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Author Topic: Too many scratched prints Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 09-25-2004 02:29 PM                     Actually as much as I like the JJ I've pretty much comcluded that American built projectors really suck big time. After spending as much time as I have with the DP-70 and now workling with the FP-56 Phillips I have definately been spoiled. The build quality and overall design of U.S. equipment has never been anywhere near what the Europenns have done in the past or are doing today. As for the JJ eating flim, it just isn't so.... yours has to have some sort of problem going on to be literally eating film. A smart operator would call his tech in to check it out!! For todays first run market one should really remove the dual sprockets anyway and replace them with 35mm only VKF's. Not only is it better for the film but it also generates far less dust having the tiny CS teeth picking away at the edge of the perfs. The sprockets will also last longer and give you a steadier picture as a bonus. In the real world,expereince has taught me with quite a few JJ locations(some that were manned by union operators)that beaause of the lack of room in the head it is very easy on the JJ and Simplex 35/65 to cross thread 35mm on any of the projector head sprockets. The dual pad roller assemblys also leave ALOT to be desired but have to be put up with. In cases such as the JJ and Simplex 35/65, removing the dual gauge sprockets out to 35mm only solved all the problems. Aside from a screening room or special venue location who on earth today is going to run 70mm in a first run house anyway.... Changing back to dual gauge only takes 15 minuites anyway if 70mm need be run. Heck the Europeans also were right about this with the Bauer U-2 and its interchangable seperate 35 or 70mm sprockets. You could change them so fast you could still run 35mm and 70mm during the same show. Mark @ CLACO  |  IP: Logged Alain LeTourneau Film Handler Posts: 37 From: Portland, OR Registered: Jan 2004 posted 09-25-2004 04:24 PM                        My comment about "minimum wage labor" was not intended to say *all* minimum wage labor = bad. By extension all *union* or *well-paid* labor does not = good. There are certainly variables. However, I do think its important that there be a decent wage for people working in any booth, something to aspire to and a process of creating better understanding for the booth's inner workings. That being said, what I would like to know as a member of the audience is what can I say and do to help to change this situation. I don't want to watch scratched prints, and prints should not be getting scratched. Perhaps others out there (those working in the booth and as managers) could recommend a way of appraoching a theater (multiplex and independent) that adequately expresses concern for having the best possible presentation without causing employee defensiveness and a resulting lack of change for the better. Someone mentioned that they talked with a person who thought "scratches" on the print was *normal*. This is definitely a BIG misconception. That film is scratched and projects unsteady is a common misconception about film presentation. And a feather in the cap of the digital (hype) marketing machine. Like the local owner of a film lab said to me: "If Kodak had been making the claims that HD has for the last 20 years Kodak would have been put immediately out of business." Alain  |  IP: Logged Manny Knowles "What are these things and WHY are they BLUE???" Posts: 4247 From: Bloomington, IN, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 09-25-2004 04:44 PM                     I think it is safe to say that the virtually wholesale, industry-wide shift toward having minimum wage employees working the booth is indeed a big part of the problem. Another component is the lack of proper training and, I suspect, a reluctance on the part of theatre owners to provide the best equipment, supplies and working conditions. I have to agree that the general decline in quality presentation is paving the way for a digital revolution. I thought I would be in some sort of 7th Heaven when I got back to Los Angeles. I thought this would be the home of "film done right." No such luck. The world-famous Chinese theatre was having focus issues last weekend as was one of the theatres at Universal Studios. The ONLY impressive show I have seen/heard so far is a DLP presentation of THX 1138. Sad, but true.  |  IP: Logged Alain LeTourneau Film Handler Posts: 37 From: Portland, OR Registered: Jan 2004 posted 09-25-2004 09:59 PM                        Frank Angel wrote: "It's all economics. It's all crap anyway. All you have to do to prove that the distributor wants nothing to do with all but the first run stint is to look at the window of play they give a title. How soon after that first run stretch is the film released on video? Many times it is WHILE the independent or the small circuit is playing those scratched prints. I guess the studio's figure, "Hey, you wanna see the film without scratches after we close it at the godzilla-plexes? Go rent it on video -- there's never any scratches on the DVD."" This is indeed a horrible situation (of course, even worse for non-narrative and low budget films which general run for one night every few years if even that). I can recall a number of films - David Gordon Green's All The Real Girls is one example - that by the time my schedule opened up allowing me to see the film it was gone after only running on the screen for 1-2 weeks. This is the worse when even the rep houses pass on a title despite whether it is good or not. The BIG economics of modern America give one much to deplore! Best, Alain  |  IP: Logged Mike Babb Master Film Handler Posts: 250 From: Norwich UK Registered: Jul 2002 posted 09-25-2004 10:09 PM                        While low wage is a factor, I'd blame it more on training and ongoing supervision. Having at least one experienced person on a staff helps immensely and if that person also supervises and trains, the staff may do well even if paid less. Now if the supervisor/experienced person is underpaid, it creates issues. There's an interesting mix out there of people who are capable but not willing, and people who are willing but not capable  |  IP: Logged Ian Joseph Parfrey Film Handler Posts: 56 From: Bollier Queensland Australia Registered: Sep 2004 posted 09-26-2004 04:39 PM                     Any projector/platter/mut setup can scratch film if it is not 1. CLEAN 2. CORRECTLY ADJUSTED 3. PROPERLY MAINTAINED BY COMPETANT TECHO'S 4. OPERATED BY WELL TRAINED OPERATORS Agree with Brad in regards to Century's. Probably the most gentle projector on the market. I was once told by an engineer that the best way to see if a projector is well designed is to run a reel of junk film through it with all the rollers OFF THE SPROCKETS WHILE RUNNING. The logic behind this relates to the involute curves on the sprocket tooth and stripping angles, sprocket wrap etc. Well, just for fun, after the show at the Drive-in I was working at we decided to give the Century DAW 2's a trial...... and the film ran through the machine very happily without ANY of the pad rollers closed apart from the intermittant, of course. Some may think that this is a frivolous exercise but if you actually think about it it does make a lot of sense (in an engineering sense of the word)  |  IP: Logged Gordon McLeod Film God Posts: 9532 From: Toronto Ontario Canada Registered: Jun 99 posted 09-28-2004 09:20 AM                     Probably the most gentle projectors are the FP20/DP75 serries machines (that inkludes the 30-50 and PK) and the ernaman 12 and 15 Century is not one of the more forgiving machines to damaged film For handling a damaged print the VIc5 gets high marks  |  IP: Logged Mark J. Marshall Film God Posts: 3188 From: New Castle, DE, USA Registered: Aug 2002 posted 09-28-2004 01:39 PM                    quote: Alain LeTourneau Well, I think I know the answer to that question - minimum wage labor happens in the projection booth. I've trained several low wage employees to properly handle film and to take pride in their work, and our theater has a consistantly top notch presentation. The job isn't worth $30 an hour anymore, folks.  |  IP: Logged Ian Joseph Parfrey Film Handler Posts: 56 From: Bollier Queensland Australia Registered: Sep 2004 posted 09-28-2004 04:38 PM                     Hi Gordon. How do you find the nylon skates on the Philips/Kinotons in regards to the SR.D track? I have found that on long runs the SR.D track gets a bit of a thrashing with what looks like a heavy rain-type scratching over the track with a corresponding increase in error rates and emulsion shedding a fine white powder. Is this typical of these machines? I'm still a fan of the Century. One week at the Drive-in, we had to run a print of Flesh Gordon on 6000' spools. This was in '82, and this print was absolutely stuffed with one set of sprocket holes completely stripped (acetate stock) along the entire length of the print. We had no choice but to run it as no other print was available for replacement. Although the screen image was shall we say "jumpy", we never lost one show during that week due to print failure. Admittedly, that may have been attributable to the Chief Projectionists skill in adjusting the intermittant shoe, or just dumb luck, but the Century's just kept the show together. I have never seen any other projector run a print with only one set of legs!  |  IP: Logged Edward Jurich Master Film Handler Posts: 305 From: Las Vegas USA Registered: Jul 2003 posted 09-28-2004 11:00 PM                     Some people just don't deal well with projectors. We have someone who is training in the booth and I'm afraid he's just not film friendly. I went in to check the threadup he did the night before and found the platter leader in two pieces on the floor. No doubt pressed the takeup button with the roller all the way down and left the booth while the takeup ran all the way up and jerked the film. If that wasn't bad enough, he threaded the middle platter payout to the top platter roller with the film running right over the bottom of the top platter. The time before he misthreaded the brain so the film would scrape over a post. I think his booth duty will be limited to pressing the start button, that's if he can remember that fading the music is done by turning the knob to the left, not right so as to blast everyone, then down.  |  IP: Logged

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