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Author Topic: Types of grease for Century gears Dan Lyons Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 698 From: Seal Beach, CA Registered: Sep 2002 posted 03-26-2005 09:23 PM                     Update: This morning I put more Superlube on all gears. Ran for about 3 minutes, I observed the same spots were DRY again with orange powder on that section of the gears. I cleaned the gears off, and applied some vintage TU 235. I ran for 3 minutes. NOt only did I observe the same orange powdery spots where the lube had been pushed off, but the metal gears were EXTREMELY HOT to the touch. Almost hot enough to burn me. ideas?  |  IP: Logged Tim Reed Better Projection Pays Posts: 5246 From: Northampton, PA Registered: Sep 1999 posted 03-26-2005 11:33 PM                       Check that the intermittent movement isn't pressing too hard against the vertical shaft. There should be just barely-perceptible back lash between those two gears. Also, assuming the sprocket shafts have been getting oiled and are not binding... turn on the projector and carefully loosen the screws on the two vertical shaft bearing retainers, so that the shaft can align itself to the gear train. Then retighten the screws. Just be careful that you don't get the end of the screwdriver caught in a gear while you're doing this.  |  IP: Logged Aaron Sisemore Flaming Ribs beat Reeses Peanut Butter Cups any day! Posts: 3061 From: Rockwall TX USA Registered: Sep 1999 posted 03-27-2005 12:02 AM                     Yeah, Danny- it sounds like the gear lash is set WAY too tight on your JJ. Follow Tim's instructions and all should be fine. There should be a teeny tiny bit of movement/play on the main, vertical, intermittent and shutter shafr gear meshes. Too little and its sloppy, too much and you get premature wear of the fiber gears as well as possible noise and vibration. -Aaron  |  IP: Logged Dan Lyons Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 698 From: Seal Beach, CA Registered: Sep 2002 posted 03-27-2005 03:00 AM                     A huge Thank You to Tim and Aaron. That little trick seems to have solved my problem, and the machine turns over by hand much easier now also!  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 03-27-2005 08:16 AM                     quote: Tim Reed turn on the projector and carefully loosen the screws on the two vertical shaft bearing retainers, so that the shaft can align itself to the gear train. Then retighten the screws. Just be careful that you don't get the end of the screwdriver caught in a gear while you're doing this. Ya gotta be careful doing this!!! If the dowel pimns are in there it isn't going to hardly move at all and if its done wrong and the dowel pins are missing you can actually bend the vert shaft permanently. I remove the imtermittent and shutter shaft. Then adjust the vert. shaft by loosening the movement drive gear block and making sure that its very free to move. You will find some are locked in the carrage assy. because of excess paint or rust. Then loosen the top and bottom bearing blocks and check and set clearance in the sprocket drive gears. Keep in mind that these machines are supposed to have dowel pins that locate the top and bottom brearing blocks in place but they may have been removed by some technician that thought he could asjust it better than the factory.... remember these should have grease clearance, not oil clearance and the gears mesh should be just a tad sloppy! Anyway I prefer to have the pins in place and usually replace them if they are missing. If the dowels are in there you will not be able to move the top and bottom bearing blocks around by more than about a couple of ten thos. Once you are satisified thay are properly located or loosning them doesn't allow any movement then tighten them down snug AND THEN re-tighten the intermittent drive gear bearing block back to the intermittent carrage. Then re-insert the movement and adjust for one thickness of notebook paper clearance. Ditto with the shutter shaft and then re-run in the machine for several hours. BTW: The main reason for loosing the intermittent bearing block is to relieve any stress that might be placed on the vert. shaft as you move the upper/lower bearing blocks around. Its really best to rely on the pins for the upper and lower blocks and replace them if missing, then tighten down the movement drive block. No stress that could reult in a permanent set on that long shaft wil happen of you do it this way. Really Danny, just takethewholedamthignapartandlearn! Mark  |  IP: Logged Scott Norwood Film God Posts: 8146 From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas) Registered: Jun 99 posted 03-28-2005 08:02 AM                        Danny--your Century gear grease is in a metal tube? Every tube that I have seen is clear. I have an almost-full tube (which is probably 30 years old, but still feels fine) of the original stuff, which I expect to be a lifetime supply for home use. Is there any reason to strip this stuff off (how?) and switch to Super Lube or something else? My Centurys are fairly low mileage (probably about 1-2000 hours on each, if that) and will get relatively little use (maybe once a week) from me, in case that matters.  |  IP: Logged Dan Lyons Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 698 From: Seal Beach, CA Registered: Sep 2002 posted 03-28-2005 02:20 PM                     Yep, here they are Scott. The one in the metal tube is REALLY old, but just as good as the other. Hasn't separated or gone bad.  |  IP: Logged Manny Knowles "What are these things and WHY are they BLUE???" Posts: 4247 From: Bloomington, IN, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 03-29-2005 01:14 PM                     FWIW I don't think this is a lube issue at all. If your gears are becoming too hot to handle in such a short space of time -- and so soon after a reapplication of lube -- then they are most likely binding. In which case, no amount of lube (natural/synthetic, new/old, this brand/that brand) is going to solve the problem. The projector will need a realignment. If the SHAFTS are also too hot to touch then you may have a bent shaft. This could be the cause of the improper meshing or it could be in addition to...  |  IP: Logged Dick Prather Master Film Handler Posts: 259 From: Portland, OR, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 03-29-2005 01:48 PM                     The only Century's I have worked on that had dowel pins were the model C. Most A type did not have them. With that said in the many I have rebuilt I have found the gears over the years are slightly different. I replace Century gears in pairs only due to that. Usually when a gear gets hot it is due to an improper mesh or the gears not being matched and the cut being off to each other. I always use LaVezzi gears and have not hade any problems. I agree with Manny grese is probably not the problem. I do NOT recommemd unloosing anything on the gear side while the machine is running. Once I have a properly done vertical shaft assembly I will line it up to get proper mesh with the lower drive and the two sprocket gears. Tighten the screws on the bearing retainers. If there are dowel pins use them onlf if the proper gear mesh can be obtained. If not remove them or tap them flat so the bearing retainers can be properly adjusted. Then tighten the two screws on the intermittent gear holder. I they loosen the bearing retainers then tighten them one at a time again to let the vertical shaft set itself. Always check for hand rotation after each operation to make sure you have the proper adjustment. I then run in the machine for a bit dry untill I a slight fiber dust on the metal gear then grese the gears as normal. I would also be happy to discuss this on the phone with you if needed.  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 03-29-2005 10:59 PM                     Dick, I have to confess that most of the A series I've worked on have had the dowel pins in them. This area is the exception where a certain tech has admitted to taking them all out over the years and I've slowly put them back in. Rarely do I have a gear mesh problem with them in and if there is a mesh problem that usually points to another problem elsewhere(mating gear, bushing etc) that also needs to be delt with. And yes there are those few incorrectly machined castings out there too! Another thing I have been doing lately is scrapping the rubber isolated intermittent drive castings and replacing them with the solid variety. The machines with the solid castings always run alot smoother... the C model, the early A model and the Cinerama/JJ's all had the solid mount casting. You should try out the new Wolk Gears on a rebuild one of these days...... very good uality, actually better than the LaVezzi fibre and they're now made on CNC gear cutters. I still use the LaVezzi steel gears though. P.S. I agree on not working with a running machine! Mark  |  IP: Logged Phil Hill I love my cootie bug Posts: 7595 From: Hollywood, CA USA Registered: Mar 2000 posted 03-30-2005 01:22 AM                  Danny, I don't agree with Mark, Manny, or Dick... I think you should change the lubricant to either of these: or "Elbow Grease"  |  IP: Logged Dick Prather Master Film Handler Posts: 259 From: Portland, OR, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 03-30-2005 02:30 PM                     The newer machines I've been getting did not have locating pins in them. Perhaps someone did remove them but on most I could not get a proper gear mesh if the pin was still there. I have seen gear mesh problems with older Wolk and some ORC made gears. I agree with Mark in changing the intermittent drive gear bearing bracket (BR-3). I have been doing this for several years. Also LaVezzi came out with an anealed vertical shaft and gear (C3-G-93) that does not bend or warp. A little more cost but well worth it for longer life. Century's may look simple but if they are not set up correctly with all the correct parts they wear out quickly. Phill is right on the mark with the grease. I don't know why we didn't think of it.  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 03-30-2005 07:46 PM                     quote: Dick Prather I have seen gear mesh problems with older Wolk and some ORC made gears. Actually when Don bought Wolk out they retired all the old gear hobbing equipment for good. NOrm alwyas told me that it wasn't the geas it was the equipment they were being made on that was bad . Now they are made for Wolk on cnc equipment. They seem to haev hit the nail dead on by doing this. As for ORC, they ruined the Century, then Stonrg bought the remains and destroyed the rest. Mark  |  IP: Logged Michael Rourke Expert Film Handler Posts: 159 From: San Luis Obispo, Central Coast of CA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 03-31-2005 02:18 PM                     Hey Dan, I thought I would give my 2 cents about grease since I had quite the ordeal trying to choose the right kind for me and my Century's. If you like the Century Grease and it's working for you just stick with it. It was a little too thin for me, and even though our booth is air conditioned our lamp exhaust sucks meaning more heat in the gear box. I chose the Superlube because it stays on the gears and it is available at local bearing dealers so I don't have to order it through a supply house and wait for weeks because it's back ordered. If you order the little tubes of TU 235 I think they are like 8 or 9 bucks a tube but you can go get a 5 pound bucket of Superlube for $40 bucks. Rheolube was the best stuff ever, do they still make it? I raised a stink when I couldn't get it anymore through our distributor because it held fast to all the gears even the fiber shutter gear. It does dry up more than Superlube though. Hope that helps with any decision you're gonna make.  |  IP: Logged Tim Reed Better Projection Pays Posts: 5246 From: Northampton, PA Registered: Sep 1999 posted 03-31-2005 02:31 PM                       quote: Mark Gulbrandsen I remove the imtermittent and shutter shaft. Then adjust Yes, I thought about that after I'd posted, but by then, I was already out on the big road. quote: I agree on not working with a running machine! Well, I said you gotta be careful! It's not for the faint of heart, naturally, but you gotta figure he knows at least something about what he's doing. It's not that difficult an operation.  |  IP: Logged

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