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Author Topic: How long should cue tape be? Paul G. Thompson The Weenie Man Posts: 4718 From: Mount Vernon WA USA Registered: Nov 2000 posted 03-07-2004 05:19 PM                     Several factors enter in that were not discussd. If it were the old mechanical pick-off roller type of detector, sometimes up to 4 inches were needed for the automation to "see" it. And that also depended on how well the grounding roller worked, and what the voltage was that the automation provided. In addition to that, whether the automation provided AC or DC voltage made a difference. The Xetron Maxi-*DC were absolutely terrible. The standard Maxi-* was not too bad, but it left alot to be desired. They had a 90% hit when the cue came waltzing by. If course, another thing that really entered the picture was how good of shape the cue was still in, and how good of quality the cue tape was. Proximity detectors are the way to go. The old mechanical cue detectors belong in the trash masher...they were good in their day, but their day is long gone.  |  IP: Logged Chris Hipp Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1462 From: Mesquite, Tx (east of Dallas) Registered: Jul 2003 posted 03-07-2004 05:47 PM                     Brad's method is better, but you can only do it that way if you know you have to change it. I usually find out from the alarm going off and I know I wont remember while it runs the next round.  |  IP: Logged Steve Kraus Film God Posts: 4094 From: Chicago, IL, USA Registered: May 2000 posted 03-07-2004 07:19 PM                    Why is there a need to be changing the cue in the first place?  |  IP: Logged Paul G. Thompson The Weenie Man Posts: 4718 From: Mount Vernon WA USA Registered: Nov 2000 posted 03-07-2004 07:38 PM                     Steve, some cues go to crap with the mechanical pick-off rollers because of oil and stuff, in addition to some of the el cheapo cue tapes fracturing. That does not happen with the prox detectors. Unfortunately because of the automation types of the older style, the cues may not be compatible to other automations.  |  IP: Logged Brad Miller Administrator Posts: 17775 From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall) Registered: May 99 posted 03-07-2004 08:01 PM                     Mark's comment... quote: If Kelmar would just get rid of the film break drop arms they'd really have something! Mark, I guess you've had different experiences than I have, but in my opinion NOTHING beats the Kelmar proxy cue detectors. The microswitch "film break" works and works well. Also those proxy detectors will pick up the tiniest piece of cue tape...literally the size of a dot like a Sharpie marker would make if you tapped it on a piece of paper! The FM35 is a damn good product, but there is just too much to go wrong and the thing must be kept squeaky clean whereas the Kelmar will just work even if neglected. It's simple design is the key. On the subject of cues, I find Neumade's "Aucuta II" on sheets to be the best cue tape anywhere. It's size is perfect to lay over the edge and sprockets (without "wrap-around") and I have never seen one come off. The cues also never miss. A very close second is a product from Jack Roe. It is 1000 cues on a roll. My only complaint of them is that they are just a tiny bit too wide and if you have a full width setup (out to the 825 line on PA35) you will see the edge of the cue flash on the extreme right edge. Also they are thick and can cause the focus to blip or shift the image on some projectors. On the positive side though, you will never find an easier set of cues, all perfectly precut in length and no "picking" at the sheet trying to get one off. Like the Neumade cues, they never miss either. However ALL other cue tape on the market is crap.  |  IP: Logged Steve Kraus Film God Posts: 4094 From: Chicago, IL, USA Registered: May 2000 posted 03-07-2004 08:05 PM                    Unfortunately because of the automation types of the older style, the cues may not be compatible to other automations. I hope you mean when a print gets moved because if you mean cue foil left by another theatre for shame! Film Done Wrong to leave crap on the print.  |  IP: Logged Daryl C. W. O'Shea Film God Posts: 3977 From: Midland Ontario Canada (where Panavision & IMAX lenses come from) Registered: Jun 2002 posted 03-07-2004 08:18 PM                        Totally overlooking the possibility that you know you have to change your cue tape ahead of time I didn't mention the method Brad did. Anyway, I prefer to use sponges instead. It virtually eliminates the chance of scratching the film. Just place two sponges on the takeup platter one on each side of the roll (across from each other) and that's it. When the show is done, pull the sponges out and fix your cue / splice / whatever.  |  IP: Logged John Pytlak Film God Posts: 9987 From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922 Registered: Jan 2000 posted 03-08-2004 09:47 AM                        Brad's method of placing cores (or better yet, the non-abrasive sponge rubber suggested by Darryl) into the take-up roll at the point you want to make a change was first discussed in the Kodak publication "Film Notes for Reel People", July 1980, H-50-11, figure 12: http://www.film-tech.com/manuals/H5011.pdf  |  IP: Logged Thomas Procyk Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1842 From: Royal Palm Beach, FL, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 03-08-2004 12:21 PM                     Wait... SPOOL THE CREDITS ONTO THE FLOOR to change a cue?!?! Goddam, that's dumb. I had a manager at one of the crappier theaters I worked at tell me to do this and I flipped out like a ninja. A few weeks later, I actually saw an employee standing knee-deep in a pile of film changing a cue when I came in for a shift. The mess was so tangled that they ran the next show without credits. DUMB! DUMB! DUMB! This is just as bad as those idiots who grab one end of a trailer and THROW the roll across the booth to "rewind it quicker." And Richard, you shouldn't be afraid to tell her in a loud, clear voice, how this DUMB IDEA of changing cues is damaging film. If she says anything to the effect of, "But it's just the credits." Then I give you permission to smack her. Yes, even if she's a woman. Don't know the brand of our cue detectors off hand, but they use the little "dot" of cue tape that looks like a changeover cue. One for lights, two for shutdown on the right side of the frame. Never had a mis-cue, and they come off surprisingly easy. You DO see them "blip" into the frame on Scope movies, though. Hard to notice in the credits and everyone's gone by the time the shutdown one goes thorugh. =TMP=  |  IP: Logged Scott Norwood Film God Posts: 8146 From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas) Registered: Jun 99 posted 03-08-2004 12:37 PM                        Sounds like the Kelmar failsafe/cue detector (might also be sold under the "Xetron" name?). Presumably you have the "punch" thing that applies the cues. I liked the concept, and the "punch" tool made the cues super-easy to apply, but the visible cues were annoying. Also, at least with the setup I used, the soundtrack edge of the film had to face the outer edge of the "punch" tool, as the cues covered only the image area, not the soundtrack. It took me a while (and lots of non-working cues) to figure this out.  |  IP: Logged Matthew Bailey Master Film Handler Posts: 461 From: Port Arthur,TX Registered: Sep 2000 posted 03-08-2004 02:42 PM                     aren't you supposed to unspool the reel into a box using a new clean garbage bag simiar to using the wastebasket with a clean bag method when threading leaders as described in one of the Kodak books?  |  IP: Logged Carl Martin Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1424 From: Oakland, CA, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 03-08-2004 03:11 PM                        the thing about all these "sounds easy" ideas where the film ends up in a disorderly pile is that, in addition to causing scratches and dirt, they take so much longer than doing it the right way. sure, it's a (minor) hassle to hook up a mut, but the thing is designed to rapidly and neatly move film on and off the platter, which is what you're trying to do. carl  |  IP: Logged John Pytlak Film God Posts: 9987 From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922 Registered: Jan 2000 posted 03-08-2004 03:46 PM                        The rules of good film handling: 1. Don't let the film get dirty. 2. If the film gets dirty, clean it properly. 3. Don't let the film get scratched. 4. Don't let the film break. Simple.  |  IP: Logged Jack Ondracek Film God Posts: 2348 From: Port Orchard, WA, USA Registered: Oct 2002 posted 03-08-2004 07:05 PM                        quote: 4. Don't let the film break. Must be after the film pulls some gears out of the projector, then tips the platter over! On cue detectors: After cleaning the FM35 detectors that were left at the theatre wae reopened, we've had 100% excellent performance from them. I use about 2 sprockets worth of tape, applied with tweezers, then enough splicing tape to cover the sprockets over the tape. That has prvented any eventual miscues as the application ages. I've had zero trouble with this method.  |  IP: Logged Richard Greco Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1180 From: Plant City, FL Registered: Nov 2003 posted 03-09-2004 07:34 AM                     Appreciate the help guys  |  IP: Logged

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