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Author Topic: CP200 - trouble getting signal thru Sam D. Chavez Film God Posts: 2153 From: Martinez, CA USA Registered: Aug 2003 posted 07-05-2012 06:00 PM                       Steve is talking about 5 full frequency front channel mixes as in L, Le, C, Re, R. Not too many of those around. but... As to the 778, you are not crazy, they are mainly for dubbing theatres where the output of the 650/778 feeds the console.  |  IP: Logged Robert Minichino Master Film Handler Posts: 350 From: Haskell, NJ, USA Registered: Dec 2005 posted 07-05-2012 07:17 PM                        I assume you also lose volume control with the 778?  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 07-05-2012 09:09 PM                     You would assume wrong. The only thing that changes on the output is that it is digital, not analog. In terms of 70mm movies that are still being printed occasionally, 5-across is at least 50% of what I'm finding. The bulk of the format 42 movies were just blow-ups of 35s and not likely to have much more life in 70mm aside from any prints that may still exist.  |  IP: Logged Brad Miller Administrator Posts: 17775 From: Plano, TX (36.2 miles NW of Rockwall) Registered: May 99 posted 07-06-2012 12:10 AM                     So since everything up to 1983 in 70mm is faded, what is the 5 across percentage of 70mm films released in 1983 OR AFTER?  |  IP: Logged Sean Weitzel Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 619 From: Vacaville, CA (1790 miles west of Rockwall) Registered: Dec 1999 posted 07-06-2012 12:23 AM                     Were any of the mag 2001 prints struck in the mid 90's 5 screen channels?  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 07-06-2012 06:31 AM                     All but one version of the 2001 prints were 5-across. The vast majority of the 70mm movies running at the AFI's 70mm festival right now are 5-across (including 2001...which just played).  |  IP: Logged Jock Blakley Expert Film Handler Posts: 218 From: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia Registered: Oct 2011 posted 07-06-2012 11:02 AM                     We have a 1996 70mm of 2001 which I'm quite sure is Format 42... I'm going to have to check that now.  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 07-06-2012 12:09 PM                     NO 2001 prints are format 42! They are all format 40, 41 or a very special non-formatted (but I put it in as format 51) since it uses the 5.1 track layout where tracks 2 and 4 are Ls and Rs and track 6 is Subwoofer. It is a very dangerous print since if played improperly, it will put the subwoofer track out of the surrounds.  |  IP: Logged Jock Blakley Expert Film Handler Posts: 218 From: Melbourne, Victoria, Australia Registered: Oct 2011 posted 07-06-2012 06:51 PM                     Ooh, I see. I've never run it myself, but I think I'll be making some enquiries to check that we haven't been cocking it up for 18 years...  |  IP: Logged Louis Bornwasser Film God Posts: 4441 From: prospect ky usa Registered: Mar 2005 posted 07-06-2012 09:30 PM                        2001: original mix: ch 2 was a blend of 1 & 3; the same for 4. We routinely turned off 2 and 4, and reduced the "phasiness." (Very wide auditorium) Louis  |  IP: Logged Jim Henk Master Film Handler Posts: 364 From: San Diego, CA Registered: Feb 2006 posted 07-06-2012 10:10 PM                     Now Steve's original comments about 5 across make sense to me. It's been a surprise to me that not all 70 releases make use of the full five channels in front, that this was really only prevalent in the Todd/AO and some "Dolby Discrete 6 Track" days, and that 2 and 4 were often hijacked for other reasons. I really thought that the sound engineers always cobbled *something* together for those releases. But I've been reading more on the history of Dolby and other sound formats from way back till current. Old news to you guys, but I couldn't stop reading. Now it makes more sense when I read that the UXO/650 upgrade to the CP650XO "offers Le and Re support". At first I thought what the heck - wouldn't it all? I had to read through a lot of Dolby's website and a lot of other people's comments elsewhere, but I see now. I agree that the capability to have Le and Re is important. But I think the answer has to be to plan and budget for that later. I've seen people's 70 screening room pics, and know that a lot of people only have three channels behind the screen, and that's fine. I'll have all five. Eventually. I think it still has to be a 650. Just not the type to constantly have to tinker, I guess.  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 07-06-2012 10:53 PM                     Having run 2001 a bit myself...including in a rather wide (well the World Premier theatre for it)...we NEVER turned off LC/RC...never had the "phasiness" and LC/RC were extremely important to localizing the dialog. While I have played 2001 in 70mm without LC/RC (at the KB Cinema)...the results were not as good though since the mix does drape the dialog it isn't as devastating as other mixes, like for say Sound of Music.  |  IP: Logged Louis Bornwasser Film God Posts: 4441 From: prospect ky usa Registered: Mar 2005 posted 07-07-2012 10:22 PM                        A significant factor in all of this is what did they mix on. Prior to Dolby, there were not enough mixing rooms for stereo. Only one as I have been told for 5 across. The 4 track mixes were made in old mono rooms where the d/m/e (dialog/music/effects) recorders were repurposed to do l/c/r. Surround mixed later in mono. So, if one room is tied up working andgets delayed, then another mix goes into a lesser room. I know this is hard to believe with the money spent on modern stereo rooms, but cheapness persisted in the old days. Somewhere here I have a Dolby printed article about finding a proper room for original Star Wars. Louis  |  IP: Logged

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