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Author Topic: Speakers on an open stage. Louis Bornwasser Film God Posts: 4441 From: prospect ky usa Registered: Mar 2005 posted 04-13-2009 09:17 AM                        Anything you do will help some. Even my portable swing open "wings", while not perfect, made a big difference. I agree there is no reason to side baffle the horn. The goal is stiffness and mass; in fact, authentic 18th century cemetery markers are "the best." (lol) Louis  |  IP: Logged Marco Giustini Film God Posts: 2713 From: Reading, UK Registered: Nov 2007 posted 04-13-2009 01:45 PM                     quote: The wings only need to be next to the woofers, not the horn. The curtains you hang will easily solve your early reflections/ bounce from the screen issues, so the 8ft tall wings are are a waste of time I don't agree. Perhaps the wood baffle is not necessary but I would add some fiberglass (or similar) around the horns. If you have a big stage behind the speakers, I believe that curtains are not enough to stop the reflections. In the theatre you saw in the photo I uploaded, there is a curtain at the end of the stage, with some sound dampener (made by wood, not so efficient) at the very back wall. However the wings you saw dropped A LOT sound reflections that were coming from the back wall.  |  IP: Logged Scott McGuire Film Handler Posts: 94 From: Elmira, NY/United States Registered: Oct 2007 posted 04-15-2009 12:45 AM                     Have you tried bringing in the accoustic shell? That would send the sound out rather than having a curtain that would absorb it. You could also fly the speakers on a line that has borders or legs on them. I guess it depends on how fast your change over needs to go.  |  IP: Logged Randy Stankey Film God Posts: 6539 From: Erie, Pennsylvania Registered: Jun 99 posted 04-15-2009 01:10 AM                     Yes, we have a Wenger acoustic shell. I have tried it and it does work. The problem is that it is all white. It sticks out like a sore thumb behind the screen. I can't paint it or cover it. It needs to be white for use in concerts. It is also true that my idea for the fold-out wings (or shell, if you will) was derived from that. The Wenger shells are made from welded steel frames and they are faced with what looks like Masonite with Formica cemented to the front. They are only about 1/4 inch thick. They are 4 feet wide and about 16 feet tall. There are two big, heavy concrete blocks in the bases to weight them down and keep them from falling over. They lock together with hasps and turnbuckles. I really would LOVE to fly this wall I am thinking of but we just don't have the linesets to do it. They have to be portable enough that one or two people can do the job by themselves. We don't have a lot of room back stage to store the speakers, the current orchestra shells plus this new shell for the movies. The carts I currently use are made so the horns nest together like Dixie Cups. You push them up against the wall, facing sideways and they all stack together really nicely. My whole idea is based on these principles. It has to reflect the sound. It has to be portable. It has to be stored in the scene shop after use. Although I am have pretty much settled on the overall design I am still tweaking things, even as we speak. (Write.) Nothing is decided for certain until I start cutting wood. Even then there's still room for improvements.  |  IP: Logged Scott McGuire Film Handler Posts: 94 From: Elmira, NY/United States Registered: Oct 2007 posted 04-15-2009 01:34 AM                     What about blue foam insulation rather than fiber glass, or even the osb all together?  |  IP: Logged Randy Stankey Film God Posts: 6539 From: Erie, Pennsylvania Registered: Jun 99 posted 04-15-2009 02:30 AM                     You mean attach blue board to the faces of the wings? I can do that but it doesn't take paint very well. It will take latex if you roll it on but it will scratch off very easily. Do NOT try to paint it with petroleum based spray paint! (Ask me how I know this! ) At this point I am thinking of just painting the OSB black then coming up with an idea afterward. I might be able to staple some polyester batting on the front then cover that with black Duvetyne. Too bad I can't get a whole bunch of those old paper egg cartons and staple them up there with a staple gun...  |  IP: Logged Randy Stankey Film God Posts: 6539 From: Erie, Pennsylvania Registered: Jun 99 posted 04-16-2009 10:12 PM                     Here's an update on the project. Had a meeting on the subject of sound system upgrades. I got a favorable verdict. We're probably going to go ahead with this by summer after school lets out. But there are likely to be some changes: We're thinking about moving the screen downstage by one lineset. (Approx. 16 inches.) We'll consolodate the masking on that downstage lineset onto the screen frame so only one lineset is used. The empty lineset will be used to fly the baffle. We are thinking about making a welded frame out of square tubular steel then facing it with either OSB or plywood. We'll probably get an upgrade to the rest of the sound system too. They are planning to upgrade the sound system in the entire hall. I'm trying to get them to buy a new cinema processor while they are at it. I'm looking at the Ultra-Stereo JSD-80. More on that when I get more info.  |  IP: Logged Elia Orselli Film Handler Posts: 42 From: Imola, Bologna, Italy Registered: Feb 2008 posted 04-21-2009 12:33 PM                        I read this topic and I have some questions: 1) Marco says that there's another topic about wings but I can't find it. Can somebody tell me the name of this topic? 2) I was going to build the wings for my theatre because we have the same problem: the stage is used for conferences and we are a no-profit association and we haven't a lot of money. What is the minimum width for the wings? I have KCS 2000 series speakers Thanks for all the replies. Elia Orselli  |  IP: Logged Randy Stankey Film God Posts: 6539 From: Erie, Pennsylvania Registered: Jun 99 posted 05-08-2009 08:07 PM                     Elia, According to my design, the baffles will extend 4 feet. (1.2 meters) from each side of the speakers. The speakers are almost exactly 8 feet apart. If I rearrange them just a little bit I will have a wall that is approximately 33 feet (10 meters) long with the speakers arranged at equal intervals along the wall. There will be 4 feet of wall extending past the outer speakers. Our screen is 31 feet wide. Therefore, the wall will extend about a foot past the screen on either side. Update on our plans to build our wall: We have been having some discussions and it looks like we might be able to fly the wall after all! With a little creative rearrangement we will be able to weld the frame out of square, tubular steel and cover it with 1/2 inch OSB. It will be made in 4 foot by 12 foot sections. We'll suspend it on chains, attached to the pipe with batten clamps. If we ever need to use the line for anything else, we will be able to unhang the wall and stow them back stage. I think this will be a much better arrangement than the collapsable panels attached to the cart. I just won't be able to make such cool 3-D animations to explain it.  |  IP: Logged Elia Orselli Film Handler Posts: 42 From: Imola, Bologna, Italy Registered: Feb 2008 posted 05-09-2009 03:07 AM                        Randy, thanks for the infos. Unluckily I can't fly an entire wall, but I hope the wings will help the sound system in reproducing low frequencies. Bye, Elia  |  IP: Logged Gordon Bachlund Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 696 From: Monrovia, CA, USA Registered: Aug 1999 posted 05-09-2009 12:40 PM                        A long, long time ago I worked in theatre with stage house. Happily it sported a motor operated main drape and a motor-operated title curtain, with the screen hung the next pipe back. The speakers were behind the screen and quite close to it. Behind the speakers, hung on the next pipe, was a heavy wool felt blanket that served as the baffle wall. One could walk around backstage during a film and hear only little of the film sound, while, in the house it was playing at a comfortable level. I would guess the speaker installation date to have been in the late 1940s, certainly "old tech" but a quite satisfactory solution to the problem.  |  IP: Logged

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