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Author Topic: What are you wearing...when you change Xenon lamps. Gordon McLeod Film God Posts: 9532 From: Toronto Ontario Canada Registered: Jun 99 posted 02-08-2012 07:08 PM                     Tony i disagree especially on the Barco lamphouse modules the soft material of the stud I have seen many that have been sheared off by overtightening  |  IP: Logged Manny Knowles "What are these things and WHY are they BLUE???" Posts: 4247 From: Bloomington, IN, USA Registered: Feb 2002 posted 02-08-2012 07:09 PM                     Tony, Tony, Tony - I was personally instructed by our projector manufacturers (Sony and Barco) to adhere to their torque specifications. (Evidently, there is also an electrical code 110.3(B) that mandates adherence to manufacturer's specified torque requirements.) It may be overkill, but it's in my nature to heed this kind of instruction. As my piano instructor used to say: "Practice makes permanent. Perfect practice makes perfect." BTW, if anyone's interested: Those Tohnichi drivers are exactly what Barco has in their training lab.  |  IP: Logged Tony Bandiera Jr Film God Posts: 3067 From: Moreland Idaho Registered: Apr 2004 posted 02-09-2012 12:22 PM                     Gordon: I have not had to work on any Barcos yet, so what I said still applies to virtually ALL film lamphouses. And I didn't say EVERY lamphouse, I said this: quote: ME I speak from over thirty years of tech experience on virtually every lamphouse ever made. There is some room for omissions there. And note that the Christie doesn't have a torque requirement, 'cuz they are smart. IMHO, requiring any kind of speciality tool for something as simple as a lamp change is a piss-poor design decision...(remember the security bolts on the Super Lumex lamphouses? 99% of the theatres I serviced replaced those stupid things with regular screws)...and yes I include torque wrenches in that category. Unless the manufacturer is going to provide the torque wrench and fitting with the machine, they are making a dumb mistake. And in the heat of battle with a blown lamp and a full house, do you really think the average bulb change monkey is gonna take the extra time to dig up a torque wrench to tighten the lugs? All that said, I do concede that like Barco, there are likely D-Cinema lamps that have torque requirements that I have not yet encountered. Still maintain it's a stupid design though. And Manny, you have my condolences on being stuck with those Four-Letter S-word abortions.  |  IP: Logged Gordon McLeod Film God Posts: 9532 From: Toronto Ontario Canada Registered: Jun 99 posted 02-09-2012 01:20 PM                     Also fastening the DMD in chrisities requires a torque driver  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 02-09-2012 02:57 PM                     Tony, you know not what you speak. Liability requires a torque specification. One can not say to merely "tighten" something. If it burns up one may be tempted to say it was not tight enough but there is no proof as to the source of failure at that point. If you provide a torque specification, it takes the "user" out of the equation. If you, me or a noobie tighten something to the specified torque, then the job quality is identical. The fact of the matter is that there are differing levels of capability out there. Some have a feel for mechanical things and some do not...even worse, some think they do but don't. A manufacturer has an obligation to provide a torque specification for each such connection. This is particularly true if being outside of the range can cause a failure. -Steve  |  IP: Logged Graham Ritchie Film Handler Posts: 54 From: Christchurch, New Zealand Registered: Apr 2009 posted 02-09-2012 03:00 PM                     Hi Tony When that lamp exploded as shown, the lamp had just been switched off for the night and had run around twelve hours without any problems that day. It had been off for only, at a guess for less than a few minutes when it exploded. The extracter fan is on a timer and the small fan at the rear of the lamphouse was all running. The lamp pressure would still be very high but dropping and I still cant figure out to this day why it blew when it did when at the time was cooling down. We did have an accident a few years ago, when late at night the projectionist was sorting out the old used lamps, anyway one accidentally hit the deck and exploded. I got a call from the cashier saying the projectionist was at the hospital. He had been wearing a face shield but nothing else and a piece of glass had hit him on the hand. I came to work the next day and found what was left of the lamp and "blood". When I cleaned up I found to my surprise two larger bits of glass about 30 feet away. I am not sure of the kind of velocity for them to travel that far, but I am glad I was not in the way of it. When I did catch up with him I told him to go and buy a "Lotto" Million dollar ticket as it must be his "lucky day" as if any of those bits had hit him on the neck it could have been a different story. Graham.  |  IP: Logged Tony Bandiera Jr Film God Posts: 3067 From: Moreland Idaho Registered: Apr 2004 posted 02-11-2012 02:27 PM                     Steve-o: I know of what I speak, for the longest time there were NO torque specifications for connections/lugs on MOST lamphouses. Now of course with everyone so worried about liability SOME manufacturers are now specifying torque values, which in many cases is a good thing. The CP-2210 I just installed does NOT specify torque values for the lamp lead or cathode end clamp. You are 100% correct in that many folks have no mechanical ability or ability to judge torque values. I am NOT one of them. I generally can consistently torque fasteners to the same value without difficulty, and testing with a torque wrench has proven to me that with a few test runs I can get to a SPECIFIC torque value consistently. That said, if the manufacturer does indeed specify a torque value, it is wise to follow that spec to avoid warranty/liability issues. Otherwise, with no spec, just make sure the leads are "gutentight". Graham: Understand I am not trying to dismiss or undermine your posts and the point you're making, but sir you are talking apples and oranges here. You had an incident with a bulb that was hot and in cooldown mode, whereas we are talking about installing a bulb that is at room temperature, which is a whole different ballgame. (BTW, the reason your bulb failed when it did has a very simple explanation: the thermal stresses in the bulb found the weak point as it was cooling down, thus causing the boom. Remember that the air is essentially being blown over one end of the bulb, not in an even layer over the entire bulb. Thus you have one end getting cooled off faster than the middle or other end.) I will be the last person to ever tell anyone that a Xenon bulb is NOT dangerous, even when cold. But, in the total overall "carnage" factor, a cold bulb will cause less damage than a hot or warm one as the pressure rises considerably when it is hot or even warm. (And of course there is the added risk of HOT glass or metal causing burns in addition to cuts and lacerations.) Bottom line is, cold or not, new or old, when handling a Xenon bulb of any size or type, one should wear the full protective gear. That some of us do not (myself included) means we have assessed and accepted the risks involved.  |  IP: Logged Graham Ritchie Film Handler Posts: 54 From: Christchurch, New Zealand Registered: Apr 2009 posted 02-11-2012 08:57 PM                     Thanks Tony for the explanation regarding the lamp, even though all the bits "what was left" was sent back to Osram we never did get a report back from them on the "why" that lamp blew. Graham.  |  IP: Logged Monte L Fullmer Film God Posts: 8367 From: Nampa, Idaho, USA Registered: Nov 2004 posted 02-11-2012 09:14 PM                     quote: Tony Bandiera Jr ... means we have assessed and accepted the risks involved. Of all of the hundreds of bulbs that I've changed - from 1Kw to 6Kw bulbs in size - I still sweat and get nervous while doing the change (and some with tonnage of hours on then and seeing devitrification lines in them, which knowing that these things can pop just by looking at them) on knowing that I must have absolutely full respect for one of these units. A grenade with the pin pulled is what you have in your hands - just don't squeeze the lever... That one YouTube video that we've all seen with that kid pulling a Osram bulb away from the foam "Philips/LTI" insert and then it popped on them, I always wonder on how would that have popped just being pulled slowly...  |  IP: Logged

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