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Author Topic: GDC Cue fails to fire Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 04-07-2015 04:43 PM                     You can also just VNC to the GDC server and use your laptop/computer's keyboard too. The only time I drag a physical keyboard on to the GDC is on initial commissioning and when I make a periodic "save" of everything where you need to catch it on boot up so it stores an image (in case something goes awry down the road...kinda like Windows does with its System Restore. Cheap insurance, if you are thinking about it at the time.  |  IP: Logged Dave Young Film Handler Posts: 19 From: New Bedford, ma Registered: Jul 2014 posted 04-07-2015 09:32 PM                        I've tried double-firing, all variety of CRLF, tried adding \0D\0A with a keyboard. It goes in just fine, but gets sent as strings and not escaped chars. I've also tried adding dummy commands before and after the desired command. The only thing consistent is that the GDCs open the socket and keep it open. That will be an awkward burden to bear with hundreds or thousands of screens. I setup a few of each type tonight, will remove error handling on my socket server, and see what happens tomorrow. Otherwise, I might just end up using a JNIOR because I know it works. Just trying to avoid the extra costs.  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 04-08-2015 05:34 AM                     When you double-fire...do you put any delays between each cue? And don't be afraid to stack even more...I've done up to 4 (with 1 second spaces between them) to get a GDC to convince an NEC projector to change Presets or move a douser. But honestly...it shouldn't be too difficult to get things to fire reliably with the GDC though I strongly advise the use of a proper automation. My preference is the eCNA line.  |  IP: Logged Mike Blakesley Film God Posts: 12767 From: Forsyth, Montana Registered: Jun 99 posted 04-08-2015 03:14 PM                        One quirk I have noticed about the NEC is, if I close the douser manually (either on the control panel or using the NEC or GDC interfaces), the next time a playlist runs it won't open the douser. Every other function works fine no matter what manual step have happened.  |  IP: Logged Dave Young Film Handler Posts: 19 From: New Bedford, ma Registered: Jul 2014 posted 04-08-2015 09:08 PM                        Steve, the combination that seems to work: Dummy Call Timer (500) Actual Call Thanks for the timer suggestion. It looks like it's going to work. I am definitely going to be looking into dedicated automation (I have worked with JNIOR). It complicates the setup but also works 100%. Also don't need to worry about open sockets on my server for thousands of screens that way. I appreciate all your help!  |  IP: Logged Ian Freer Expert Film Handler Posts: 135 From: Wellington, New Zealand Registered: Oct 2003 posted 04-08-2015 10:13 PM                     A few notes if you're going to use the Jnior AND the Cinema.Jnior application to run Macros etc... This might be specific to GDC, I am unsure, as in my case it is with a GDC... Long story short: I am just trialling Cinema.Jnior 2.34.212.1338 as we had significant dropped cues with an earlier version. I don't know if it's up on their website yet, but it's been running for a few days with no issues so far. For more details read on... I have several sites with GDC, Jnior and the Jnior manual control panel, so running Cinema.Jnior is needed to make the control panel work. I had been running Cinema.Jnior 2.22.1115.1501 for a while, but every so often a site would let me know the Jnior had become unresponsive and needed a reboot. The guys at Integ looked into it and found an issue and a fix, so gave me version 2.30.939.1430, which I installed into one nearby site, connected to a GDC, and it has not since missed a beat. So feeling confident, I recently updated another 'occasional reboot required' site to 2.30... (and updated the GDC to Build331 at the same time). It broke the Jnior automation. i.e. other than a very occasional reboot required, it had been functioning well, now it was missing many cues per day. After lots of back and forth with Integ looking through logs, they found an issue where some characters were being dropped meaning two messages were running together as they were received from the GDC, resulting in invalid commands and missed cues. It seemed only to affect multi-cue macros from the GDC, i.e. a simple House Lights Up command was fine, but a SCOPE FEATURE Cue, with Lights Down, Masking Open, Volume x.x all trying to fire from the GDC to the Jnior and the last message or two got dropped, but only sometimes... I also run duplicate commands and a 500ms gap between commands to the same device in a setup like this to ensure things run smoothly, but was finding I had to really space things out to 2000ms, and while that improved things, it still missed many cues. Luckily one site had reported this to Integ a couple of weeks prior to me, so a fix had already been developed but not tested in the field... But it's all looking OK at the moment. No complaints from my site since the upgrade to Cinema.Jnior 2.34... Cheers, Ian  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 04-09-2015 06:23 AM                     See generally when I use an automation...I only have the GDC fire ONE cue to the automation and if there are multiple tasks, then the AUTOMATION handles the Macro or sequence of events. With the eCNA line of automations, there are currently 50 macros one can set up, 9 programs as well as direct out commands (and RDI commands). So I'll have Start Show 2D Flat (or words to that effect) and everything one needs to happen to get the show going will be handled by the automation once it receives that command. Projector, curtain, masking, lights...what have you. And it will do it without fail and you can trace the command coming from the server (anybody's) as well as the macro being executed. It doesn't really complicate anything either, it actually greatly simplifies it. Your commands become VERY uniform regardless of projector or server company you are integrating with. The commonality is the automation itself. The same macros can be used throughout the chain and even if Christie is used on one site and NEC is used on another and Barco is used on another (you can do the same with the sound processors too), the whole operation remains very uniform. Via the eCNA's RDIs, if you are uniform in how you create them (function 1 is Lamp on, Function 2 is lamp off...and on down) such that when you switch out the RDI file based on the projector or sound processor...you don't have to reprogram anything other than the IP addresses. Even the "greatest" DCinema system out there (Film Tech's DCS) uses the AUTOMATION as the central control point (The FT-21) such that it is equipment agnostic. Having an automation just makes much more sense to me and honestly, our cue related complaints are effectively zero. It is nice that servers have some capability to control stuff out of the box and in the most basic of systems it might be sufficient but it isn't what I would want to design anything around.  |  IP: Logged Dave Young Film Handler Posts: 19 From: New Bedford, ma Registered: Jul 2014 posted 04-09-2015 07:06 AM                        That's a fantastic design. I'm a 3rd party service provider integrating with existing setups for second-screen automation, so I don't get to make decisions, only recommendations. Additionally, because my commands hit an externally located server, I need special handling on a case by case basis. I prefer to use a colocated JNIOR taking a single command in, and sending multiple commands out. Sometimes I have to go through an ACT (GDC->ACT->JNIOR->Cloud) to do that. Rick from Integ has been extremely responsive in answering my myriad questions, and this kind of setup runs for months with no hiccups. Either way, it usually requires someone to do some network and firewall config though. Getting some bandwidth from those kinds of resources is extremely difficult. For this reason I do what I can to get up and running, I'll try anything once. I'm now thinking about doing what I need to do by monitoring a TMS. I have tremendous respect for what you guys do. It's deeply fascinating  |  IP: Logged Ken Lackner Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1907 From: Atlanta, GA, USA Registered: Sep 2001 posted 04-09-2015 07:54 AM                     Dave, I'm curious why you would use an ACT and a JNIOR. They are both automations. Why have two automations?  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 04-09-2015 10:27 AM                     Yeah...just what does the JNIOR do that the ACT doesn't? I think on of the ACTs biggest flaws it what some would call its greatest strength. That is, it is complicated and designed around running scripts. Once you get your scripts the way you want them (and there are LOTS of canned ones), you then are down to changing IPs for specific sites...but before that, you have a bit of overhead getting the scripts to suit your types of theatres. The JNIOR is definitely a cost-effective device and I can appreciate why it is favored by many. At some point, we standardized on the eCNA (Eprad) and they too have been quite responsive to our requests. The eCNA is VERY fast to set up and configure as needed...no scripts...just a decent web browser interface for setting up what you want and super-easy to save things as you desire. Note, we too are a 3rd party service company (and a dealer) so I do understand the difficulty of sometimes convincing customers to buy things. We do have a decent track record we can reference of how our systems perform. That can often help.  |  IP: Logged Dave Young Film Handler Posts: 19 From: New Bedford, ma Registered: Jul 2014 posted 04-09-2015 11:22 AM                        The only reason for running through an extra ACT is network topology and security restrictions on the IT level. In the one case I've had to do this, the theater was willing to open up my JNIOR to net out on the firewall, but not their Christie ACT itsel, and certainly not the projector network. Although a firewall means you can safely restrict traffic to outgoing on specific ports, some feel safer with lockout topology.  |  IP: Logged Dennis Benjamin Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1445 From: Denton, MD Registered: Feb 2002 posted 04-09-2015 07:35 PM                        If a theatre is under a V.P.F. agreement, like with a company such as Christie, they lock up their network pretty tight. Making changes to the firewall or to the network configuration could void the contract that the theatre chain has with the monitoring company. This risks thousands of dollars and could void the V.P.F. contract. So I'd be very careful.  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 04-10-2015 05:56 AM                     Generally, the firewall is the router and only the NOC will have that password. Likewise with any managed switch which could also limit which ports can be used and what devices can "see" what other device.  |  IP: Logged Dave Young Film Handler Posts: 19 From: New Bedford, ma Registered: Jul 2014 posted 04-10-2015 09:10 AM                        Dennis, I am following the rules in regards to modifications thanks to your advice when we spoke on the phone in early January.  |  IP: Logged

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