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Author Topic: The Advanced Projection Manual
Mark Gulbrandsen
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 - posted 09-30-2007 10:22 AM      Profile for Mark Gulbrandsen   Email Mark Gulbrandsen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Tim,

Check the US Department Of Commerce Statistic Records ... thats whats shown there.

Mark

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Richard Fowler
Film God

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 - posted 09-30-2007 03:30 PM      Profile for Richard Fowler   Email Richard Fowler   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
From experience, Department of Commerce figures, are at best, a good sticking your finger in the wind estimate [Razz] Christie and Strong have good and bad points; it depends what the end user considers good for their situation.

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Mark Gulbrandsen
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 - posted 09-30-2007 07:41 PM      Profile for Mark Gulbrandsen   Email Mark Gulbrandsen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Well Richard... thats kind of a duh thing in reality. Of course differing points are generally why people choose different things. In the projection world though projectors and systems are many times sold because they are the lowest price equipment... not because some technical folks get to actually decide on two brands good or bad points. The market is and always has been price driven except in high end installations. Christie has obviously kept their proices lower(that I can attest to by experience!). The P-35 is ALOT less expensive to build than an X-L/5-star or Apogee.... and is certainly an equal to and many times better performer on screen. Christie continues to improve on it while Stong has been stuck in the muck... well... well pretty much for ever.

Mark

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Leo Enticknap
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 - posted 10-01-2007 12:43 PM      Profile for Leo Enticknap   Author's Homepage   Email Leo Enticknap   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I bought a copy at GEH at the AMIA conference last week. I've only had a chance to skim-read it so far. My first impressions are that it offers very comprehensive coverage of the issues and problems involved in archival print handling, setting up a booth for legacy format presentation and the operations and maintenance stuff which comes with that. It would be perfect for an advanced projectionist or tech who is moving into a well-equipped booth and/or a job that will involve handling legacy format prints or physically problematic (e.g. shrunk) ones on a regular basis. I suspect that it's pitched at too high a level for someone with less than 5-10 years of experience.

It doesn't cover the basic theory or operations at all - for example, the book assumes that you know the theory behind the operation of the intermittent or shutter, or how analogue optical sound is recorded and reproduced. The emphasis of the book is completely on the things you need to know to handle and present archival, special format and other non-standard prints, which you probably don't need to know in a mainstream/multiplex environment.

Strengths

  1. The chapter on bench handling techniques gives a thorough account of what you need to look for when getting an archive print ready for projection.
  2. The chapter on 35mm aspect ratios is great, with excellent frame scans as examples and a good 'how to make an educated guess at the correct ratio if the print doesn't tell you' section.
  3. There's a very good discussion of the different types of optical mono track and how these affect playback on modern cinema processors.
  4. The chapter on video projection has very a clear and effective discussion of the signals theory, TV standards and other background knowledge needed to understand how electronic projection actually works.
  5. The standard of illustrations - both photos and diagrams - is good throughout.
Weaknesses

  1. Some issues are covered in great depth, while others are brushed over or just aren't there. For example there's a big chapter on 3-D projection and short-lived sound formats which even rep projectionists are unlikely to ever encounter (e.g. 70mm CDS), but nothing whatsoever on nitrate projection.
  2. There is no reasoning or explanation for many of the book's recommended practices. For example, why does the author regard the DP-75 as suitable but the Vic 8 as an unsuitable projector for use in archival projector?
  3. The chapter on booth equipment doesn't cover automation and non-rewind systems (i.e. platters, double-MUTs and towers) at all - not even to say 'don't use them'. For something claiming to be an advanced projection manual in general rather than an archival projection manual specifically, leaving this out is a major problem.
  4. The chapter on small gauge projection doesn't really work. It offers no comparative discussion of the different theatre-scale 16mm machines in the way that the book does for 35/70 (though there are few brief paragraphs on this in an earlier section), and nor does it offer much in the way of practical pointers for optimising the quality of 16mm projection. Given that many archival projection prints in circulation are 16mm, I felt that more space needed to be given to this topic.
  5. The chapter on digital projection will very quickly go out of date, but I guess that can't be helped.
  6. At 55 euros or $80, it probably costs more than many individuals or smaller theatres are willing to pay (though in my opinion, almost all of FIAF's publications are overpriced, relative to what they offer).
In short, my initial reaction is that this book does a lot of very good things, and understandably concentrates on the areas that the BKSTS manual either doesn't cover at all or only very briefly. But some of the 'recommendations' really need to be explained and justified (given that this claims to be 'advanced', it should cover fors and againsts rather than just say 'do this' or 'don't do that') and I get the impression of some problematic gaps in its coverage. I'd guess this is because (according to his bio on in70mm.com), Mr. Sætervadet's background is exclusively as a theatre tech and projectionist, and therefore probably isn't bringing in the archivist's perspective to the discussion. Hopefully, sales will be good enough to be able to think about a second edition which could enlarge this aspect of the book a bit.

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Oliver Pasch
Film Handler

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 - posted 10-02-2007 01:56 AM      Profile for Oliver Pasch     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I've ordered this book some month ago directly from Norway without any problems - shipping was reliable and fast.

@Leo: i do agree on some points of your strength & weaknesses list, however, there's absolutely no way of being comprehensive when it comes to this subject. Still, i truely believe that this is

by far the best book on cinema technology ever .

And about pricing: you might want to realise that the print run isn't as huge as with the latest Harry Potter - have a look at other "special interest" publications and you'll see that it's almost a bargain.

Oliver

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Leo Enticknap
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 - posted 10-02-2007 02:53 AM      Profile for Leo Enticknap   Author's Homepage   Email Leo Enticknap   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
If you look at the typical range of books published by, say, Focal Press or Routledge on technical topics (which also sell comparatively short print runs, of usually well under a thousand copies), you'll see that almost all titles are also available in paperback and that the prices rarely exceed £20 (35 euros or $40). And these are produced by for-profit publishers! FIAF is supposed to be a non-profit professional body and advocacy organisation, and so either they're raking in a big profit on book sales or their production practices are inefficient. Their costs will be slightly higher than those of the big publishers, but not that much. My point is that the price is high enough to deter people who are interested but not that interested from buying it, or who simply don't earn enough to be able to spend nearly $100 on a book.

I agree that the book achieves a lot of very good things, and covers aspects of projection installation, operation and training which no similar manual published in the last 30 years does. But the coverage is too patchy (something which could have been addressed by consulting with archive technicians and access officers more than I suspect the author did) and contains too many unsubstantiated opinions for me to consider it definitive or the last word.

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Tim Reed
Better Projection Pays

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 - posted 10-02-2007 06:03 AM      Profile for Tim Reed   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Mark Gulbrandsen
The P-35 is ALOT less expensive to build than an X-L/5-star or Apogee.... and is certainly an equal to and many times better performer on screen.
 -

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Mark Gulbrandsen
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 - posted 10-02-2007 08:51 AM      Profile for Mark Gulbrandsen   Email Mark Gulbrandsen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Mark Gulbrandsen
The P-35 is ALOT less expensive to build than an X-L/5-star or Apogee.... and is certainly an equal to and many times better performer on screen.
And at least with the few parts orders we have had to do we also get the right parts instead of someone elses order [thumbsup] .

Mark

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Richard Fowler
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 - posted 10-02-2007 10:22 AM      Profile for Richard Fowler   Email Richard Fowler   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
The Chinese clone of the P-35 is even cheaper to build....but the cast iron casting makes it a little heavy [Razz] Our $$$ buying power will probably make all brands make some price changes....but then again, how many film projectors are being sold lately [Confused]

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Mark Gulbrandsen
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 - posted 10-02-2007 12:59 PM      Profile for Mark Gulbrandsen   Email Mark Gulbrandsen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Richard Fowler
but then again, how many film projectors are being sold lately
The Christie line can do about 40 projectors a day and is still going full blast... sometimes running with two shifts when its really busy. You do the math.

Mark

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Louis Bornwasser
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 - posted 10-02-2007 01:02 PM      Profile for Louis Bornwasser   Author's Homepage   Email Louis Bornwasser   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Still selling film machines in 100% of our new construction at Hadden. Louis

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Mark Gulbrandsen
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From: Music City
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 - posted 10-02-2007 02:05 PM      Profile for Mark Gulbrandsen   Email Mark Gulbrandsen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Our last two were... still in the middle of the second one... All Christie/Dolby/JBL Schneider/(some ISCO) of course... Chineese seating which we have sold and installed now on over a a dozen jobs and not one seat problem. We have another 12 plex comming up thats supposed to be all DP-70 but we'll see if that one holds true or not. I can live with either film or digital... both are good methods of presentation.

Mark

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Richard Fowler
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From: Ft. Lauderdale, FL, USA
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 - posted 10-02-2007 04:52 PM      Profile for Richard Fowler   Email Richard Fowler   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Using "Christie" math....who needs digital projectors when you can get a new film projector every three years to re-equip the entire U.S. market...no service, no repair, just have them last long enough to be replaced. [Smile] It will give them time to build a 100 digital machines a day. [Big Grin] One manufacturer I know dropped a model due to the "bottleneck" regarding intermittents...better to sell a more expensive projector than a cheap model using the identical time/labor/materials to make the heart of the machine. [Cool]
Glad you had no problems with the chairs....I was dealing with that manufacturer in 2001 and their game plan and product was solid.........
I love film and have been doing more custom jobs and rentals since there is less of us old Phil - Louis guys in the field. [Razz]

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Mark Gulbrandsen
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From: Music City
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 - posted 10-02-2007 06:21 PM      Profile for Mark Gulbrandsen   Email Mark Gulbrandsen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Richard Fowler
since there is less of us old Phil - Louis guys in the field.
Oh come on now... I'm every bit as old.... [Eek!] [Frown] [Embarrassed] [sleep]

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Mike Blakesley
Film God

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 - posted 10-02-2007 06:33 PM      Profile for Mike Blakesley   Author's Homepage   Email Mike Blakesley   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Mark Gulbrandsen
Chineese seating which we have sold and installed now on over a a dozen jobs and not one seat problem.
Hey, you told me those seats weren't any good. (Bet the bottoms aren't falling off of them though.)

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