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Author Topic: moving aperture plate Phil Blake Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 558 From: esperance western australia Registered: Nov 2003 posted 07-31-2004 08:11 AM                        I have discovered with our Vic 5's the aperture plates when they warm up buckle slightly which causes them to jam amd not change ratio. I think I have fixed this by 1. removing the spring from the V pin and 2. I placed a very small piece of shim brass behing the aperture mounting blocks , this giving the slide move clearance when hot. so far......... no failed changes !  |  IP: Logged Thomas Jonsson Expert Film Handler Posts: 216 From: Bromolla, Sweden Registered: Sep 2003 posted 08-06-2004 01:04 PM                       I´ve just discovered another reason the aperture plate won´t move, or get stuck with the wrong format - or even half-way between formats. To the right of the toothed roller on the shutter gear box is a roller to keep the belt from "jumping off". This one is VERY close to the arm that makes the aperture plate slide. Take a look if it is actually touching the arm, and prevents it from moving. It did in one of my machines. Extreme precision or a construction mistake? Thomas  |  IP: Logged Antonio Marcheselli Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1260 From: Florence, Italy Registered: Mar 2000 posted 08-06-2004 08:11 PM                        Thomas I was aware of that roller. "Extreme precision"? Uhm... I believe it's not a term that can be applied to Cinemeccanicas! Phil I'm sure that without the spring the mechanism won't fail. But what about its precision? It is not "extremely precise" right now ith the springs... Bye A  |  IP: Logged Thomas Jonsson Expert Film Handler Posts: 216 From: Bromolla, Sweden Registered: Sep 2003 posted 08-07-2004 03:48 PM                       Well, Antonio There was a line in "Our man Flint" starring James Coburn. Sitting in his private jet plane, Coburn´s pilote says: -Oh, I see you´ve emptied the ash-tray? and Coburn replies: - No, I bought a new airplane instead. Perhaps that´s what we should do. Stop fiddling with the aperture plate and buy a new machine? Thomas  |  IP: Logged Antonio Marcheselli Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1260 From: Florence, Italy Registered: Mar 2000 posted 08-07-2004 07:53 PM                        No, of course. But Cinemeccanica sells Victoria 5 all around the world. Seems strange to me that are so few that are asking for aperture plates... I'm still search a definitive solution! Bye A  |  IP: Logged Gordon McLeod Film God Posts: 9532 From: Toronto Ontario Canada Registered: Jun 99 posted 08-08-2004 09:37 AM                     Cinemecanica projectors are a workhorse machine the are installed all around the world and they day in day out run with few and infrequent problems  |  IP: Logged Michael Schaffer "Where is the Boardwalk Hotel?" Posts: 4143 From: Boston, MA Registered: Apr 2002 posted 08-08-2004 12:33 PM                        That reminds me, I read somewhere the best way to clean an oven is to move to a new appartment every year.  |  IP: Logged Ken McFall Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 615 From: Haringey, London. Registered: Apr 2001 posted 08-08-2004 04:59 PM                     I agree with Gordon..... they are a very reliable machine that work fine.... the design is simple and reliable. The locating spring is required for the plate to locate correctly and should be left in place. You can check a couple of other things.... Has the profile of the app plate been distored in some way so that it is slightly fatter than it should be. Try laying the plate on a flat surface and using a smooth file check there are no high spots.... The other thing to check is the running plate itself. If you have the edge pushers rather than the top rollers.... check that the spring cover on the back has not been distorted and is catching the plate as it tries to move. If you have an older plate without the edge pushers try using that. I've had both of these problems in the past. You should also check the the stop adjustments on the actuating arm are correctly set so that the plate stops in the correct position. That way the locating spring does not have to try and pull the plate into its correct position. It is after all only intended to hold the plate in position, nothing else.  |  IP: Logged Antonio Marcheselli Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1260 From: Florence, Italy Registered: Mar 2000 posted 08-08-2004 08:14 PM                        Ken, Gordon, I agree with both of you, I've nothing to say on Cinemeccanicas. I worked with 48 different Cinemeccanicas (V5 and V8) and I can say that I would found just a bit more precision in their mechanism. The aperture plate is one of them. Since no oil can be put for the high temperature reached, the mechanism has to be improved, IMHO. Ken, I understand both of your suggestions. But as Thomas said the problem is in the spring that, Ken is right, has just the job to lock the plate in the correct position but NOT to foce it. First the micro behind has to be adjusted perfectly. However, the pin has sometimes some difficults moving out of the "V" shaped hole. Bye A  |  IP: Logged Thomas Jonsson Expert Film Handler Posts: 216 From: Bromolla, Sweden Registered: Sep 2003 posted 08-09-2004 08:45 AM                       My James Coburn-post was just a joke. Don´t take it seriously - but it COULD solve Antonio´s problem. I´ve worked with Victoria 5´s for many years. They work OK most of the time and it´s easy to fix most problems yourself. I´ll give them that. But as Antonio said himself, the precision could be a little better here and there. Even though I can´t really complain about the picture- and sound quality from my two machines, I can´t rid myself from the feeling of a "toy-machine". A simple thing like making an aperture plate move into 3 positions, shouldn´t be a problem. If it doesn´t work as it should, then the construction isn´t very good. Cinemeccanica should rush out to help Antonio with his problems, and then buy him a large dinner. By the way, Antonio, as you work with both V5 and V8, do you think the image quality (focus and steadiness) are better with the V5 with curved gate than the V8? Or is the V8 still the better of them? Thomas  |  IP: Logged Antonio Marcheselli Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1260 From: Florence, Italy Registered: Mar 2000 posted 08-09-2004 01:53 PM                        Thomas I'm not sure to have fully understood you post about the joke... About V8-V5, I work everyday with V5 projs but I worked just few months with just one V8 installed in a particular screen in Italy. I didn't notice big differences in image quality. The main thing I noted is that the V8 gate is much more gentle with prints. About the plates: the mechanism works but, IMHO, could work better!! It is too much susceptible to dirty and other factor. Bye A  |  IP: Logged Thomas Jonsson Expert Film Handler Posts: 216 From: Bromolla, Sweden Registered: Sep 2003 posted 08-09-2004 03:20 PM                       Antonio, The point of James Coburns line was, he didn´t bother to empty the ash-tray - he bought a new air plane. "Translated" to your problem, don´t bother to fix the aperture plate - get a new projector. And please notice I didn´t say a new brand of machine, just a new machine. Mr Gordon McLeod said "Cinemeccanica projectors are a work horse machine that are installed all around the world and run day in and day out with few and infrequent problems". Meaning, I guess, they are very good machines. When browsing some older posts I happened to find "Cinemeccanica"(05-28-2000), mr McLeod saying "The Vic 5 is a piece of crap". No offense, Mr McLeod, but those are two very different statements. What made you change your mind? Thomas  |  IP: Logged Antonio Marcheselli Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1260 From: Florence, Italy Registered: Mar 2000 posted 08-09-2004 04:56 PM                        Thomas Ok, very clear, I just did not remember correcly your previous post, I should had read it again before reply! I have the same opinion on Cinemeccanicas since many year. As you said, a "big toy", a very well made big toy I have to say. In my 6 year of experience (not so much!) I worked with the changeover Auto-Rewind system 2 x V5 with "Vector 2000" automation, with "Vector 1000" multiplex automation, V5 and V8, many releases. I have projector failure only twice, once for a lightning fallen on my theater!! But I personally do not judge a projector for how many times fail in a year. Cinemeccanicas needs many and many simple improvements. Without these improvements you have to make a continuous manteinance on the parts that are poorly designed. If you fail to make this kind of mainteinance the projector will continue to make the shows, but the quality of the presentation fall in the hell. This is my personal opinion! Bye A  |  IP: Logged Thomas Jonsson Expert Film Handler Posts: 216 From: Bromolla, Sweden Registered: Sep 2003 posted 08-10-2004 04:34 AM                       Hi Antonio, As I see it, maintaining the projector daily to make it run properly, is my businness. But using all the tricks in the book to make it run because of poor construction should not be my businness. Would you accept that if you buy a new car? I don´t think so. For example, the manual douser in the lamphouse bends so much from the heat, it gets stuck with the heat filter. That´s crap. The douser in the machine now and then bends from the heat and gets stuck. Even when it works "all right" I have to have a bolt taped to the douser lever to make it fall down. That´s crap. And the trouble with your aperture plate is crap. I recently changed the shutter gear box and it sounds like it hasn´t seen oil for years. "It sounds like that" I was told. That´s crap. But besides all that, it´s a reasonably good machine. There simply is no perfect machine out there. They could be made a lot better, but I guess no one would be willing to pay the price? Thomas  |  IP: Logged Gordon McLeod Film God Posts: 9532 From: Toronto Ontario Canada Registered: Jun 99 posted 08-10-2004 11:23 AM                     "Hi Antonio, For example, the manual douser in the lamphouse bends so much from the heat, it gets stuck with the heat filter. That´s crap. "' funny that is a problem on many lamphouses out there and some manufacturers don't include one standard anyway "The douser in the machine now and then bends from the heat and gets stuck." That happens on lots of machines includeing the kinoton range "Even when it works "all right" I have to have a bolt taped to the douser lever to make it fall down. That´s crap." Again that is not an unique problem to cineemcanica "And the trouble with your aperture plate is crap." I have had that problem with jamming plates on many simplexs and Kelmar conversions " I recently changed the shutter gear box and it sounds like it hasn´t seen oil for years. "It sounds like that" I was told. That´s crap." The newer steel geared gear box is noisier than the old ones "But besides all that, it´s a reasonably good machine. There simply is no perfect machine out there. They could be made a lot better, but I guess no one would be willing to pay the price? Thomas " It also has a good track record as well  |  IP: Logged

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