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Author Topic: What happened to my tail leader? Aaron Garman Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1470 From: Toledo, OH USA Registered: Mar 2003 posted 06-30-2004 03:38 AM                     I'm one of those that build on to 60s and then to the platter, so I like tails out. However, mixing and matching stinks because then you just have to think: what's the quickest way to do this. If it's all heads, easy job. If it's all tails, an even easier job. An update on my original post: my replacement reel came in tonight so our final print is ready to go for tomorrow. AJG  |  IP: Logged John A. Parker Jr. Film Handler Posts: 21 From: Brevard, N.C., USA Registered: May 2003 posted 06-30-2004 08:36 AM                     Well here's what I got. Reels 1,2,3,4 and 7 were tails out. Every body else was heads up. At times like these, sure love a horizonital mut (super platter). Now in mid reel 7, diagonal scratches and they are printed on the film. Calling Dr. John! I figure the master was damaged during a previous pass and the ptr's on the printer cleaned most of the debris up because they were nice and clean.  |  IP: Logged Brad Miller Administrator Posts: 17775 From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall) Registered: May 99 posted 06-30-2004 03:03 PM                     I see two realistic options. 1. the print was used and the last guy made those scratches. 2. you scratched that reel. To my understanding, there is no place that the lab can make diagonal scratches on their machines.  |  IP: Logged Scott Norwood Film God Posts: 8146 From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas) Registered: Jun 99 posted 06-30-2004 03:41 PM                        jhawk--you rewind the reels before inspecting them? Doesn't that risk a) a bad mid-reel splice that falls apart and causes film to dump on the floor (or inside the Goldberg machine), b) a tail leader that is taped to the reel hub, or c) other film damage? I don't really know, as I've never used this method, but I've never had any trouble inspecting the film in whatever orientation it arrived and then rewinding it if necessary. Brad--how many theatres actually have platter reels? I don't know of any. I bet that changeover houses (including commercial theatres, screening rooms, special venues, etc.) far outnumber platter houses with platter reels. I love the concept, but no theatre that I know is about to spend several hundred dollars on one. And what is this about two rewind benches? I've seen that in large (10+ screens) multiplexes, but they are usually located in different parts of the booth, not all together.  |  IP: Logged Brad Miller Administrator Posts: 17775 From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall) Registered: May 99 posted 06-30-2004 03:44 PM                     I have been seeing platter reels become more and more common lately. People are wising up! Also, I tend to notice that the better multiplexes are putting at least 2 tables together as a central buildup station, rather than spreading them around the complex. It just makes more sense. That way all the leaders, snipes, trailers, splicing tape, etc are all in one central location.  |  IP: Logged John Hawkinson Film God Posts: 2273 From: Cambridge, MA, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 06-30-2004 08:39 PM                     Scott: Generally it's not a problem. a) Inside the Goldberg it just stops. No big deal. (Remember that accelleration is almost nil once the reel has started going, so there's very little force. It has to be an almost nonexistant splice to be a problem.) b) Generally taped to the reel hub the tape just peels off. Just as if you're running on a projector and taped to the reel hub. I suppose it might put some excess tension on the last foot of leader, but "that's what it's there for." c) The only possibility I can think of is what Brad asked about -- misaligned masking tape splices that cause the post-splice film stock to get squeezed against the flange. But this is not a problem. So what's the rationale? Well, basically, if things are in a hurry during inspection (posit an inspection immediately before a pre-screening), the rewind step is a fixed delay (approximately -- if really in a hurry one can rewind on the rewind bench faster than the Goldberg can). It's convenient to put the fixed delay first, because you never know how long manual inspection of the reel is going to take. Sometimes it's a breeze. But if it drags out and takes longer and longer, it's great to be able to pull it off the rewinder and thread it up just in time, rather than having to wait to rewind it. Now I'm curious what Steve does, though. If you guys are so curious, why not ask Goldberg how many platter reels they've sold. I bet they'd share a ballpark figure (100, 1000, 10,000, etc.). --jhawk  |  IP: Logged Dave Macaulay Film God Posts: 2321 From: Toronto, Canada Registered: Apr 2001 posted 06-30-2004 09:06 PM                     I just screened "the clearing" with changeovers last week, and I found a tail leader and some picture attached before the head leader - somewhat confusing as I was rewinding the reels from head-up-on-core to head-up-on-housereel. This was a new print with no splices or cuts, I would say definitely a miscut from the printer.  |  IP: Logged John A. Parker Jr. Film Handler Posts: 21 From: Brevard, N.C., USA Registered: May 2003 posted 07-02-2004 10:10 AM                     Beep, wrong answer. Sorry Brad. Scratches are there, but no physical damage to my print. Have been trying to get to another theatre to check out their reel 7. Will try to get a digital camera to photograph. John A. Parker Jr.  |  IP: Logged Steve Kraus Film God Posts: 4094 From: Chicago, IL, USA Registered: May 2000 posted 07-02-2004 12:04 PM                    I check the head for a splice. If there is one I check it and very often remake it. Like often it's a single side and needs to be backspliced but there is a remnant of the old platter splice sticking out I'll peel the whole mess and remake. Multiple cuts get removed as does anything with opaque tape. Anything where framing is not visible across the splice has to be checked with the framing checker. Also, I don't want any adhesive stickiness exposed to the gate runners. Edgemarking tape or whatever it's called gets pulled off. That's almost always an indication that Classic Cinemas Elk Grove handled it for a trade screening. (It shifts the picture, throws it out of focus and obliterates SDDS for people who use it. Film done wrong!) Wind to tail. Check splice if any. If it needs to be made/remade I'll single side it unless backsplicing is indicated to cover old adhesive. Check the dots. Scribe with Sign-O-Marker if visibility is in doubt or if they need to be made in the first place. Back to heads on a house reel. I take up on directly on shippers and despite their bad condition I think I've only had one fall apart on the projector once or twice in many thousands of reels and it still didn't disrupt the show. Last reel I'll check the end for last item although sometimes if I'm busy or lazy I may wing it. There's more of course but that's the basics.  |  IP: Logged Brad Miller Administrator Posts: 17775 From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall) Registered: May 99 posted 07-02-2004 02:57 PM                     Well John if I'm wrong then fine, but I just can't imagine where a diagonal scratch at the lab would come from other than *maybe* a film jumped off of a roller, but unlikely. They run scratch tests every X number of feet and that would've showed up, which would've sent them looking at the last X number of reels so they could be tossed. I emailed John Pytlak. Maybe he can shed more light on this one.  |  IP: Logged John Pytlak Film God Posts: 9987 From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922 Registered: Jan 2000 posted 07-02-2004 03:06 PM                        (I'm home on vacation today) A scratch on the printing negative would normally show as white on the print. Labs normally handle film in a conventional roll-to-roll fashion, or in a helical loop over many rollers, so a diagonal "platter scratch" would be unlikely. The only possibilities for a diagonal or horizontal scratch would be film riding up on the flange of a roller, or an operator flattening a dished/coned roll.  |  IP: Logged Scott Norwood Film God Posts: 8146 From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas) Registered: Jun 99 posted 07-07-2004 07:14 PM                        Steve (et al.)--have you noticed whether or not leaving opaque head and/or tail splices causes the SRD track to drop out? Normally, I'd advocate removing the white or yellow crap, of course, but when I have ~30 minutes to get the print to the booth and inspect the first couple of reels' worth of film before going on screen, I don't mind leaving the leaders attached with the opaque tape as long as the splice itself is well made, since those frames will never be projected. I haven't run that many shows in a changeover booth with SRD, however, and will definitely start re-making those splices if they cause the track to dropout (this is with cat. 702 penthouse readers, in case it makes a difference).  |  IP: Logged Brad Miller Administrator Posts: 17775 From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall) Registered: May 99 posted 07-07-2004 08:44 PM                     quote: Scott Norwood I don't mind leaving the leaders attached with the opaque tape as long as the splice itself is well made, since those frames will never be projected. Oh the shame! Want a sloppy joe to go with the sloppy changeovers? Don't worry about the tails, just the heads.  |  IP: Logged Christopher Seo Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 530 From: Los Angeles, CA Registered: Jun 99 posted 07-07-2004 09:47 PM                     One thing I've noticed running WinDRAS is that reel change splices, even made with clear tape (and yes, even Neumade tape) increase the Block Errors count by usually 3-4 each time. It seems like opaque tape wouldn't be much more of a problem in that regard. But I guess even one more block error could be too much. Or am I misinterpreting the WinDRAS information?  |  IP: Logged System Notices Forum Watchdog / Soup Nazi Posts: 215 Registered: Apr 2004 posted 04-12-2007 02:21 PM                 It has been 1008 days since the last post.  |  IP: Logged

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