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Author Topic: NEC NC2000c scaled flat inside scope lens Frank Cox Film God Posts: 2234 From: Melville Saskatchewan Canada Registered: Apr 2011 posted 08-21-2017 04:30 PM                        Sadly, I get the impression that a lot of theatres don't give a damn about the presentation of the picture and sound for the movie so why would commercials be treated any differently.  |  IP: Logged Pietro Clarici Expert Film Handler Posts: 136 From: Foligno (PG) Italy Registered: Sep 2008 posted 08-21-2017 05:32 PM                        quote: Marcel Birgelen It might be "just commercials", but you're getting paid to show them. You're not getting paid to make them look like crap. Crap? Come on, it's low-bitrate 1080p material (at best) scaled to 858p and shown at the same fL as regular Scope. They still look way better than on an average HDTV, we've had several "surprise" spot checks and obviously no one ever objected. Nitpicking has to be part of our job, but let's be realistic. Up until a few years ago they were happy to be put on screen with a 720p single-chip office projector.  |  IP: Logged Marcel Birgelen Film God Posts: 3357 From: Maastricht, Limburg, Netherlands Registered: Feb 2012 posted 08-21-2017 06:01 PM                     I don't think I'm nitpicking. I'm just pretty allergic to slippery slopes and the resulting sloppy "standards" that come from this. Some of those advertisers or the agencies in between might not take their job serious, but it's no excuse for doing the same to them. And really, a lot of the advertising looks like crap, not just because the often bad up-conversion from low quality 1080p or worse sources, but often simply because of how it is framed. Look, I get where it is coming from. For most theaters, those advertisements are just a nice stream of revenue on the side, they're usually not their livelihood. Often they already care pretty little about how their main feature looks on screen, so they care nothing about how the rest looks. Still, your advertisers most likely think differently about it. They usually expect you to make sure your patrons actually get to see them and they also expect you to make sure they get to see them properly.  |  IP: Logged Pietro Clarici Expert Film Handler Posts: 136 From: Foligno (PG) Italy Registered: Sep 2008 posted 08-21-2017 06:19 PM                        I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm just saying that a slight downscale of arguably average-looking material doesn't automatically result in a crappy presentation. Actually, I don't think this is even noticeable in most cases, and keep in mind it's all to compensate for projector issues that could affect the feature presentation. In a perfect world, NEC would upgrade or fix the lens motors and control electronics to make them faster and reliable, but this is not going to happen.  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 08-21-2017 09:11 PM                     The NEC's move slow by design. They are not a servo drive system like other projectors have. They actually count the pulses generated by the lens drive motor and memorize that to use for repeat settings. You could also be stuck with the stupid add on set up Christie has used or having to move the lens manually like they also used to do. Mark  |  IP: Logged Pietro Clarici Expert Film Handler Posts: 136 From: Foligno (PG) Italy Registered: Sep 2008 posted 08-22-2017 07:29 AM                        As stupid as it might look, I'd be perfectly cool with a add-on ILS if it meant it actually worked. The problem with my 7 machines is that they somehow manage to be both slow and imprecise at the same time - I can't even get the 2500 and 3240 to stay in focus after a *single* Flat/Scope shift. It's the main reason I definitely won't be choosing NEC again when I get new projectors next year or so.  |  IP: Logged Randy Stankey Film God Posts: 6539 From: Erie, Pennsylvania Registered: Jun 99 posted 08-22-2017 09:42 AM                     I haven't got a problem with having a pause between the ads and the regular show program. In fact, a couple-three minute gap would be ideal. It lets the customers know that the ads are over and gives them some time to get situated before the show starts. You could also program in a nice, long fade for the house lights... like 30 seconds... so that people's eyes can adjust. In other words, you're making much ado of nothing. Leave things just as they are.  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 08-22-2017 10:07 AM                     quote: Pietro Clarici I can't even get the 2500 and 3240 to stay in focus after a *single* Flat/Scope shift. Seriously, I have 334 NEC's installed all over the place and I have zero problems with focus or zoom drift. I go to many of the sites, but not all, a couple ties a year and I wold see it if it were that bad. I do get calls from my customers that have wooden buildings in places like Wyoming and Idaho that have wide seasonal temperature shifts because their image slightly shifts on screen with the building expanding and contracting. I just touch that up for them remotely. But as far as focus/zoom problems they just don't exist, not even on the 30+ NC-900's I installed. NOW there WERE and PROBABLY ARE still problems with a certain brand lens whose name escapes me that also fits the NEC. I had big issues with those lenses!! I pulled them all back out and sent them back for Konica-Minolta, or Fujinon lenses. So if you have those off brand lenses and you can't exchange them you are probably stuck. But that's not NEC's fault, they neither built them or speced them. I have so few problems with the NEC's around here as to have non existant problems. Most of my problems are server(hard drives), sound or network related. Mark  |  IP: Logged Pietro Clarici Expert Film Handler Posts: 136 From: Foligno (PG) Italy Registered: Sep 2008 posted 08-22-2017 12:53 PM                        Very mild climate all year round and I'm running Konica Minolta lenses on all projectors. I bought the first 2500S in my country ten years ago dealing directly with NEC and I think I got the second or third 3240 in continental Europe in April 2011 - that was fun, it took almost a year to get stable software for it and for the awful Doremi IMB. They spent months blaming each other for every single artifact or crash. So yes, a possible excuse is that my specific machines were very early models, but there's absolutely nothing off-brand. Of course this is just my experience, but it's enough for me to say I'm not willing to deal with them anymore.  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 08-22-2017 01:22 PM                     I never installed any Series 1 NEC, but there was a lot of it in Salt Lake City. I had all my customers wait till series 2 came out. I also installed some of the first 3240's here, but with GDC and had no problems with them. I did have pixel failure on the first couple light engines that necessitated replacing two engines. Other than that no issues. Mark  |  IP: Logged Mike Blakesley Film God Posts: 12767 From: Forsyth, Montana Registered: Jun 99 posted 08-22-2017 08:16 PM                        quote: Randy Stankey In fact, a couple-three minute gap would be ideal. It lets the customers know that the ads are over and gives them some time to get situated before the show starts. Not 2 or 3 minutes, but I program a 30-second gap between the ads and the trailers. If we have an unexpectedly-large crowd, the gap allows me to pause the program for a few minutes to get everyone through the concession line. I have the stage lights come back on during the gap so people aren't looking at a blank screen. As for focus issues....our NEC projector (series 2) turned 7 years old in June of this year and as far as I know, we've never adjusted the focus. The picture is still as sharp as on day one.  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 08-22-2017 08:59 PM                     The lens brand you are trying to recall is "InVision" NEC DID sanction them and has their own part numbers for them. Barco uses them on their "B" series projectors a bit, including "built for 4K versions." My experience with them are mixed. They are VERY heavy and will tend to have the Barco "B" projector have a shimmering image as they magnify any vibrations, a lot with a lot of overhung weight. As for NEC and lens stability. They are the worst, by far, of the DLPs. it is absolute BS that Mark is spewing about the NC900s holding their lens positions. They can't hit the same spot twice in a row. There isn't enough granularity in their mechanism to even precisely hit were you want. I haven't had excessive problems with their .98" machines. They do drift and are slow at doing their business but not as bad as you are describing. Are you initializing your lens before saving your first position? NEC, unlike Barco or Christie, doesn't seem keep track of what direction the lens was moving when coming to rest and doesn't seem to have as good a means of initializing.  |  IP: Logged

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