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This topic comprises 2 pages: 1 2
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Author
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Topic: DTS Digital Sound in a Drive-In
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Frank Angel
Film God
Posts: 5305
From: Brooklyn NY USA
Registered: Dec 1999
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posted 06-14-2005 01:22 PM
MRD-DS000 Sony's Virtual Digital Surround Processor: 
The processor has 6 inputs and sends the processed virtual surround two channel signal to the headsets via infrared. There is also an output 1/4in TRS jack for a corded headset which is where you can also get the processed signal. That is where you would get your L - R signal to feed the transmitter.
Sony sez: quote:
Enjoy the surround sound equivalent to that of 6 speakers (using only two) when you listen with Sonys MDR-DS8000 Infrared Cordless® Digital Surround Headphone System.
....this system is compatible with DTS ES, Dolby Digital EX, DTS, Dolby Digital, Dolby Surround, Dolby Pro Logic II and MPEG2 AAC. ... an Optimum surround field is created anywhere (between two speakers) -- simply select Input, Effect Mode, & Output. For a more realistic surround sound experience, choose the MDR-DS8000
This unit with the infrared headset has a list on the Sony site for $799, but I know I saw it for half that street price. Again, small price to pay to give them surround sound in the car. I know if I owned a DI, you bet I would have this thing installed in the blink of an eye and then go about getting Filmack to make me a snipe proclaiming that we had Dolby Digital Surround.
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Jack Ondracek
Film God
Posts: 2348
From: Port Orchard, WA, USA
Registered: Oct 2002
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posted 06-14-2005 03:37 PM
quote: Robert Schultz
do you know how they are mixing the channels? Is it similar to, or the same way I am doing it?
Pretty much, Robert. The only real catch to this is that you are feeding two monaural sources to your stereo channels (the center and sub feeds), so you need to use mixers with active front ends to prevent the l/r channels from mixing and losing separation.
I'm using Behringer mixers in my 3 setups. They're small enough to mount in back of the rack. A friend of mine in Lockport, NY installed SRD this year. He uses a rack-mounted mixer, but his rack has a security door on it.
quote: Robert Schultz
The FM unit I am using for this system has a built in Limiter and Compressor that I setup very carefully, but this did allow me to play the dynamic range of film tracks and still get a good volume level over the FM transmitter.
Mine does, too. However, I take a somewhat different approach to the final dynamics of the system. In my mind, people are going to compare my sound to the (unfortunately) squished & clipped stuff they listen to on their way out (cd's notwithstanding). People are talking in their cars, so the ambient noise levels are frequently higher than you'd find in an indoor theatre. Add to this, the noise floor of many FM radios I've tested out here (generally 40-45db), and you have a system that is not compatible with the dynamic range of even SR.. much less a digital playback. In my case, I'm using Afterburners to get the range somewhat under control. Past that, everything here passes through a 6-band Behringer DSP-9024 processor, where most of the dynamics are adjusted... to a Broadcast Warehouse transmitter, which has an internal peak limiter I use very sparingly.
My booth is controlled by a Broadcast Systems "Simian" automation system, which manages our show starts (control of the automation), intermission announcements, pre-show and intermission music programming and the voiceovers I can do at the ends of our trailers. This system uses a sound card for each screen. Software-controlled mixers allow for audio inserts. I use a Broadcast Tools audio switcher to to insert the Simian sound cards into the audio chain only when needed. This allows the entire system to be operated manually, if necessary. The switcher also feeds cue inputs from the film to the Simian system to trigger the various audio functions it controls throughout the night.
As a system, the computer manages my entire presentation except the start points of each feature. With one button, the system runs through our introductory audio, starts the show, does any voiceover tags during our trailers ("Batman Begins starts Wednesday, here at the Rodeo Drive-In"), intermission inserts on the first feature's credits ("get in here and buy more stuff"), then starts the music at the end of the feature. Music plays until I go up to hit another button (lens changes and DTS disk changes are done at this point). At the end of whatever song is playing, the computer does some marketing for the drive-in then starts the second show, does any voiceovers on the trailers, then switches itself out of the audio circuit until the second feature credits hit. It then switches back in, does our "bye bye" audio (exits are at the left of the field and out the back), then plays our exit audio when the credits end. Basically, the computer does all the stuff I used to do manually, so I can spend more time cooking cheeseburgers and french fries!
When I get to it, the system can be made to trigger our 2-way radios & announce intermissions and any alarms... something like the Newmade system, though I can do any audio I want.
I'm running XL heads, SH1012 sound w/ CE readers, TA10 controllers and a 701 reader for the DA20. Lamphouses are the new 7kW Big Sky units with glass reflectors, electric dowsers & Strong switcher supplies. My automation controls the motorized dowsers, not the bulbs, which are manually switched on & stay lit throughout the nite.
 
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Jack Ondracek
Film God
Posts: 2348
From: Port Orchard, WA, USA
Registered: Oct 2002
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posted 06-14-2005 06:40 PM
Well, maybe not, Scott. You could probably get things up & running in pretty short order.
While probably true that you might have to figure out how to get music to play out of the computer (maybe I should wire up a cd player to the nonsync inputs?)... the system initially boots up without any fancy stuff in the circuit. You can turn on the breakers, thread up, hit the start on the TA10 and it will work. It just won't be snazzy. On power-up, the audio switchers default to a straight-thru channel. If not separately armed, the computer will not interfere or respond to any incoming triggers. Past that, everything else is icing on the cake.
quote: Frank Angel
Sony makes a processor that will take the five channels and processes them for virtual surround. This is for headset listening
I think I've seen earlier posts about this, Frank... maybe even from you. Seems I remember a report that this unit is effective only if you have a fixed point of reference (center). In a car, with people sitting on both sides & maybe also in the back, would this still work & not be a distraction?
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Jack Ondracek
Film God
Posts: 2348
From: Port Orchard, WA, USA
Registered: Oct 2002
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posted 06-14-2005 09:07 PM
quote: Robert Schultz
Some time when I'm in the area I'd love to stop by and see this in person.
Any time!
Oh, by the way... I need to pass along my appreciation to Mark for the way he (and his company) approach their business.
About 2 weeks ago, my DA20 started acting a bit wierd. Over about 7 days, it got worse, then eventually died altogether... reasonable error rates, but no audio. A long conversation with Dolby resulted in no clear answers. One of their people actually suggested I pull the cards and "lightly tap the relays" (???????)!
After a chat with Mark, it became clear, this problem was going to be an unusual one.
Mark sent me a complete DA20, which I initially used intact to eliminate my reader (which scoped out ok) and anything else external (it worked fine). Simple card substitution after that pointed to the single card that was causing all the trouble (it was the 673 board).
Fixing this could have been much more complicated... possibly requiring me to send the whole box out (I didn't have another one here to compare it to). Mark's approach had me back up in a couple of days.
So, my thanks to Mark & the rest of the folks at Claco. With Vern being gone, it's good to find people who really know this stuff when I do get stumped.
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Frank Angel
Film God
Posts: 5305
From: Brooklyn NY USA
Registered: Dec 1999
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posted 06-15-2005 10:48 AM
Jack, that's a spectacular setup....love that computer monitor sitting there ruling the world. Me, I would try to automate the hamburger grill so I would have more time to work the booth. ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
As for that Sony processor, I did post about it when I first saw it a couple of years ago because I was blown away when I heard the Dolby Virtual Surround --there is something about hearing a sound coming from behind you, but you turn around and there are no speakers, that fascinates me. Then when Sony incorporated the technology into a unit that seemed to be an easy way to get it into a DI sound system, being the DI lover I am, well like I said, if I ran a DI, I would try this thing out.
And yes, ideally it wants you to be equidistant between the two speakers. But I saw the technology when it was demonstrated using speakers (not headphones) and even at a ten feet distance from the speakers, and quite off-center (it was at Computer Expo in a demo of a sound card where the Dolby Virtual Surround was incorporated -- about 10 of us standing around the computer speakers) the effect was still very impressive.
As for being distracting, if you are not dead center, then the perspective shift that would ocurr wouldn't be any more distracting than what happens in two channel stereo when you are not sitting dead center -- the stereo perspective shifts slightly. Same here, the entire multi-channel soundstage shifts slightly, but you still hear audio that is supposed to come from behind you coming from behind, maybe only a bit to the left or a bit to the right, depending on you off-center position.
This technology is used in lots of TV sets and like a car, people aren't sitting exactly dead center and it seems to work. I guess the only way to see what it does would be to install it and do some testing. Just get it from a place that has a 30 day return policy.
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John Vincent, Jr.
Film Handler
Posts: 16
From: Eastham, MA, USA
Registered: Jul 2003
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posted 06-16-2005 09:05 AM
A couple of years ago I bought a Lake Techologies Dolby Headphone unit and tried that at our drive-in (hooked up to a CP-55), worked great over FM if you used a walkman, not so great if you used your car speakers.
Still may go digital next year, if for anything but having a inherent backup in extracting the soundtrack. The only thing that would prevent us from using the new virutal surround technologies, is that I have to apply compression via a Beherenger unit (700 cars with a dynamic soundtrack does not bode well with my close neighbors), and the compression ruins the encoding for the virtual surround.
Another option I'm considering is providing a different frequency for FM Walkmans and the Dolby Headphone, that way if you wanted to hear it in Dolby Digital with Dolby Headphone, you could, without compression.
For our current setup, we use a CP-55 with the 150 card removed and Lt and Rt bypassing the 150 slot via the DB 25 test port in back. On to the compressor and FM transmitter, as well as a active mixer combining Lt and Rt for field speakers.
John - Wellfleet DI
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Not exactly the sort of booth that one could just walk into and run a show without having seen it before, however.
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