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Topic: The demise of film... What have you heard?

Jay Glaus
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 123
From: Pittsburgh, PA USA
Registered: Dec 2010

posted 10-05-2013 12:12 AM

Thanks Brad that's not bad advice. There enough time to wait, but still keep (or try to keep) the fund up.

I've always thought about when it gets down to the nitty gritty as film is finally dying, main/big features you probably will still be able to get, but what do you do for second features? Only the big blockbusters would be available in 35, and after that who knows.

Peter, I've heard the exact same thing about trailers. It certainly slowed down, not quite as much as I had thought it would but I always think the worst so I can be surprised. [Smile]

They definitely don't put as many in as they used to, and its far and few between that they send you one seperate to add to a showing. They're saving the stock for movies apparently. I look at the trail mix trailer hard drives I get with the digital booths and I think I get maybe 1/8th of them on 35mm if I'm lucky.

It would be nice though if they all put a date out and said something like after March 1st 2014 there will no longer be 35mm prints. It may not be what everyone wants to hear, but at least we would all know.

J

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Scott Norwood
Film God

Posts: 8146
From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas)
Registered: Jun 99

posted 10-05-2013 05:58 AM

Back to animation: the weird thing is that, as far as I can tell, no one actually shoots animation on an animation stand anymore, at least not for anything with a budget. Even hand-drawn animation is now inked and painted on a computer and then output to film with a film recorder. This makes all the sense in the world from an economic and timing point of view, but I cannot help but think that something has been lost here.

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Buck Wilson
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 894
From: St. Joseph MO, USA
Registered: Sep 2010

posted 10-06-2013 12:18 PM

We've been planning on receiving prints through January at least here at our 35mm 2nd run 8 plex.

We'll see what happens.

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Terry Lynn-Stevens
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1081
From: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Registered: Dec 2012

posted 10-06-2013 02:04 PM

quote: Jay Glaus
I've always thought about when it gets down to the nitty gritty as film is finally dying, main/big features you probably will still be able to get, but what do you do for second features? Only the big blockbusters would be available in 35, and after that who knows.

I know two independent 35mm theaters in my area that still run film, both are having a very difficult time getting 35mm booked for new studio releases, both theaters have seen a significant decrease in attendance and studios will not give you a 35mm film print if they feel you will not make a decent gross.

Man of Steel was the last film to new open as a new release at one of the cinemas I am talking about, the gross was under $3000 for the entire three week run. Warner will not book them anything in 35mm.

The last article I read stated that studios were still making about 300 35mm for the North American market.

quote: Jay Glaus
It would be nice though if they all put a date out and said something like after March 1st 2014 there will no longer be 35mm prints.

I don't think film will be gone forever, the next Christopher Nolan film is rumored to open in a number of 35mm theaters across North American. There will be very rare, select titles released IMO.

If you asked me 10 year ago if I would ever see a 70MM presentation such as The Master, I would of said no way.

If you would of asked me 10 years ago if I would ever see a Hollywood film shot with 15/70 and projected in 15/70 like The Dark Knight, I would of said you were out of your mind.

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Lindsay Morris
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 233
From: Darlington, WA, Australia
Registered: Sep 2002

posted 10-06-2013 07:33 PM

Unlike Peter Howard I am having great difficulty in sourcing enough titles to fill out the summer film season. I can see that I will have to book some titles that I really could not squeeze in last summer to plug up the gaps in the program.
Being out on video does NOT have a seriously detrimental effect on my numbers as patrons are generally NOT the ones who rush off to every first screening to see stuff.
4 of my regular distributors told me in April this year that as of then NO MORE 35mm releases whatsoever...ONLY DCP and not even E Cinema stuff which many small indies went with due to costs. (I never bothered with E Cinema as screen size and throw a bit much for the gear then available.)

So apart from ONE smaller distributor who IS releasing odd 35mm copies I am back to booking from the bigger distributors who have seriously cut back on the type of film that the audience here want. Sadly they are not much of a help either.

Thus I cannot see myself going beyond this summer and thus after 18 years of really good fun times doing the summer seasons we will close.
So far have NOT found any digital conversion that would be cost effective and something that we could seriously take on.

Just dropped some rough quotes to go digital onto the "bean counter's" desk and I think he is still stuck up on the ceiling. [Roll Eyes]

Lindsay

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Leo Enticknap
Film God

Posts: 7474
From: Loma Linda, CA
Registered: Jul 2000

posted 10-06-2013 07:42 PM

quote: Terry Lynn-Stephens
There will be very rare, select titles released IMO.

If the demand for film stock and lab services once the conversion is essentially complete is sufficient to make it economically viable to continue the manufacture of all the raw materials and equipment needed for the small number of filmmakers who wish, and can afford to continue releasing titles on 35mm and 70mm for artistic reasons.

My gut feeling is that in the case of colour stock, that's a very big if. The chemistry of b/w is so much simpler and cheaper that IMO there's a better chance of it, plus lab services, continuing to be made at least into the medium-term future.

Remember - it's not just the stock we're talking about, but processing chemistry, printers, processors and all the support infrastructure for labs as well. As Robert Shanebrook's book points out, the cost of maintaining this capacity runs into hundreds of millions for Kodak, which (as far as I've been able to find out when I finished the research for my forthcoming book on film restoration, at the end of last year) is now the last remaining manufacturer of dye-coupler colour film emulsion in the world. So they're going to need to continue securing hundreds of millions of $$ in stock sales for colour film to stay viable. They are continuing to try to do that, and to market film pro-actively, notably with a recently-launched line of stocks designed specifically for use as archival preservation masters. But even with a look at rough, ballpark figures in the public domain, I fear, and would not be overly surprised, if the end of colour stock manufacture is announced within 3-5 years.

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Peter Howard
Film Handler

Posts: 44
From: Forster, NSW, Australia
Registered: Dec 2005

posted 10-17-2013 04:48 AM

We started the conversion of our final 2 screens today... bittersweet moment, but we've got enough portholes to leave the 35mm equipment installed for the time being which means that we'll have a mix of 35mm and 2K for as long as we can obtain 35mm.
Hey, we've got a hell of a lot of spares to try and get through!

Paramount have joined Fox in not supplying anymore 35mm trailers, and Roadshow / Warners have advised their last 35mm release in Australia will likely be The Hobbit 2. Paramount have advised their last 35mm releases in Australia will be Anchorman 2, and Jack Ryan.

It's happening now, and in a hurry. Looks like we're just going to sneak in under the guillotine.

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Terry Lynn-Stevens
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1081
From: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Registered: Dec 2012

posted 10-19-2013 04:31 PM

Peter, any word if the prints in your area are coming from the United States or another country?

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Buck Wilson
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 894
From: St. Joseph MO, USA
Registered: Sep 2010

posted 10-19-2013 04:40 PM

Print numbers are getting lower and lower.....

Last week we got "The Family" and "Riddick", print numbers 00002 and 00005. Scary stuff!!!

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Terry Lynn-Stevens
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1081
From: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
Registered: Dec 2012

posted 10-19-2013 05:33 PM

Riddick and The Family would likely get a very low release for the remaining 35mm theatres, I wonder what the print numbers of a movie like Gravity or Captain Phillips are? I heard 300 prints for North America is what they are currently making.

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Jason Metcalfe
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 134
From: Austin, TX, U.S.
Registered: May 2010

posted 10-20-2013 02:51 PM

Our print of Gravity is #124 so not too bad. On a side note, there are definitely some printing errors in the third reel, some pink splotches around a lab splice

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Lindsay Morris
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 233
From: Darlington, WA, Australia
Registered: Sep 2002

posted 10-22-2013 05:07 AM

Captain Phillips in OZ is coming on a mere handful of 35mm prints and I will have to wait a while to secure one.But will at least be able to run it. [Smile]

What is Gravity like on 35mm?? worth a shot screening it?? or is it only best in 3D.

As to prints being produced in OZ I am told that there are now NONE. ALL are imported from the USA.
Deluxe bought out Atlab in Sydney and closed down the 35mm printing facility and I believe only does DCP copies there now.

Lindsay

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Jarod Reddig
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 513
From: Hays, Ks
Registered: Jun 2011

posted 10-22-2013 07:23 PM

Gravity is one of those rare movies best seen in 3D IMHO.

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Peter Howard
Film Handler

Posts: 44
From: Forster, NSW, Australia
Registered: Dec 2005

posted 10-23-2013 02:02 AM

quote: Terry Lynn-Stevens
Peter, any word if the prints in your area are coming from the United States or another country?

Have all been coming from Thailand for quite some time now. Atlab Australia stopped doing prints locally about 18 months ago.

quote: Lindsay Morris
What is Gravity like on 35mm?? worth a shot screening it?? or is it only best in 3D.

We're screening it on 35mm.... it's ok, nothing to write home about, but I don't think it would be any better for us in 3D. No one's asking for us to screen it in 3D.

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