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Topic: Audio Processors for digital/35mm mix.

Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster

Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99

posted 10-23-2011 08:24 PM

When I heard the price of the AP-20 I didn't even bother to look. I have no doubt it is very good sounding but it had be for what it sells for! God help us all if we ever need 16 channels of audio in a mainstream movie theater... [Roll Eyes]

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Olivier Lemaire
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 118
From: Paris, Ile de France, France
Registered: Jan 2010

posted 10-23-2011 08:27 PM

quote: Pete Naples
Sadly not, he was definitely serious!

I suspecgt their sales bosses had not really looked at what the market will pay, thing is sadly, you only get one chance, and to pluck a number like that out of the air as your best price... You blew it.

hum... I understand.

Nevertheless, you should have a check now, DTS prices has been reviewed and are now more in phase with the market : AP-20 prices range around 5 K$USD now.

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Olivier Lemaire
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 118
From: Paris, Ile de France, France
Registered: Jan 2010

posted 10-23-2011 11:06 PM

quote: Mark Gulbrandsen

When I heard the price of the AP-20 I didn't even bother to look. I have no doubt it is very good sounding but it had be for what it sells for! God help us all if we ever need 16 channels of audio in a mainstream movie theater...

Well, it helps anyway: bi-amp, or 3-amp, filters... and for 500 $USD difference between 8 or 16 channel... could be an idea to be ready for more.

But I agree, for most screens, a CP750 or a 8 chan AP-20 are far sufficient, and range in the same price category - at least in Europe.

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Scott Norwood
Film God

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From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas)
Registered: Jun 99

posted 10-24-2011 07:46 PM

Why is it so important that everything be in one box? What is so terribly wrong with adding a DMA8 Plus or the Ultra-Stereo DA converter to your favorite cinema processor?

I recently saw the JSD-80, which is an interesting unit, but it looks as if setting it up with a DA20 would be doable, but not much fun.

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Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster

Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99

posted 10-24-2011 08:40 PM

You can certainly use existing analog stereo processors as long as they have 6 channals input. Seems like many of my customers want to retire theor 20 year old JS series Ultra Stereos though when digital is installed.

The JSD-80 is a great unit and uber reliable. I've never had one even so much as burp out of a gazillion installed units since it appeared many years back. I even have a location that has two USL DSP-60 digital processors still chugging along nicely. I am installing a bunch of JSD-100's over the next two weeks and one JSD-80 where the owner wants to keep one 35mm projector in place. Note that the JSD-100 is also capable of 16 channels with just an inexpensive upgrade card and can be fully controled by ethernet, RS-232 or 422.. It also has a built in spectrum analyzer. AND! It is about half the price of the AP-20!! JSD-100 is strictly digital only... no analog. As for crossovers I prefer to use external for bi or tri amp. It seems like crossovers go obsolete much quicker than do cinema processors. So I keep them seperate.

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Adam Fraser
Master Film Handler

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From: Houghton Lake, MI, USA
Registered: Dec 2001

posted 10-24-2011 09:18 PM

The main reason is that our CP55 is over 20 years old, has been modified at least 3 times for upgrades, and looks to be no longer supported by Dolby. Not that it has had any problems though. If I already had a CP650 I probably wouldn't even think about replacing it.

Also, pricing the DMA8, it more than 50% of the price of a new JSD 80 that could do everything in one unit.

Honestly, we may only use 35mm once or twice a year after the digital installation (maybe less). It is nice to have some sort of backup for the next few years while film is still available if say the digital system were down for an extended period of time, I could still book a film print.

Thanks for all of the information everyone.

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Olivier Lemaire
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 118
From: Paris, Ile de France, France
Registered: Jan 2010

posted 10-25-2011 12:14 PM

quote: Mark Gulbrandsen

(...)Note that the JSD-100 is also capable of 16 channels with just an inexpensive upgrade card and can be fully controled by ethernet, RS-232 or 422.. It also has a built in spectrum analyzer. AND! It is about half the price of the AP-20!! JSD-100 is strictly digital only... no analog.

Marc, you write that a JSD-100 is half the price of the AP-20: what is the price for a JSD-100 16 channels?

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Ron Lacheur
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 650
From: British Columbia, Canada
Registered: Feb 2002

posted 10-25-2011 12:46 PM

quote: Mark Gulbrandsen
As for crossovers I prefer to use external for bi or tri amp. It seems like crossovers go obsolete much quicker than do cinema processors. So I keep them seperate.

How do crossovers go obsolete?

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Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster

Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99

posted 10-25-2011 08:04 PM

quote: Olivier Lemaire
Marc, you write that a JSD-100 is half the price of the AP-20: what is the price for a JSD-100 16 channels?

Yes, over here that is true. Best to check with your local dealer for your price in Europe.

quote: Ron Lacheur
How do crossovers go obsolete?

Seems like better ones appear magically every few years from most manufacturers... Because of new technology mostly. All companies have had x-overs out that are now not servicable. The most stable part of the sound end of things has been the main processor itself. They seem to stay arond for a very long time before a new one comes along.

Mark

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Scott Norwood
Film God

Posts: 8146
From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas)
Registered: Jun 99

posted 10-25-2011 09:08 PM

What makes one crossover better than another? Isn't this sort of a solved problem? Are there really people who can tell the difference between two competently designed units? I understand the "not serviceable" issue, but do crossovers really fail on a regular basis?

What do these fancy units do that a (for example) Rane unit (which seems pretty common in many installations, though not so much for cinema) does not do?

Is it wrong to assume that most modern electronics (processors, crossovers, amps) are resonably decent and that the room and the speakers are the major cause of sound quality differences among theatres?

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Olivier Lemaire
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 118
From: Paris, Ile de France, France
Registered: Jan 2010

posted 10-26-2011 03:06 AM

quote:

quote: Olivier Lemaire

Marc, you write that a JSD-100 is half the price of the AP-20: what is the price for a JSD-100 16 channels?
Yes, over here that is true.

hum... What is the price "over here" for a JSD-100 16 channels please?

quote: Mark Gulbrandsen
Best to check with your local dealer for your price in Europe.

I'm gonna check and will report.

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Manny Knowles
"What are these things and WHY are they BLUE???"

Posts: 4247
From: Bloomington, IN, USA
Registered: Feb 2002

posted 10-26-2011 03:16 PM

Do you want genuine Dolby Noise-Reduction for your analog sound?

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