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Author Topic: Indian prints are weird Christian Appelt Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 505 From: Frankfurt, Germany Registered: Dec 2001 posted 07-06-2010 01:39 PM                     Years ago, I had to handle a lot of Indian movies. We ran them single reel changeover, and most were old titles from the 1960s and 1970s, mostly art films, not the singin' in the rain stuff. All black&white prints were acetate and usually dripping wet with oil. I couldn't imagine why, because even numerous runs through leaky projectors would not have left that much oil. Later I talked to an film archive guy from India, and he explained it to me. He said that in India many films were run in 2000ft. changeover operation on projectors and reels in extremely bad condition. To keep acetate prints from being ripped apart by warped reel flanges and gates with maladjusted tension, some projectionists used to spread some oil on the side of each roll of film before they wound it on reels. Even if the warped flange hit the film, the stock was so slippery and soft that it would not tear. Of course the oil didn't stop at the edges, it spread all over and took away a lot of light in projection. I never saw darker b&w projection although we had a small screen and more than adequate lamp power! A few times the first half of a single reel left so much oil in the gate that we had to stop and clean because the image got so jumpy. Cleaning the prints before projection was impossible because they often arrived last minute. The only good thing about the oil was that it seemed to fill the base scratches at reel ends - India''s traditional FilmGuard (Ayurveda style)?  |  IP: Logged Geena Phillips Expert Film Handler Posts: 198 From: Norcross, GA / USA Registered: Apr 2006 posted 08-10-2010 08:02 PM                        quote: Mike Spaeth I got a print in a duffel bag once. Apparently someone accompanied the print from india, and just took the film (on cores) tossed them in a duffel bag and carried it on the flight. Gets better, Mike. That print sat downstairs at the theatre for hours, because no one realized it had arrived (what with it being IN A BAG and all). On the other hand: Totally sweet duffel bag. Seriously.  |  IP: Logged Jim Cassedy Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1661 From: San Francisco, CA Registered: Dec 2006 posted 08-11-2010 11:05 PM                     quote: Mike Spaeth I got a print in a duffel bag once. This isn't quite a duffel bag, but not far from it. I get a lot of prints from labs in China shipped this way. This one arrived just the other day. The film is on cores in cans stacked inside the canvas bag. It actually works pretty well, although I've gotten a couple of shipments where the cans were pretty banged up.  |  IP: Logged Galen Murphy-Fahlgren Master Film Handler Posts: 405 From: Canton, MI, USA Registered: Oct 2007 posted 08-12-2010 09:47 AM                     Jim, I had quite a few movies come that way. It is far better than many of the ways Indian prints often go. Geena, that is nothing compared to the print that I got in a suitcase, out of the reel cans, no taped ends, missing several cores. The heads and tails were laying in the bottom of the suitcase, and the "reels" were hacked off somewhere in the middle of what were supposed to be the actual reels. Some were heads up, some were tails up. It was supposed to play three or five shows over a weekend and get sent out. I spent most of my time that weekend getting it sorted out, and finally got it built by the last show, which I think no one showed up for. I did confirm that it was built correctly and break it down to at least some kind of standard, what with reel cans, heads and tails marked with what reel it was supposed to be, and a burlap box. If anyone ever sees a south Indian print in reel cans that have the original labels covered in masking tape and the pertinent information scrawled in handwriting that resembles that of an illiterate vagrant, throw it off the roof for me. I would have myself, but I put too much effort into getting it on screen.  |  IP: Logged Joe Redifer You need a beating today Posts: 12859 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: May 99 posted 08-12-2010 01:26 PM                        I doubt anyone will see that print again. Once they have played for a few days they are pretty much worthless and end up getting junked by whoever is in possession of them. There are a few rare exceptions to that rule, but the key word there is "rare".  |  IP: Logged James Westbrook Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1133 From: Lubbock, Texas, Usa Registered: Mar 2006 posted 08-12-2010 02:33 PM                     I tore down our print of Kites on the rewind bench, putting the reels back on cores, putting the reels back into their individual cans, back into that burlap container. We contact our film booker as to whom to contact regarding shipping the print back. "Just chunk it into the dumpster."  |  IP: Logged Galen Murphy-Fahlgren Master Film Handler Posts: 405 From: Canton, MI, USA Registered: Oct 2007 posted 08-13-2010 09:12 AM                     Joe, this was one of those super tiny releases with one or two prints circulating for a bit. That theater generally got new prints for anything sizable. James, that is surprisingly refreshing.  |  IP: Logged Jason Metcalfe Expert Film Handler Posts: 134 From: Austin, TX, U.S. Registered: May 2010 posted 08-13-2010 01:49 PM                     quote: Randy Stankey It took a few minutes to realize that I wasn't experiencing some strange form of Deja Vu. It took a few minutes to realize that I wasn't experiencing some strange form of Deja Vu. I see what you did there. Oh yeah and Indian prints suck, why do Asian prints always smell of sewage?  |  IP: Logged Jim Cassedy Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1661 From: San Francisco, CA Registered: Dec 2006 posted 08-25-2010 09:58 AM                     quote: F. Hudson Miller Until the late 1990s all films made in Hollywood were cut and mixed on 1000 reels. After the final mix the sound stems (dia, fx, mx masters) were spliced together into A/B reels or Big Reels. Several years ago, I was running a brand new direct-from-the-lab print of "Birdman Of Alcatraz". Since this was a new print, which arrived at the last minute, I didn't pay much attention when spooling it from the lab cores onto house reels, other than to make sure I had cue marks, since I was running change-overs. Midway through the first reel, as I had my back to the screen inspecting another print, I thought I saw flashes of light reflecting off the port-hole onto the booth wall. But I turned around and everything was OK. During the 2nd reel, I saw this again, and I turned around just in time to realize that the print I had was printed up from 1000ft 'editorial' reels, and for some reason the lab had not removed all the "TAIL:PART 1A - CUT HERE - HEAD:PART 1B- {COUNTDOWN}" leadercrap between the "A" & "B" sections. I already had reel 3 threaded up, but I pulled it off the projector and found it was the same way. After making the necessary cuts just in time to re-thread & do the change-over, I went checked and found ALL the reels have been printed this way. When I later informed the distributer of this, they were pretty pissed since they had paid the lab an extra fee to remove all the inter-reel heads & tails, which they apparantly had not done.  |  IP: Logged Stephen Furley Film God Posts: 3059 From: Coulsdon, Croydon, England Registered: May 2002 posted 08-25-2010 12:05 PM                     I ran an Indian film a few years ago which came on 1000 foot reels; it was a recent film, not an old one. All of the reels, except the last, were just about the same length, so the changeovers came just about every 1000 feet, even if that was in the middle of a scene.  |  IP: Logged Jim Cassedy Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1661 From: San Francisco, CA Registered: Dec 2006 posted 08-28-2010 10:26 AM                     The biggest problem I've been having lately with prints from foreign (excluding Canada & Hong Kong)labs is a lack of consistant frame line position between reels of the same print that are printed on different printers. This causes one or more of the reels to be slightly "out of frame" when the assembled print is shown. (WARNING: MY USUAL ANTI-PLATTER RANT AHEAD! ) Of course this is no problem when I run changeovers, since I can mark the frame knob with tape so that I can frame each reel as required, but on platters, it often results in having to find a 'compromise' framing position which often cuts off tops of heads or else still leaves a visible frame line on some reels if no universal compromise framing position can be found. (Of course, as far as I'm concerned, EVERY platter show I run is a compromise, but I'll save that for another rant!) I recently had a print of an excellent German film with one reel printed slightly out of frame. It really bothered me. Due to running multiple screens, it would be impossible for me to run to the booth to re-frame twice during each show so that the frame line wouldn't be visibile on screen. The picture was SCOPE, so there was no 'wiggle room" with the framing as there might be on a flat print. We couldn't get a replacement reel or print. Since it was only one reel that was bad, I cut an extremely thin strip of aluminium I found in my junk drawer to make a "mask" for the (Century)aperture plate. This actually worked without cutting off either subtitles or tops of heads on the 'good' reels and perfectly hid the annoying visible frame line on the 'bad' reel. If you try this, the metal strip needs to be extremely thin, or you'll have trouble getting your ap plate in. One end is bent around the edge of the aperture plate, and the rest held in place by friction once it's shoved into the projector.  |  IP: Logged Peter Das Film Handler Posts: 50 From: India Registered: Feb 2008 posted 08-28-2010 10:38 AM                     Does anybody wants to get rid of these Indian films let me know and I am glad to pay shipping costs to send to me. you can ship them to our buffalo, NY office. Thank you  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 08-28-2010 07:19 PM                     I am curious...if you run 35PA and pull your masking away...can you see the .690 line? How about any thing beyond that? I too often see plates over cut...the MAXIMUM projectable image is .690 x .825 (for scope)..that means anything beyond that (including what might fall on the masking) is over cut. Many folks mask to the lines perfectly, then cut their plates to eliminate the fringe of the aperture...which, by definition, overcuts the plate.  |  IP: Logged Joseph Pandolfi Expert Film Handler Posts: 213 From: Milford, CT. Registered: Nov 1999 posted 09-13-2010 08:16 PM                     Before you go and chuck that Bollywood print in the dumpster. You might want to contact the Film Librarian at Yale University I have to not mention his name on this site, but he is always on the lookout for used Bollywood movies. He is the master projection at the Whitney Humanities center and is well known in the preservation of classic 35mm archival prints that Yale owns.  |  IP: Logged Joe Redifer You need a beating today Posts: 12859 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: May 99 posted 09-13-2010 10:24 PM                        The problem is that preparing them for shipping and all of that is a huge bother, much easier to trash 'em.  |  IP: Logged

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