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Author Topic: The Film Freeze For a Few Second Dave Macaulay Film God Posts: 2321 From: Toronto, Canada Registered: Apr 2001 posted 05-01-2017 09:12 AM                     There are 2.5" enterprise drives, I haven't checked an ICMP (or IMS) but I doubt that Barco would use anything else. However, drives fail. You just can't guess exactly when.  |  IP: Logged Marco Giustini Film God Posts: 2713 From: Reading, UK Registered: Nov 2007 posted 05-01-2017 11:47 AM                     but GDC's - those never fail  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 05-01-2017 02:24 PM                     Very rarely. And I can speak as to the realibility with 334 servers in the field and only two actual media block failures in 5 years. And actual drive failures are also rare because the software raid is very easy on the drives. ( Just the opposite on the SX-3000 that uses hardware RAID where I have had a half dozen drive failures). Something on the order of three or four actual RAID drive failures in the same time period on the big servers. GDC is famous for kicking drives out of the RAID but you just add them back in if the SMART errors are within reason. And keep going.... Dave, I last looked at an IMS about two years ago (Thankfully) and it had the same exact drives that GDC is using in the PDP-3000. Mark  |  IP: Logged Carsten Kurz Film God Posts: 4340 From: Cologne, NRW, Germany Registered: Aug 2009 posted 05-02-2017 05:00 PM                     ICMPs does not use 2.5" enterprise drives, but general AV/video surveillance drives. At least our ICMP came with those. Dolby has spec'd the same drive type for the IMS1000 and IMS2000. It seems the ICMP is not too picky about specific drives anyway. Hard to tell wether these 'speciality' drives could be called enterprise drives as well. At least they are usually not built for maximum reliability. The term 'enterprise drive' is probably too generic nowadays. Steve is right that RAID optimized drives 'give up earlier' on read errors to let the RAID redundancy take over - however, many consumer or standard desktop/notebook drives can be configured to do the same by using manufacturer specific software tools, so, they can be tailored for RAID operation if needed. I have an old notebook running windows on an aging 2.5" drive that has some bad sectors. Sometimes it takes ages (minutes) for it to recover from read errors. You don't want that to happen on a DCI server. - Carsten  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 05-03-2017 08:53 AM                     Since I know that the ICMP uses HGST drives and you say they are from the A/V and Video Surveillance line...that makes them part of the "CinemastarC5K1000". They only go up to 1TB in that line but the ICMP offers a 2TB drive solution. HGST's Ultrastar C10K1800 line, which is "Enterprise Grade" and rated for operating in a RAID, they go up to 1.8TB. At 10,000RPM, they book! However the rated ambient temperature is lower (only 55C versus 70C of the C5K1000) than the other line.  |  IP: Logged Jack Ondracek Film God Posts: 2348 From: Port Orchard, WA, USA Registered: Oct 2002 posted 05-03-2017 10:16 AM                        quote: Marco Giustini I guess you mean re-build a RAID by removing a drive and re-installing it back in? Sorry if I wasn't clear. We had the underflow problem that Mark referenced. Rather than just replace the failing drive, I took the opportunity to replace them all and increase the size for more capacity. For me, this was made easier as I have all of my content duplicated on my other servers. Starting from scratch on one by replacing all of the drives with larger ones didn't pose a problem in this case.  |  IP: Logged Carsten Kurz Film God Posts: 4340 From: Cologne, NRW, Germany Registered: Aug 2009 posted 05-03-2017 10:43 AM                     quote: Steve Guttag They only go up to 1TB in that line but the ICMP offers a 2TB drive solution. That is correct, our ICMP came with 1TB Cinemastar drives. These are relatively inexpensive drives compared to 'real' enterprise or RAID optimized drives. As the 2TB original BARCO option was way to expensive for our needs, I have no idea what kind of drives the 2TB kit uses. There are many 2TB notebook drives available now, and the ICMP drive slots actually support extra high 2.5" drives as well. 'Cinemastar' sounds like a dedicated DCI drive type or something, but they are just optimized for video streaming, surveillance/CCTV VTRs, etc. - Carsten  |  IP: Logged Marco Giustini Film God Posts: 2713 From: Reading, UK Registered: Nov 2007 posted 05-03-2017 12:26 PM                     quote: Jack Ondracek Starting from scratch on one by replacing all of the drives with larger ones didn't pose a problem in this case. I understand that but it has to be made clear that re-initialising a RAID should never be necessary and even though that may fix the issue, that is not the solution.  |  IP: Logged Mattias Mattsson Film Handler Posts: 90 From: Göteborg, Sweden Registered: May 2007 posted 05-03-2017 01:31 PM                     quote: Carsten Kurz I have no idea what kind of drives the 2TB kit uses. On the ICMP:s with a 3x2TB configuration I have seen, Seagate ST2000NX0253 drives are used.  |  IP: Logged Marcel Birgelen Film God Posts: 3357 From: Maastricht, Limburg, Netherlands Registered: Feb 2012 posted 05-03-2017 03:25 PM                     Who provided those CinemaStar disks? Your integrator I presume? While those "surveillance disks" usually get tested a bit more rigorously if they can sustain the troughput, those CinemaStar disks don't run RAID-optimized firmware. So you might be careful with using them in a RAID configuration. Especially in a DCI environment, where a single bad disk can get your performance down sufficiently to stop a show. RAID optimized disks usually have a far lower retry count and get ejected earlier by the controller than your average non-RAID disk.  |  IP: Logged Carsten Kurz Film God Posts: 4340 From: Cologne, NRW, Germany Registered: Aug 2009 posted 05-03-2017 04:02 PM                     quote: Marcel Birgelen Who provided those CinemaStar disks? Your integrator I presume? While those "surveillance disks" usually get tested a bit more rigorously if they can sustain the troughput, those CinemaStar disks don't run RAID-optimized firmware. They are BARCO supplied. HGST has a detailed description, and they do seem to have RAID optimizations, at least the early-give-in feature that is needed for guaranteed response time ('Error Recovery Time Limits'). - Carsten  |  IP: Logged Monte L Fullmer Film God Posts: 8367 From: Nampa, Idaho, USA Registered: Nov 2004 posted 05-03-2017 06:45 PM                     These PSD drives are the HGST CinemaStar Drives, the C5K1000 series were designed for specific video storage. Doesn't mention anything on Enterprise on the drive itself. I've already replaced a few in the 3 years we've been opened. - Monte  |  IP: Logged Ananta Rusdyanto Film Handler Posts: 4 From: Banjanegara, Central Java Registered: Jan 2017 posted 05-07-2017 04:13 AM                     If i want to change the drive with the new one, does anyone have a drive recommendation beside HGST hdd?  |  IP: Logged Carsten Kurz Film God Posts: 4340 From: Cologne, NRW, Germany Registered: Aug 2009 posted 05-07-2017 06:20 AM                     Are you current on software and technotes for the Barco alchemy? There have been some issues with the RAID that may be resolved without changing the drive. If you read up this thread, you will find the two drive types used in the ICMP. If your drive is actually dead or needs to be replaced for other reasons, get the same type of drive as is already used in the ICMP. The 1TB Cinemastar is very affordable. - Carsten  |  IP: Logged Dave Macaulay Film God Posts: 2321 From: Toronto, Canada Registered: Apr 2001 posted 05-07-2017 08:25 AM                     Basically you don't just go to the local computer store and get whatever laptop drive they have on sale. The drives listed above are useb by Barco so presumably they are what it wants. You will probably need to order these and they will cost more than basic laptop drives.  |  IP: Logged

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