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Author Topic: THX returns to Cinemark > OT Speaker Cables Sam D. Chavez Film God Posts: 2153 From: Martinez, CA USA Registered: Aug 2003 posted 04-12-2008 08:23 PM                       The D20 never made it to cinemas. The first THX hardware was the crossover cards in DBX frames, then the cards in a CE frame, this was 3417, then the D1138 which was a joint project between THX and BACP. Presently, they use QSC DCM's for the crossover/monitor.  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 04-12-2008 09:15 PM                     The crossovers are now treated like other components...either they are, or are not, on the approved list. Steve  |  IP: Logged Tristan Lane Master Film Handler Posts: 444 From: Nampa, Idaho Registered: Feb 2002 posted 04-13-2008 02:40 AM                     quote: Sam D. Chavez The D20 never made it to cinemas. That explains why I couldn't find much info on it. I've only seen one 1138 unit in the field, and I was impressed with the styling and build of it. I still think the 3417 is one of the best sounding booth monitors out there (when it's not buzzing). So, if a theater has all THX approved equipment, and can meet all of the auditorium criteria, they can be certified without purchasing additional equipment? Also, Have any of the criteria changed?  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 04-13-2008 07:18 AM                     I suppose it is possible though the auditorium, unless carefully designed, will likely need improvements to achieve the proper isolation and the THX baffle wall (constructed to their specs...not just any wall or bafflette) will likely need to be added. THX also puts requirements on the wiring (gauge as well as how the surrounds are wired and the load presented to the amps) may need some changes. The room will need initial certification plus annual recertifications. Steve  |  IP: Logged Sam D. Chavez Film God Posts: 2153 From: Martinez, CA USA Registered: Aug 2003 posted 04-13-2008 12:33 PM                       We sold exactly 991 of the D1138's during the life of the project. A lot of them went to emerging markets like Mexico and South America. We used two Audax 3.5 inch speakers to improve the sound but by this time there was nobody left in the booth to notice. The 3417 was designed in part by Tom Holman and had something of a tuned chamber and a bit more room for a reasonable speaker. Later 3417's had rattle problems. Also, the original speaker went out of production and the replacement one, although of good quality, did not sound nearly as good. Oh for the days when the design of a booth monitor actually was considered a priority.  |  IP: Logged Tristan Lane Master Film Handler Posts: 444 From: Nampa, Idaho Registered: Feb 2002 posted 04-13-2008 01:41 PM                     I forgot about the baffle wall. Can anyone tell me how much more cost this would add to the front ends of the house on a new construction job?  |  IP: Logged Dave Cutler Master Film Handler Posts: 277 From: Centennial, CO Registered: Jun 2000 posted 04-14-2008 10:06 PM                     What I found most interesting about this was that it specifically mentions Denver. There are only 3 Cinemark locations in the Denver Area. Aurora, Lakewood BelMar and my location, Boulder. Aurora and Lakewood BelMar are already THX certified, as they are Century locations. Century - Boulder is a hybrid Cinemark/Century, opened 17 Aug 07. Century designed it before the buyout, and Cinemark built it. It's a pretty cool theatre actually, so I hope we're on the list.  |  IP: Logged Frank Angel Film God Posts: 5305 From: Brooklyn NY USA Registered: Dec 1999 posted 04-14-2008 10:33 PM                        Well the other day I walked past a Radio Shack and saw a whole rack of speaker cable, video cables, etc and the THX logo was emblazened on all the boxes. THX Speaker Cables! Sooooo....if THX is approving speaker cable, then it follows that any theatre that doesn't have THX official approved speaker cabling can't be THX rooms! It's crap like that which makes the brand meaningless.  |  IP: Logged Scott Jentsch Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1061 From: New Berlin, WI, USA Registered: Apr 2003 posted 04-15-2008 09:23 AM                        I don't understand the conclusion that since the THX brand appears on consumer equipment, that then the commercial applications are useless. Does the fact that the Dolby Digital logo appears on the crappy $29 DVD player at WalMart mean that Dolby Digital in the cinema is crap? When I wired my home theater (in-wall wiring, that is), I investigated using reels of standard CL-grade wiring vs. the Monster Cable THX-certified CL-rated variety from a local dealer. The cost differential wasn't that great, and I could buy only as much as I needed off the reel. The THX certification of cables gets into the ability of the cabling to be pulled through walls without stretching, binding, or failing from the strain, and the THX interconnects I've used have very good connectors on them. I was actually at the Chicago CES where Tomlinson Holman and Anthony Grimani were discussing whether they should consider certifying cabling. Even though I had nothing to contribute, I always appreciated their willingness to let me be a fly on the wall. I don't get into the oxygen-free, massage our electrons using mysterium glycosphate compounds, and other voodoo crap like that, but if you look past the over-active marketing by companies like Monster, they have a good product that, if chosen properly, isn't all that much of a price premium over the bargain bin stuff at monoprice.com. Personally, I welcome the news that THX is growing. The public needs a brand that they can use to distinguish one presentation from the next. The kicker, of course, is that the brand has to mean something, so one would hope that it's not just a marketing sticker, and that someone at THX is doing more than collecting a check in the mail.  |  IP: Logged Chris Slycord Film God Posts: 2986 From: 청주시, 경북도, South Korea Registered: Mar 2007 posted 04-15-2008 12:04 PM                     quote: Scott Jentsch I don't understand the conclusion that since the THX brand appears on consumer equipment, that then the commercial applications are useless. Does the fact that the Dolby Digital logo appears on the crappy $29 DVD player at WalMart mean that Dolby Digital in the cinema is crap? It has NOTHING to do with it being on consumer equipment and EVERYTHING to do with them being willing to put it on ANY AND ALL consumer equipment. Hell, my mom & dad sent me some games for my XBOX that they got used... one of them (Madden 2006) is a "THX Certified Game" which means the game is good? This kind of certification is meaningless to people. And the fact that Dolby Digital is similar in both cinema and DVDs makes your comparison useless.  |  IP: Logged David Stambaugh Film God Posts: 4021 From: Eugene, Oregon Registered: Jan 2002 posted 04-15-2008 12:33 PM                        quote: Chris Slycord "THX Certified Game" which means the game is good ? How did you draw that conclusion? THX Game Certification is related to technical game production issues. It has nothing to do with rating the game itself. I mean before you attack it, at least know what it is you're attacking. That's like saying a movie with a soundtrack produced under THX supervision has to automatically be a good movie. We all know that ain't the case. quote: THX sets standards for game development studio acoustics, background noise and lighting, providing developers a means to present a consistent visual and sound experience across a variety of game systems and consoles.  |  IP: Logged Chris Slycord Film God Posts: 2986 From: 청주시, 경북도, South Korea Registered: Mar 2007 posted 04-15-2008 01:56 PM                     Maybe I'm being cynical but I see it more as a way for THX to get $ than them definitively certifying that a game has better technical qualities compared to its competition. And honestly I didn't know what THX certification meant with respect to a game. But even knowing what it means now I still see it as a pretty meaningless distinction. Plus, if they're certifying content like this why are they only certifying cinema equipment and not the movies themselves?  |  IP: Logged Bobby Henderson "Ask me about Trajan." Posts: 10973 From: Lawton, OK, USA Registered: Apr 2001 posted 04-15-2008 02:38 PM                     What I find ultimately distasteful is the fact many ethics of business and quality control have stooped to such low levels that something like a certification process is even needed in the first place. Honestly, who really needs to deserve some sort of badge for just doing their damned job correctly? Can someone help me out with that? That's sort of like the Chris Rock joke where he rags on the comments of trashy people. A lady snaps a "Z" and boasts, "well, I raise my kids!" You're supposed to raise your kids! People are also supposed to do their damned jobs competently. Unfortunately, the sad fact of life is we live in a world where the preferred business model is doing things as cheap, half-assed and lacking in effort as possible. And that anti-ethic is pushed into the negative as far as possible before customers get pissed off enough to switch brands. Enter the need of having a third party look over the shoulders of a business to make sure they're delivering a satisfactory product. That's sort of what THX has meant to movie theaters, and as of late, digital video transfers to Laserdisc and DVD (haven't seen any THX certified Blu-ray discs yet). Again, THX itself is a business and is a business Creative Labs purchased from George Lucas. Does Lucas still have some stake in the company? Business interests of pleasing stock holders often run counter to the interest of maintaining high quality, even if the company (THX) is all about enforcing certain standards of quality over various aspects of how movies are produced and presented to viewers. In the end, the THX brand has definitely suffered from some cheapening by the increased variety of consumer products carrying its logo (all the way down to computer speakers), not to mention the fact some THX movie theaters really aren't all that great. It's just too bad that great picture and sound quality is not a mission critical item for commercial movie theaters in general. The very need for an organization like THX just confirms the industry's guilt in that regard.  |  IP: Logged John Walsh Film God Posts: 2490 From: Connecticut, USA, Earth, Milky Way Registered: Oct 1999 posted 04-15-2008 07:40 PM                     THX is a good idea, but they get their money from the same people they are supposed to be overseeing. This means owners who falsify certs and don't keep up the equipment. It just can't work.  |  IP: Logged Frank Angel Film God Posts: 5305 From: Brooklyn NY USA Registered: Dec 1999 posted 04-15-2008 09:36 PM                        Speaker cables are speaker cables. What parameters are THX certifying in consumer speaker cables that's any different than speaker cables in a theatre? That 12 awg gauge is actually 12 awg? My point is, if THX's claim is that it is necessary to certify speaker cable to meet whatever criteria THX thinks qualifies it for a certain level of quality, then it follows that it should be equally necessary for the speaker cables that are to be used in a fully THX level system to meet that same level of THX benchmark quality. How come theatre that are supposed to be THX certified get a pass on their cables? I am pushing this to the absurd because I think certifying speaker cable is a joke to begin with and nothing more than diluting the THX concept and ripping off the consumer. If THX truly believes it is possible for the consumer to get his hands on some sort of crap quality cable, then it is also possible for the theatre installer to get the same crap quality cable. Or does THX say, yah, but the theatre installer would never install crap cable so we don't have to look at that? Either there is some compelling reason why speaker cable needs to meet some level of quality and therefore it's a legitimate issue for THX certification, or it doesn't. If it really is an issue, then a THX theatre should have everything including its cables THX certified. If it ISN'T an issue, then branding consumer cable as THX in this instance is nothing more than a pathetic business scam. They can't have it both ways.  |  IP: Logged

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