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Topic: Weird problem with splices

Hugh McCullough
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 147
From: Old Coulsdon, Surrey, UK
Registered: Jan 2003

posted 10-11-2004 11:10 AM

quote: Stephen Furley
the Odeon Leicester Square ran a Cinemeccanica tower for many years. It was installed during the days of the Vic Xs, remained in use while they had the Vic 8s

The Cinemeccanica tower MK1 at the Odeon Leicester Square was installed in 1977. We did have some trouble with the motor start condensers burning out. We discovered that they were in circuit all the time the tower was running. Overcame this by fitting a double switch. One side of this switch was spring loaded, and returned to the off position when released. The other side stayed in the 'On' position. The sprung loaded side we connected to the condensers

quote: Leo Enticknap

They set their tension automatically - I'm not sure how, but seem to remember that they sense the changing weight of each spool and adjust a some sort of clutch in response.

The automatic film tension on the take up spool was, if I remember correctly, adjusted by the spindle being able to move downwards under the weight of the film thereby altering the take up tension.

I have found that when rewinding a feature on a Westrex tower it is best to set the speed to 90. The film then stops rewinding about 2000ft before the leader. Then you can finish winding at about a speed of 60. Takes about 12 to 15 minutes doing it this way.
Also have to use butt splices. For some reason Westrex towers do not like overlap splices.

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Stephen Furley
Film God

Posts: 3059
From: Coulsdon, Croydon, England
Registered: May 2002

posted 10-11-2004 12:14 PM

quote: Leo Enticknap
True, not as bad as those. That having been said, they weren't really long play (70-80 minutes was about their maximum capacity - try loading any more and it would be on the floor within minutes) and certainly not a device which any serious cinema would ever have used, hence the reason I didn't include them.

Kinoton make one of those endless loop things, web page they claim that theirs will run 5000 metres of film; I'm not sure I'd want to try it. How do you load the film onto these things? I wouldn't have thought that you could just run the film onto it like you would with a normal platter, do you run the print off a spool, through the projector and then just take up on this thing, stop to splice on each new reel, then retrieve the start of the film from the centre and splice it to the end?

I believe there are a few 'normal' cinemas which have this sort of thing, but I've never seen one.

quote: Hugh McCullough
The Cinemeccanica tower MK1 at the Odeon Leicester Square was installed in 1977. We did have some trouble with the motor start condensers burning out. We discovered that they were in circuit all the time the tower was running. Overcame this by fitting a double switch. One side of this switch was spring loaded, and returned to the off position when released. The other side stayed in the 'On' position. The sprung loaded side we connected to the condensers

The Phoenix, East Finchley had one from the time they installed a FP-20, I think it was 1986, until a couple of years ago when it died, and was replaced by a Westrex one. I think it was some sort of electrical problem. This had the double switches whenever I saw it, from sometime in the early '90s, but I don't know if it had them from new; It wasn't new when they got it. The Westrex towers seem to have been more common than the Cinemeccanica ones; there are still loads of them in use.

I've been in the box at Leicester Square just once, many years ago now. The three Vic Xs were in then, but no tower. I think they still had the large Zenith arcs on them. When would this have been, early '70s? Was this during your time there?

I've met Nigel Wolland a few times, but never at the Odeon. I should have asked if he could get me another visit.

This will probably be my last post for a while. Tomorrow and Wednesday I'm busy tying up loose ends at work, Thursday I'm off on holiday until the 28th. I've then got a couple of days off to sort out a few things before starting back at work on the 1st of November.

Best wishes all.

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Leo Enticknap
Film God

Posts: 7474
From: Loma Linda, CA
Registered: Jul 2000

posted 10-11-2004 03:12 PM

Thanks for the info on Cinemec towers, Hugh. My memory of them is a very positive one - you just pressed the button and off they went, be it running or rewinding. At the end of the pass, the film was always wound evenly and solidly, but not so hard as to risk cinching. The Westar towers, on the other hand, required constant babysitting and usually managed to do something nasty to the film. Plus they also had horrid screw clamps for securing the spools on their spindles, with a nasty tendency to work loose. I had one spool fly off during a rewind and dread to think what would have happened if I'd been in its way at the time. The Cinemecs, on the other hand, had a conventional securing flange - just like any other spindle on the face of the planet.

quote: Stephen Furley
How do you load the film onto these things?

It's well over a decade since I've used one, but in essence the technique was to cycle the programme round to the point at which the splice you want to insert or remove footage at is positioned between the bottom of the projector and the platter intake. You then undo the splice and either offload film from the feeder, through the projector and onto a spool; or from the projector's feed spool, through the projector and onto the programme.

How you get film onto an empty platter I don't know. It must have been a major faff because we were told never to do it, i.e. winding several thousand feet of crap spacing onto a plate temporarily was preferable to having to load one from empty. This might just have been a personal preference of the chief who trained me, but at the time I hated the things, wanted as little to do with them as possible and was very happy to obey orders!

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Hugh McCullough
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 147
From: Old Coulsdon, Surrey, UK
Registered: Jan 2003

posted 10-11-2004 05:02 PM

Stephen,
Sorry, but I made a mistake. The Cinemeccanica tower was installed in 1976, (see http://www.cinephoto.co.uk/odeon_leicester_square_5.htm) and the Zenith arcs replaced with AutoArc Xenons.
These were a disaster with overheating problems, caused by a fan that worked when it wanted to, and had too small a hot air outlet. About two years later were themselves replaced with Zenith Xenon conversions. (Bernard Bentley)

I agree Leo. The Cinemeccanica tower is a far superior piece of equipment, but I did have a feed spool fall off with about 6000ft of film on it. This was caused by the small pin holding the spindle clip on to the shaft falling out.
Cinemmeccanica were amazed, and keep saying "That's not supposed to happen". Maybe not, but it did.
To keep the spool on the Westrex tower requires either tightening the screw clamp with a wrench (not recommended), or using a locking nut.
Have you ever tried to replace a motor on the Westrex?
The are so heavy that it needs two people to do the job. One to remove, and replace the panel screws, and one to hold the whole assembly in place. A real pain if it is one of the upper motors.

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Leo Enticknap
Film God

Posts: 7474
From: Loma Linda, CA
Registered: Jul 2000

posted 10-12-2004 02:38 AM

quote:
his was caused by the small pin holding the spindle clip on to the shaft falling out.

I guess the centrifugal force generated by a full spool spinning at rewind speed must put quite a strain on that pin. I hope they managed to produce a mod to strengthen it.

I came across various improvised techniques for making the Westrex spool clamp stay put, which their inventors all swore by (and I usually swore at). A piece of cardboard in between the clamp and the spool was usually better than nothing, but I would still make sure I was behind the operating side while rewinding! At one place I worked a few relief shifts they had discarded the 'official' clamps altogether and used enormous brass nuts, a rubber washer between nut and spool, and tightened with a big socket wrench. As you say, monkey wrenches are another way, but after a few months of that there doesn't tend to be much left of the spindle thread.

I never had the pleasure of changing a Westrex motor, but have helped to shift two GK-37s (pedestal, mech and lamphouse) up a flight of 47 stairs!

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