rollers. (Ummm Adam, that was a joke too...)

Some telecine systems use sprocketless drives, they have just a single sprocket driven by the film for control purposes, and there are sprocketless 8mm projectors, but the less said about them the better.

quote:

my reason for asking was that we do need to re-frame for lens changes. it's inevitable since we have movable top masking (and side masking) but not movable bottom masking, so the different apertures are offset from each other. when a flat and scope print alternate on that screen, it must be reframed every show.

I got caught out by that one the first time I ran A local cinema; I'd never used movable top masking, set up flat adverts and trailers on No. 2 machine, first half of scope feature on No. 1, closed the tabs at the end of the trailers, reset the masking, had to guess how long to press the button for as there were no presets, started No.1, opened the tabs for the feature, the masking was spot on. I was feeling pretty pleased with the way things were going, I'd never seen the place before, and there was no time for a practice run before the show; I don't like doing that, but I've had to do it in several places now. At the changeover to No. 2 to my horror the picture was badly out of frame. Of course, as there was movable top masking, but fixed bottom, the plates were cut with a common top edge to the aperture, therefore the centre line was different, and the framing had to be reset for scope. To make matters worse, in my panic, I then turned the knob the wrong way. Hopefully I won't make that mistake again.

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Edward Jurich
Master Film Handler

Posts: 305
From: Las Vegas USA
Registered: Jul 2003

posted 11-07-2003 09:41 AM

Could you put reference marks on the framing knob for the different framing positions, it would at least get you in the ballpark to start.

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Carl Martin
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1424
From: Oakland, CA, USA
Registered: Feb 2002

posted 11-07-2003 03:49 PM

i know the direction to turn the knob and i've done it enough to know about how far for a ballpark setting. due to the awkward position of the knob i don't think marks would be helpful, or accurate. when the program starts i fine-tune the framing using the company logo and other cues. i do use rp40 sometimes but i still need to shine plain light on the screen to get the masking perfect, and i like to keep the lamp starts to a minimum.

carl

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Brad Miller
Administrator

Posts: 17775
From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall)
Registered: May 99

posted 11-07-2003 05:06 PM

quote:
my reason for asking was that we do need to re-frame for lens changes. it's inevitable since we have movable top masking (and side masking) but not movable bottom masking, so the different apertures are offset from each other. when a flat and scope print alternate on that screen, it must be reframed every show.

Carl, fire your technician who set that up. He is an idiot. If you have turrets then there is simply no excuse for not pre-aligning them before he cut the aperture plates. If you have single lens holders, he could shim the lenses or use an eccentric mount to get things right during the setup. Just because it is a top masking is no excuse for you to ever have to touch the framing knob.

and yeah...lock those puppies down! [Big Grin]

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Daryl C. W. O'Shea
Film God

Posts: 3977
From: Midland Ontario Canada (where Panavision & IMAX lenses come from)
Registered: Jun 2002

posted 11-08-2003 12:25 AM

Hell if it's a single mount that you can't get shimmed right, use a pedestal with an easily (vertically) adjustable table. There's absolutely no reason to be projecting off of the optical axis.

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Josh Jones
Redhat

Posts: 1207
From: Plano, TX
Registered: Apr 2000

posted 11-08-2003 01:28 AM

May I also mention that a lot of the XL's and many other machines out there have an index mark on the inermittant arm that when framing is centered, lines up with a scribed line on the projector casting. You can use this as a reference.

Josh

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Carl Martin
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1424
From: Oakland, CA, USA
Registered: Feb 2002

posted 11-08-2003 03:38 AM

quote:
Hell if it's a single mount that you can't get shimmed right, use a pedestal with an easily (vertically) adjustable table. There's absolutely no reason to be projecting off of the optical axis.

we do have this, and we do use it to fine-tune the bottom edge of the image. i haven't tested the limits of its adjustability, but i don't see why making a framing adjustment is worse than making a pedestal adjustment. they both look bad if not done right. well, i suppose it's easier to do the pedestal adjustment because you don't need a loop to get it "perfect".

and no, i can't fire the tech. he can fire me, sort of. i have no authority. but what we're working with is old equipment cobbled together under somewhat adverse conditions. money is tight. right now i'm having trouble getting more filmguard ordered. i'm not going to blame the tech.

carl

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