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Author Topic: UPS for Projector Electronics
Mark Gulbrandsen
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From: Music City
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 - posted 07-04-2010 08:20 AM      Profile for Mark Gulbrandsen   Email Mark Gulbrandsen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Good point Tony!

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Josh Jones
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 - posted 07-05-2010 11:38 AM      Profile for Josh Jones   Author's Homepage   Email Josh Jones   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
It should also be noted that the UPS you intent to use needs to be large enough to run your intended loads. A video projector is a fairly large load, I would imagine at least 800 watts. Also note that UPS units are rated in VA, not watts. Chances are if you have a device you are trying to run with an uncorrected switching supply, its power consumption in watts is going to be larger than its VA consumption. In the example above, I would probably want a 1500VA ups to run the DVD player and projector.

JJ

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Mark Gulbrandsen
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From: Music City
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 - posted 07-05-2010 11:43 AM      Profile for Mark Gulbrandsen   Email Mark Gulbrandsen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
You would want to typically place the projector electronics(only),server, switch, 3-D system, and any other bare necessities on the UPS. Lamp power supply is still on regular AC. During a power bump or few second outage you would only loose the lamp for the duration of the outage. All my systems are installed this way and the recovery is virtually instantanious. The systems keep on going but you just loose the lamp.. as soon as power is back the lamp re-lights itself(if your prrojector allows that, some don't!). It is also possible to place a large enough UPS on the lamp power supply as well... it's only cost thats an issue there.

Mark

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Josh Jones
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 - posted 07-05-2010 12:17 PM      Profile for Josh Jones   Author's Homepage   Email Josh Jones   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Mark, I was referring to the small consumer unit Tony Ratcliff was using, not a full-blown DLP. I agree 100% that placing a commercial projector's lamp supply on UPS power is WAY overkill and likely no benefits would be had. As fragile as the consumer units are, I can't help but think it may help.

JJ

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Sam D. Chavez
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From: Martinez, CA USA
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 - posted 07-05-2010 05:20 PM      Profile for Sam D. Chavez   Author's Homepage     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
VA = Watts, no?

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Julio Roberto
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From: Madrid, Madrid, Spain
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 - posted 07-05-2010 05:38 PM      Profile for Julio Roberto     Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Seems the talk was of VA(=Volt Ampere) vs Watts

From wikipedia:

quote:
A volt-ampere (VA) is the unit used for the apparent power in an electrical circuit, equal to the product of root-mean-square (RMS) voltage and RMS current.[1] In direct current (DC) circuits, this product is equal to the real power (active power) in watts[2]. Volt-amperes are useful only in the context of alternating current (AC) circuits (sinusoidal voltages and currents of the same frequency).

Apparent power is the vector sum of real and reactive AC power vectors. While both the volt-ampere (abbreviated VA) and the watt have the dimension of energy, they do not have the same meaning. Some devices, including Uninterruptible Power Supplies (UPSs)], have ratings both for maximum VAs and maximum watts. The VA rating is limited by the maximum permissible current, and the watt rating by the power-handling capacity of the device. When a UPS powers equipment which presents a reactive load with a low power factor (e.g., a computer), neither limit may safely be exceeded.


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Robert Minichino
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 - posted 07-05-2010 06:44 PM      Profile for Robert Minichino   Author's Homepage   Email Robert Minichino   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Power consumption in watts is never higher than apparent power in VA. Power factor is the ratio between apparent power and actual power, and is from 0 (no power delivered) to 1 (VA = W).

UPS are measured in VA and W, and you need to make sure the UPS you buy has sufficient VA and W ratings for the equipment you'll be connecting to it. It's easier to find the W rating of equipment than VA, but if you can find the power factor you can divide the W rating by the power factor to get VA. The power factor will be abbreviated PF and be a number from 0.6 (bad) to
1 (perfect).

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Stephen Furley
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From: Coulsdon, Croydon, England
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 - posted 07-06-2010 02:32 AM      Profile for Stephen Furley   Email Stephen Furley   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I'm having problems with a large (by our standards) APC unit at the moment. it's a 16 kVA on line type, three phase in and single phase out. I find that APC tend not to be the easiest people to deal with, but I've now managed to get my problem into the hands of a lady at their European, not British, support centre who seems to be better.

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Tony Bandiera Jr
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From: Moreland Idaho
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 - posted 07-06-2010 01:48 PM      Profile for Tony Bandiera Jr   Email Tony Bandiera Jr   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Sadly Stephen, that seems to be the deal with APC anymore..unreliable products and crappy support..it all started when they were bought out by Schnieder Electric.

Before that, it was almost unheard of to have any problems with an APC..and if you did, they sent you an advance replacement and return shipping on the bad unit, all at no charge.

Tripp-lite is my new brand now.

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Jeremy Weigel
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From: Edmond, OK, USA
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 - posted 07-06-2010 06:47 PM      Profile for Jeremy Weigel   Email Jeremy Weigel   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Any one have experience with this Tripp-Lite Model? I have the opportunity to purchase a used pair of these at a really good price.

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Josh Jones
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From: Plano, TX
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 - posted 07-07-2010 02:28 PM      Profile for Josh Jones   Author's Homepage   Email Josh Jones   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
quote: Robert Minichino
Power consumption in watts is never higher than apparent power in VA. Power factor is the ratio between apparent power and actual power, and is from 0 (no power delivered) to 1 (VA = W).
Note paragraph 2 of the wiki.

quote:
Apparent power is the vector sum of real and reactive AC power vectors. While both the volt-ampere (abbreviated VA) and the watt have the dimension of energy, they do not have the same meaning. Some devices, including Uninterruptible Power Supplies (UPSs)], have ratings both for maximum VAs and maximum watts. The VA rating is limited by the maximum permissible current, and the watt rating by the power-handling capacity of the device. When a UPS powers equipment which presents a reactive load with a low power factor (e.g., a computer), neither limit may safely be exceeded.
The key word here is "apparent power", ie VA. Because of time domain relationships between voltage and current, a device with poor power factor will require more power to do the same amount of work than a comparable device with power factor correction. This is why those silly twister bulbs are only 2X as efficient as a comparable incandecent bulb, rather than the stated 4X. Their power factor sucks.

JJ

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Mark Gulbrandsen
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From: Music City
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 - posted 07-07-2010 04:03 PM      Profile for Mark Gulbrandsen   Email Mark Gulbrandsen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I always thought they should dispense with all that nonsense and just create an "Effeiiency Factor" rating...

Mark

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Tony Bandiera Jr
Film God

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From: Moreland Idaho
Registered: Apr 2004


 - posted 07-07-2010 05:05 PM      Profile for Tony Bandiera Jr   Email Tony Bandiera Jr   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Yeah right Mark [Roll Eyes] let them make up some ludicrous standard like the "power ratings" of automotive amplifiers. Remember the "300 watt per channel" in-dash stereos operating from 12vdc with no switch mode power supply?

Power factor is an established, measurable and hard-to-cheat measure of electrical efficiency.

A simple posting of the power factor on the package with the very simple explanation of range from 0-1 with higher being better will do the trick.

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