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Author Topic: Drive-In Projectors John Eickhof Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 588 From: Wendell, ID USA Registered: Jan 2000 posted 08-15-2014 01:26 PM                        I think it's purely a regional thing considering the individual supply dealers and available product. What I can recall, the norm was that whatever contractor did an indoor in town, the drive-in had the same brand. I would say that RCA-Brenkert was probably more prevailent as RCA had a rather large number of dealers and service reps. Motio could equal or beat RCA simply by cost to the end user and the machines were workhorses. As for sound, it was pretty hard to hurt an old Altec A-287W 275 watt amp, or the Ballantyne high power drive in amp, Motiograph did it with banks of MA-7505 amps (25w each) RCA would come in next with a good selection of high power amps. (75w and 150w) Of course I always preferred the RCA or Simplex soundheads over the Motio or Ballantyne. For me it's a toss up between Brenkert and Motio. Amazingly the Brenkerts could handle the largest lamps without a water cooled trap!  |  IP: Logged Mike Blakesley Film God Posts: 12767 From: Forsyth, Montana Registered: Jun 99 posted 08-15-2014 02:27 PM                        We used to to have Motiograph projectors, and the local drive in (different owner) had Brenkerts. We had Ashcraft lamphouses but I'm not sure what the drive in had -- I know they were different though.  |  IP: Logged Steve Matz Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 672 From: Billings, Montana, USA Registered: Sep 2003 posted 08-15-2014 02:29 PM                     RCA Supposedly owned BRENKERT since July 1945 but apparently kept the BRENKERT name when the BX60/62 came out in 1948. I don't know if that was RCA's choice or some contractial Deal made with BRENKERT when they Sold out. This RCA 100 or BX100 came along in 1950 and started carrying RCA Badges.This model was more prevalent in as many Drive-in's as I have past visited over the decades across the US; I have seen more of this Model than any other Brenkert(i.e. BX80,BX40,BX60) in the one's I visited; I remember our old SAGE Drive-in having these 100 Models... Another thing that is surprising because no one even mentioned it on this thread is how many Drive-ins had DEVRY 12000 Projectors. A lot;and they weren't just in the Illinois Area. I have a list from Devry showing Drive-ins in Kentucky,Ohio, Georgia,Indiana, and deep South States using DEVRY Equipment. The outdoor Theater Business didn't even really take off til after WWII. From 1933 to 1939 there were only a total of 18 Drive-ins across the US. And only one in California{Burbank) Before we entered the War in 1941 DI Theaters had grown to around 150 but because of Wartime Shortages,Rationing,etc. a number of theaters closed down for 2 yrs and more. So it wasn't until 1946 before things took off. So if you were opening a Drive-in in 1946 Your Projection Choices might be BRENKERT BX40,SIMPLEX E7,CENTURY C,MOTIOGRAPH AA,DEVRY 12000 or even a WENZEL ACE if your pinching pennies. I did find after a little Digging that a number of theaters like our MOTOR-VU Drive-in who built larger than Normal CINEMASCOPE Screens in 53/54 and had longer Projection Distances ditched their Simplex's Brenkerts,etc. for the MOTIOGRAPH AAA What is Ironic is the most popular Drive-in Projector Companies ended up all going out of business in the mid 1950's... The RCA 100 theorectically a Brenkert was a very popular projector in the 50's and on...  |  IP: Logged Sam D. Chavez Film God Posts: 2153 From: Martinez, CA USA Registered: Aug 2003 posted 08-15-2014 03:39 PM                       quote: Steve Matz I did find after a little Digging that a number of theaters like our MOTOR-VU Drive-in who built larger than Normal CINEMASCOPE Screens in 53/54 and had longer Projection Distances ditched their Simplex's Brenkerts,etc. for the MOTIOGRAPH AAA That must have been some salesman if he talked people out of perfectly good projectors to put in AAA's just for the 4 inch lens barrel. Why else would someone do this? Don't think this happened very often as there were not a lot of AAA's sold. I don't buy the idea Motiographs had more light throughput because of a barrell shutter. This style shutter(s) forced the use of lamphouses with slower reflectors. If someone can walk me through what I'm missing I'd listen.  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 08-15-2014 04:33 PM                     You're right Sam. By the time the 4" triple A's appeared the double drum shutter had long gone the way of the shiter. It was only via the double drum shutters that they could have been a little bit more efficient. The mess in gearing required and subsequent bearing failures killed that idea quickly. Then the troubles really started... the flicker issue caused by the single blade shutter and Rube Goldberg gear train was NEVER solved according to a late friend that worked for them. The AA shutter can be a pain to get out... especially the tapered shutter set screw that always gets baked into place under all the crud. In the end the AA and Triple A is what killed off Motiograph. They ended projector production first but were around for a few more years to supply parts for them and their sound systems. Then Wolk bought them at the fire sale. All in all the last models of Motiographs were piles of crap even though many ran well after the turn of the century. The economics of running crap that long simply doesn't make sense. I have a first year production Model K here and it is a far superior mechanism, much simpler, very robust and quiet running. The only draw back was flipping the back out to thread through the gate. The image out of the K is as good as anything out there. Mark  |  IP: Logged Steve Matz Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 672 From: Billings, Montana, USA Registered: Sep 2003 posted 08-15-2014 07:02 PM                     Here we go again;Reminds me of Ford & Chevy Lovers telling each other their Car is a Piece of $HIT. I could give a Rats A$$ about What Drive-in used what projector and for What Reason. It's all water under the Bridge now anyway because the Amount of Drive-in's left in the Country is Trivial.I'm simply trying to do some research on Something that probably isn't 100% because most of the people are dead that had any involvement in the Older Drive-in Movement... Every Projector Mfger had Good/Bad Points of every Model they produced. Did any of them make the Perfect Projector.NO! Just like Human Beings nobody's perfect by a Long Shot... As far as the MOTIO issue Goes...Talk that out with EICKHOF...  |  IP: Logged John Eickhof Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 588 From: Wendell, ID USA Registered: Jan 2000 posted 08-15-2014 10:59 PM                        I think Mike hit it on the head.. different owners would encourage competition amongst dealers, thus the drive in may not have wanted to have the same equipment as his indoor competitor! I can agree with Mark on the motios as for the shutter issues and the longer working distance lamps needed. I am amused that with a few exceptions, most RCA and Motio booths had giant old trashcan lamps (ashcraft) they were carbon hogs but tests in the 50s showed they beat the lumens of an equal sized Strong / National lamp! (Using same size sticks and current) Of course Simplex with it's ties to Strong & the National name seemed to always have excelites or mighty 90s they too used up carbon at a high rate! But the best drive in picture I have seen behind brenkerts was at the Roper Drive In Fallon NV. they had BX-60s air cooled with RCA Dynarc (Ashcraft Super High) running 95 amps on a motorgenny lighting up a 105ft wide picture! It looked like the picture was painted on the screen! Amazingly the film was not very warm to the touch coming out of the gate! I'm with Sam though when it comes to the best light transfer, you can't beat an XL with a 75 degree shutter and no visible ghost on the screen! The GoWest Drive In in Missoula had the best picture I've seen from an XL! Using Strong Mighty 90s it had a 120 ft picture and over 500 ft throw! The traps and lamps were water cooled though. They never heated up a print either! Probably the most destructive lamp in my opinion was the Xetron HX-4000 (xenon of course)if mis adjusted it would fry a print in one pass!I had serviced a couple drive ins in California that had Strong UHI (Ultra-High-Intensity, 175-195 amps) and they put out a lot of light as well as the Peerless HyCandescent condenser lamps, they were used in some of Hollywoods largest theatres. I remember the current minimizers and the loud pop when you would strike the 13.6mm and 9/16 sticks! I still contend the Motio was a good machine but it was priced to it's overall quality. The 4" lens may have been a selling point, but there were 4" lensholder kits for Simplex Standards, Supers, E-7s, as well as Wenzel and Ballantyne so it couldn't have been just the lenses. More likely a favorable package price for the install offered by the dealer! And of course the always vigilant money minded theatre owner!  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 08-16-2014 11:01 AM                     It's also interesting to note that even if a manufacturer was located in a certain metropolitan area as Motiograph was in Chicago that doesn't mean you're going to find a lot their projectors there. Chicago and surrounding area was predominately an RCA-Brenkert town with Simplex's Century's and Motio's sprinkled in here and there. John... There were still remains of the Roper DI last time I was in Fallon a couple years ago. Mark  |  IP: Logged Robert Koch Film Handler Posts: 93 From: Williams Ca USA Registered: Apr 2006 posted 08-16-2014 01:28 PM                     Mark: I installed the Roper D.I. in, I believe,1953.  |  IP: Logged John Eickhof Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 588 From: Wendell, ID USA Registered: Jan 2000 posted 08-16-2014 10:54 PM                        Hi Bob... I figured it was probably your doing!! The indoor had Motio Ks then BX-60s (You probably updated them about the same time) I took out the BX-60s years ago and placed XLs on 9030s in there.Still running them today. Mark, I was at Fallon a couple weeks ago visiting the Ericksons, the roper is all but gone now vandals have torn up the booth and snack bar and someone ?? made off with the three 75watt RCA amps I was looking for!!  |  IP: Logged Louis Bornwasser Film God Posts: 4441 From: prospect ky usa Registered: Mar 2005 posted 08-17-2014 07:22 AM                        We had a number of drive ins with Century C that went to Motiograph AA when the Super 135 was installed. A net increase in light, but a lot more when I went back to Century SA. Boy were they pi$$ed. Chicago: Remember, Brenkert was also made there.  |  IP: Logged Steve Matz Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 672 From: Billings, Montana, USA Registered: Sep 2003 posted 08-17-2014 11:44 AM                     BRENKERTS MFGed in both Detroit and Chicago  |  IP: Logged Donald Brown Expert Film Handler Posts: 131 From: Lincoln, DE Registered: Sep 2009 posted 10-22-2014 05:27 PM                     Did anyone ever operate or observe the Strong 170 Constellation? I had the opportunity to remove several of these from drive-in service nearly 25 years ago, but I never observed them in operation, and I have never encountered a pair since. Don Brown  |  IP: Logged Sam D. Chavez Film God Posts: 2153 From: Martinez, CA USA Registered: Aug 2003 posted 10-22-2014 10:48 PM                       I worked a couple of these. Basically, a better ventilated version of the Futura. Ran very smoothly with a nice controlled tail flame due I suppose to the penthouse fan. Power was via Hetrner transverter generator.  |  IP: Logged

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