Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Digital Storage Space

my profile | my password | search | faq & rules | forum home

»	Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE » Operations » Digital Cinema Forum » Digital Storage Space (Page 2)

This topic comprises 3 pages: 1 2 3

Author

Topic: Digital Storage Space

Matt Close
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 226
From: Hervey Bay, QLD, Australia
Registered: Sep 2001

posted 12-16-2004 05:00 AM

.....

well, yes ... neither the studios nor the distributors want to foot the bill ..... so we are safe for now..... but what worries me is that technology has a habit of becoming cheaper and cheaper..... and when it gets to a point where a cinema owner can see equipment paid for through just a few short years of not having to pay projection staff..... [Frown]

| IP: Logged

Matt Manalis
Film Handler

Posts: 27
From: Yamba, NSW, Australia
Registered: Apr 2004

posted 12-16-2004 05:18 PM

i hear where everyone is coming from now and i get the point of it is not going to make more money for anyone by saying we have got digital. but its the hype of something that gets people attracted like advertising a movie the more hype you give it the better the movies goes. so when DLP projection does come out the public will get the hype from it all and only want to see a movie in DLP. that is how i feel the public will take it. i was in the forum of digital cinema at the movie convention with you Dominic and some great ideas are floating around but as paul has said it is going to take alot longer to intoduce this new technology, because people hate change for some reason. i am all for DLP projection to some extent for the money saving side of things and all that but i hate the fact that when we go digital i will lose my job as a Projectionist and its a job that i love and hoped that i would be able to do forever but it won't happen. we also need a way to get the picture quality alot better the 2 screenings i have seen in DLP have been total crap and the difference is notciable but maybe not to the public eye. thanks for letting me give my opinion and i am not tryin to yell out or anything i just interested in how the introduction of DLP is goin in australia and the rest of the world!!!

| IP: Logged

Mattias Ohlson
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 180
From: Falun, Sweden
Registered: Mar 2003

posted 12-16-2004 05:44 PM

Do you know of what kind of bitrate we will be talking about for 4k files being displayed on 4k projectors? If 80Mbit/s is about it for 2k we should be looking at over 300Mbit/s when 4k arrives.

Why is it assumed that people will loose their job if dlp comes? I am sure there will always be a need for a projectionist as long as there will be projection. It is just that the job will change if projection changes.

| IP: Logged

Frank Angel
Film God

Posts: 5305
From: Brooklyn NY USA
Registered: Dec 1999

posted 12-19-2004 03:53 PM

Why is it that people assume that the reason some of us are not getting erections over the advent of video projection (which I emphatically do not believe is at all inevitable given the present untenable economic model) is because we are afraid we will loose our jobs? If you read most of the posts in the various threads here over the last few years, you will see that it is much more about the concern for degrading image quality, backward incompatibility, the real or imagined savings in dollars of print costs and finally, the ultimate question -- who is going to pay for this global transition from film to video. It is not, "I am against Deee-Cinema because I will loose my job."

To denigrate the discussion as some kind of a self-centered issue of job security for those who have serious reservations and misgivings about the wisdom of such a transition seems to me as a not so subtle way of negating legitimate concerns.

| IP: Logged

John Hawkinson
Film God

Posts: 2273
From: Cambridge, MA, USA
Registered: Feb 2002

posted 12-19-2004 04:18 PM

Pet peeve. [Mad]

One will "lose a job" or "loses a job."

To "loose" is "to turn loose," "to break lose," "to loose unto the winds," etc.

Thanks.

--jhawk

| IP: Logged

Mattias Ohlson
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 180
From: Falun, Sweden
Registered: Mar 2003

posted 12-20-2004 07:02 AM

I understand that digital presentations lose out to film presentations done right. If digital presentations are easier to get right then I am for it. If digital presentations are more prone to go wrong I am not as positive. One problem that I can think about with digital is color calibration can be off or not set correctly for a specific film.

| IP: Logged

John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 12-20-2004 08:30 AM

That's why Kodak believes Digital Cinema is much more than just the hardware:

http://www.kodak.com/go/dcinema

quote:
NETWORK-BASED SOLUTION BUILT ON LINUX PLATFORM WITH ALL SYSTEMS AND SERVICES:
Fully compliant with today's — and will be compliant with tomorrow's — evolving interoperability standards of DCI and SMPTE
Supporting a choice of projectors — up to 2K resolution today, with upgrade to 4K tomorrow
Driven by unique KODAK Software and supported by KODAK Service worldwide
NETWORK INTERFACES WITH:
Variety of in-cinema ticketing systems for presentation scheduling
Range of theatre "legacy" and other automation systems for fully coordinated customer presentation
Up to 30 screens in multiplex
WIDE-AREA NETWORK AND IN-CINEMA ETHERNET NETWORK HANDLE:
All scheduling information
Remote monitoring and diagnostics
Audit and verification reports
Distribution and staging of pre-show content
Automatic and efficient movement of content throughout cinema
Security management for feature presentations
CONTENT MANAGER WITH UNIQUE KODAK SOFTWARE:
Includes firewalls to protect integrity of ticketing system and screen content
Receives,stores,and stages key delivery messages from satellite and/or DSL
Schedules and stages show playlists to auditoriums
Serves as collection point for audit data
Includes localized language user interface
Generates show playlists with ads, trailers, and feature presentations
KODAK CINESERVER — "HEART OF THE KODAK SOLUTION" — SUPPORTS:
Content loading via hard disk drive, DVD-ROM, or CD-ROM
2048 x 1080/24P/25P/60i/50i
1920 x 1080/24P/25P/60i/50i
8-bit, MPEG2-encoded video today and upgradable to JPEG2000 tomorrow
Playback at up to 80 Mb/sec
SMPTE 292M video output with TI CINELINK System encryption
Eight digital and six analog channel audio
TI CINECANVASTechnology subtitling
AES 128-bit encryption
MXF packaging
Total storage of 200 GB of information — with mirrored drives for reliability
KODAK DIGITAL CINEMA SERVICES:
Handles all system monitoring
Serves as the customer's network operations center (NOC)
Prepares and distributes digital playlists and packages, including pre-show content
Distributes feature movies via hard disk drive or DVD-ROM today, with satellite distribution tomorrow
Handles digital rights management, including key delivery message (KDM) distribution
ANTI—PIRACY FEATURES:
All feature film content can be received in encrypted or non-encrypted form
KODAK System includes a certificate associated with an RSA public/private key pair
An equipment registration and installation location supplied to a central database managed by Kodak
ADDITIONAL KODAK SERVICES — THROUGH KODAK'S LASERPACIFIC SUBSIDIARY:
Complete end-to-end motion picture digital postproduction services
2K and 4K digital intermediates
LaserFilm recording services from digital intermediates
One-stop digital cinema mastering services, including:
Encoding
Encryption
Digital source master creation
Digital cinema distribution master packaging
...with full compatibility with KODAK CineServer
THE KODAK DIGITAL CINEMA SOLUTION FOR FEATURE PRESENTATIONS:
Easy to use
Right for your business
And available now

quote:
"We are committed to doing our part to help ensure that the digital projection technology of the future matches or exceeds the best possible image quality that exhibitors can present with 35 mm equipment," says Kodak Entertainment Imaging Division President Eric Rodli. "We believe that will ultimately require higher resolution digital projectors with a capacity for faithfully reproducing the full dynamic range of nuances in colors and contrast that today's films are capable of recording."

| IP: Logged

Frank Angel
Film God

Posts: 5305
From: Brooklyn NY USA
Registered: Dec 1999

posted 12-22-2004 10:30 PM

So John, if someone loses his job, hasn't his job been loosed to the winds? Hasn't he been cut loose? heh heh.

| IP: Logged

David Yauch
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 206
From: Mesa, AZ, USA
Registered: Oct 2004

posted 12-22-2004 11:29 PM

I wonder if it's going to be cheaper to pay projectionists full time or to pay for someone to maintain your digital projection system.

I'm thinking the projectionists are probably a tad cheaper.

| IP: Logged

Mattias Ohlson
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 180
From: Falun, Sweden
Registered: Mar 2003

posted 12-23-2004 06:59 AM

Spiderman 2 from SONY in 4k in january.
35TB uncompressed
It looks like they are going to play the uncompressed material. In normal distribution the same film will surely be 300-400GB thereabouts.

| IP: Logged

Stephen Jones
Master Film Handler

Posts: 314
From: Geelong Victoria Australia
Registered: Jun 99

posted 12-23-2004 06:28 PM

There are some interesting comments here Regarding DLP.As far as Australia goes I still think It will take some time before the change to digital starts to make any impact.The Industry here is allways cautious of new technology,I remember when Dolby first made an appearance it took years before majority of cinemas installed it and the same SRD and DTS,there are still places who have only just changed to SRD etc some havent converted to red led yet.A lot of owners here say if it aint broke dont fix it.As for DLP intalations it wont happen overnight,operators wont rip out excisting 35mm gear or put 1 DLP in as most are running on limited bugets and just make ends meet in some cases.Any multiplexes built around the introduction year of 2006
will most likely put a couple in as it would make sense as they waould allow for it in the budget if they dont run over cost as most usually do,but the excisting plexex wont change till the last minute so to speak its always been that way and always will and wont change.Film will se me out as it will most projectionist my age.For the record I do embrace new technology I find it exciting and DLP is no exception.
Steve [thumbsup]

| IP: Logged

John Pytlak
Film God

Posts: 9987
From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 12-23-2004 11:22 PM

quote: Mattias Ohlson
Spiderman 2 from SONY in 4k in january.
35TB uncompressed
It looks like they are going to play the uncompressed material. In normal distribution the same film will surely be 300-400GB thereabouts.

More details please. Where is it being shown on a 4K projector? Is this just a Sony demo, or a permanent theatre installation? Where did you get the 300-400 GB figure? Source? [Confused]

| IP: Logged

Paul Konen
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 981
From: Frisco, TX. (North of Dallas)
Registered: Jun 99

posted 12-24-2004 02:24 AM

Here is one of my titles that I am playing right now.

Oceans 12
Image - 51.5 GB
Audio - 6.5 GB

| IP: Logged

Mark Ogden
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 943
From: Little Falls, N.J.
Registered: Jun 99

posted 12-24-2004 03:20 AM

quote: John Pytlak
More details please. Where is it being shown on a 4K projector?

Sony Pictures will present a special invitation-only one time showing of Spiderman 2 on January 13th at 8:00pm at the Hollywood Pacific Theatre on Hollywood Blvd. The film will run uncompressed from a Silicon Graphics server (about 9.6TB) onto a Sony SXRD 4k projector, at a resolution of 4096 x 2160.

Announcement here.

| IP: Logged

Mattias Ohlson
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 180
From: Falun, Sweden
Registered: Mar 2003

posted 12-24-2004 05:44 AM

Mr Pytlak
My 300-400GB was more like a question. If I extrapolate the numbers for digital cinema today that are 50-80GB? That should give about 300GB or thereabouts.

There is a report about this by Hollywoodreporter. I also think that SGI might have some info about this. In a text where EFILM is talked about in relation to Spiderman 2 then 35TB was mantioned. 9.6TB does that seem "small" for uncompressed 4k.

| IP: Logged

All times are Central (GMT -6:00)

This topic comprises 3 pages: 1 2 3

Printer-friendly view of this topic

The Film-Tech Forums are designed for various members related to the cinema industry to express their opinions, viewpoints and testimonials on various products, services and events based upon speculation, personal knowledge and factual information through use, therefore all views represented here allow no liability upon the publishers of this web site and the owners of said views assume no liability for any ill will resulting from these postings. The posts made here are for educational as well as entertainment purposes and as such anyone viewing this portion of the website must accept these views as statements of the author of that opinion and agrees to release the authors from any and all liability.