my profile | my password | search | faq & rules | forum home

» Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE   » Operations   » Digital Cinema Forum   » NC1200C issue (Page 2)

This topic comprises 3 pages: 1  2  3

Author Topic: NC1200C issue Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 02-16-2018 06:32 AM                     4.221 is indeed current. However, I have not had favorable experiences with it or the mating DCC. I've had it crash numerous times. 4.220 runs the current DCC and has not been as unstable. 4.221 just adds another lamp or so to 4.220. I'd say that the minimum NEC software to be on is 4.217. The differences between 4.217 and 4.221 are just the lamps it recognizes as certified lamps in most S2 projectors. As for Dolby DSS, 4.9.0.96 is current but I do think that 4.9.1 will be hitting the streets pretty soon. 4.9 is definitely a worthwhile update. 4.3.5.9 remains the most stable of all Dolby DSS versions but it will not work with SMPTE packages with encrypted captions (it will show the movie, not the captions). It is a "snapshot" of what things were like back then so any changes in the SMPTE packages as it has evolved are not represented in it. All of that said, I don't think what you experienced is software related. I think it is DCinema related. having to reboot things seems to be a way of life. Reseating ICP boards also seems rather common (all three DLP brands). FWIW, I notice a significant upswing in ICP oddities when the humidity changes, particularly towards the dry season (winter).  |  IP: Logged Leo Enticknap Film God Posts: 7474 From: Loma Linda, CA Registered: Jul 2000 posted 02-16-2018 09:21 AM                        My impression is that heat cycling really pummels the electronics in digital cinema projectors. Most of the problems I've had which have either been fixed by pulling and reconnecting something, or replacing a hardware component, have been on the larger projectors with bigger bulbs, e.g. Barco 32Bs and NEC 2500s and 3240s. You're pumping a lot of heat and UV into a very small space, and then reducing the temperature a lot afterwards.  |  IP: Logged Steve Kraus Film God Posts: 4094 From: Chicago, IL, USA Registered: May 2000 posted 02-16-2018 09:47 AM                    So what is my best course of action? Besides updating NEC but not to the very latest (4.217 or can one just update Enigma alone?) Should I enter and reseat a few boards? Obtain and replace router? I've never been inside so there is the concern of getting it going again after triggering various tamper alerts. Should I find a local tech? Strong? Recommendations? Business is in the toilet (break-even right now) but that's all the more reason to spend avoid disaster. I can certainly live with a periodic reboot IF that is sure to resolve it but naturally I'm worried about this disrupting a show. It does seem to make some sense that 5.5 years of temperature cycling could result in a poor connection on some board. What is the deal with SMPTE? Is that still coming or will they stay interop? I presume what I have won't handle them. So there is that as well. And on another matter, I put my DSS100 issue aside as we got into the holiday season but will be revisiting it soon as having a backup for server will give me a little confidence. Wish I had a backup projector! I never had to finish a film show on one machine but there was always that option and I kept 6K reels handy just in case.  |  IP: Logged Carsten Kurz Film God Posts: 4340 From: Cologne, NRW, Germany Registered: Aug 2009 posted 02-16-2018 10:20 AM                     I would not be too nervous, but you definitly need to bring the Enigma up to date. There is no reason not to update the NEC to something in the 4.217 to 4.219 range. Somehow your business must be prepared for being down one or two days at least, because something simply breaks some day. As the internal router turns out to be a common point of failure, just get one to be on the safe side. Did you ever reseat boards, clear a security tamper yourself, perform a remarriage? If not, 'Id say make yourself familiar with these procedures so you can fix minor issues on your own. For a DSS200 and with a series 2 projector, I see no reason not to switch to 4.9. Yes, 4.8.x had quite a few glitches, but if you want to screen current and future DCPs, you should update. SMPTE is definitly coming, they won't stay with Interop. No need to hurry with the DSS upgrade, though, you can easily wait until a solid 4.9 version is communicated through this forum (it appears though that 4.9.0.96 is quite usable). However, staying on Enigma 1.6 is a real risc. You are really lucky it did not hit you already. At a certain point in time, that would have taken your screen down for more than 1 or two days, and it would have been an expensive repair as well. - Carsten  |  IP: Logged Steve Kraus Film God Posts: 4094 From: Chicago, IL, USA Registered: May 2000 posted 02-16-2018 10:59 AM                    No, not counting the lamphouse, I've never been inside at all except the front when I changed the connection to put electronics on an an IEC cord so it can run on a fulltime UPS for filtration purposes. There was security reset of some sort for that. Yes, if I'm down, I'm down and the clients (the studios & their publicists) would book elsewhere. Worst of all would be a show that fails while underway while second worst would be a projector that doesn't start when people are on their way. I'm usually starting up an hour or two before showtime. The key is being as absolutely reliable as is possible including cancelling well in advance if something breaks so the publicists can tell their guests the screening will be held elsewhere. In mid 2014 the Cat.862 did not survive a *reboot. Luckily it happened on over a weekend and there was nothing needing the server until Thursday. This was back when Dolby would still RXO them. I fixed it on Tuesday. I think I lost two shows; one an inquiry for Wednesday and I decided not to chance it. And upon hearing I was down, Thursday moved to a theatre just to be safe, a decision I concurred with. *The Cat.862, unresponsive even to a direct connection, had no LEDs lit so probably the on-board regulator(s) had failed. It was after a routine reboot after running a month or two.  |  IP: Logged Leo Enticknap Film God Posts: 7474 From: Loma Linda, CA Registered: Jul 2000 posted 02-16-2018 11:39 AM                        You can simply update the Enigma board on its own, using the .pkg file within the NEC bundle, and the TI ICP and Enigma tool. However, I couldn't say whether Enigma version 1.8 will be problematic when used with much older components of the rest of the NEC package. I have Dolby 4.9.0.96 in use in several sites, both with cat862 and cat745s, none of which have reported any software-related problems. You will need to buy a KDM in order to update a cat862-based system. Per this site's convention, I'm not going to quote the actual price, but it is not a significant amount. Any Dolby cinema products dealer can sell you one. Agreed with Carsten. If you are absolutely mission critical, and the loss of a show would be economically catastrophic for you, then, IMHO, you have two options, from which you can choose either, both, or a combination. Option A is self-sufficiency: train yourself to maintain and repair your server and projector, and keep spares in stock of known weak point parts, or identify vendors that can get those parts to you within an acceptable timescale. One route to option A could be to have a service tech come to you for a day and train you in stuff like bulb replacements, pulling and reseating boards, clearing tamper alarms, understanding what's in the logs: in short, planned maintenance and first line troubleshooting. Option B is to sign a service contract with a local (or even not so local, if that makes sense) service vendor who guarantees a response time that would be acceptable to you. A service contract that includes a mix of remote monitoring and troubleshooting (we do it by installing an Internet-connected PC in the customer's booth, and use Teamviewer to communicate with LAN-connected equipment), combined with rapid response capability to the actual site if necessary, might be something you'd like to look at. One other thing to throw out there is that if you, or a service tech you call in, need to go to equipment vendors for support, one of the first things they'll ask is what software or firmware version the equipment is running, and if it isn't the current version, they may tell you to update to the current version before being willing to troubleshoot with you any further. Some will do this even if the problem clearly has nothing to do with software. So, while I am sympathetic to the "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" approach to software and firmware updating, please keep in mind that when old software does cause something to go wrong, you may have little or no warning.  |  IP: Logged Carsten Kurz Film God Posts: 4340 From: Cologne, NRW, Germany Registered: Aug 2009 posted 02-16-2018 11:39 AM                     I'd say, as a screening room, you definitely will need full SMPTE support sooner (not later). Chances are high you will receive features earlier, or different packages from the main distribution. If something doesn't work, you're among the first to experience it, and it will be embarassing to explain you are running very outdated software (even if you have the 'if it ain't broke, don't fix it!' explanation). I'm not saying you always have to be on the latest software - but you have the benefit to find out on this forum from the many users and experienced techs when it is safe to install a specific version. - Carsten  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 02-16-2018 12:35 PM                     4.3.5.13 DOES support SMPTE packages and likely he has run them as Disney has been doing SMPTE now for over a year and others have started as well. It is just that it is a 6-year old "snapshot" of the SMPTE definition or an interpretation of that definition. 4.9.0 is more stable than 4.8 except 4.8.10.4, which is about equivalent in stability. 4.9.0.96 is what just about all of our customers are on. It is quite stable though I think Jupiter client is a bit sluggish and it can be slow to update some fields...overall a winner.  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 02-16-2018 01:00 PM                     quote: Leo Enticknap My impression is that heat cycling really pummels the electronics in digital cinema projectors. I don't see this happen in NEC S-2 stuff at all. I have locations that leave equipment on 24/7, but more places that shut down completely every night. The reliability with NEC/GDC and USL has been the same very low rate at all locations. I can't speak of the other brands since I went exclusively with those brands when major conversions began. The latest failure was an NC-1200 rectifier in Nevada, but it was one from a batch of San-Rex rectifiers that all fail eventually. Its twin failed three years ago. That makes a total of 6 NEC projector component failures I've had in NEC in seven years. I have also never had a single fan fail of it's own accord, but I have replaced some AC-On and Power-On fans in the oldest projectors as a precaution, and it's very easy to do. Mark  |  IP: Logged Leo Enticknap Film God Posts: 7474 From: Loma Linda, CA Registered: Jul 2000 posted 02-16-2018 01:42 PM                        quote: Steve Guttag It is just that it is a 6-year old "snapshot" of the SMPTE definition or an interpretation of that definition. And, IIRC, some significant aspects of that definition changed in 2014, especially around subtitles. As a very rough rule of thumb, you stand a good chance of getting away with playing SMPTE DCPs on servers and/or projectors with ancient software, unless it has subtitles or captions, in which case all bets are off.  |  IP: Logged Steve Kraus Film God Posts: 4094 From: Chicago, IL, USA Registered: May 2000 posted 02-16-2018 03:03 PM                    I tried the script but I don't think my version has it. Can I get back to the regular GUI without rebooting? Funny that Disney is mentioned. Yesterday I got a couple of Disney DCPs for an upcoming screening, both IOP, but different creation dates. Today I got yet another one and it's SMPTE.  |  IP: Logged Carsten Kurz Film God Posts: 4340 From: Cologne, NRW, Germany Registered: Aug 2009 posted 02-16-2018 03:26 PM                     SMPTE does not mean a simple formal distinction, it's still in transitional phase. Try to play the current ISDCF SMPTE test DCP, and the Dolby on 4.3x will fail on the subtitles. Disney was one of the first companies who tried SMPTE on wide releases, even for non-ATMOS DCPs. Keep in mind, subtitles, or captions, are not only used to subtitle foreign language movies, they also show up often as declarative elements in 'ordinary' feature or to translate short foreign language passages. I'ts probably rarely a show killer if they don't show up, but in a screeningroom, it may still become obvious to the audience that something is missing. - Carsten  |  IP: Logged Leo Enticknap Film God Posts: 7474 From: Loma Linda, CA Registered: Jul 2000 posted 02-16-2018 05:07 PM                        Ctrl + alt + F8 to get back to the GUI. The Enigma purge log script was introduced in version 4.7 of the Dolby DSS software, so if you're on 4.3 it won't be there - sorry.  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 02-16-2018 05:40 PM                     Most subtitles that are used for brief instances to allow the original language are burned in (for the US, at least) so it is likely that the 4.3 version will pose an issue there. Honestly, Id have version for 4.9 at the ready. I'll quote you an upgrade fee off-line. I have one site that is on 4.3.5.9 and on top of the pedestal there is a "break in case of emergency" sort of thing to immediately get them up to what was current the last time I was there. This site has had zero server issues since it was installed a long time ago and they want to run that version. Hey Boys and Girls...NEC has been cooking up another version 4.222! It only really affects the NC3200 and NC3240 projectors (new lamps). They have also finally issued the new version of DCC for the "series 3" projectors like the 3541L. It does NOT work with legacy projectors. I believe some series 3 projectors also have new firmware versions available.  |  IP: Logged Leo Enticknap Film God Posts: 7474 From: Loma Linda, CA Registered: Jul 2000 posted 02-16-2018 06:24 PM                        I really wish that NEC would follow Barco's lead and issue one, single Communicator app for every single one of its projectors. The one, tinsy downside to this is that the Barco Communicator installer file is pretty big (over 100mb for 5.10), and keeps growing with every revision; but that's an insignificant price to pay for the convenience of not having to mess around with multiple versions. At the moment I have to have three NEC DCCs on my laptop: whatever was the last Series 1 version, 5.1.8.0 for most Series 2s, and the unique one for the 1040L.  |  IP: Logged

All times are Central (GMT -6:00)

This topic comprises 3 pages: 1  2  3

Printer-friendly view of this topic

Hop To: Select a Forum: Category: Operations -------------------- Digital Cinema Forum Film Handlers' Forum Large Format Forum Ground Level Feature Info, Trailer Attachments & REAL Credit Offsets Category: Community -------------------- Film-Yak Film Handlers' Movie Reviews The Afterlife Bob Maar's Joke-A-Thon Category: Classified -------------------- Equipment and Supplies Wanted/For Sale Help Wanted/Seeking Employment Category: System -------------------- Software Beta Testing Forum

The Film-Tech Forums are designed for various members related to the cinema industry to express their opinions, viewpoints and testimonials on various products, services and events based upon speculation, personal knowledge and factual information through use, therefore all views represented here allow no liability upon the publishers of this web site and the owners of said views assume no liability for any ill will resulting from these postings. The posts made here are for educational as well as entertainment purposes and as such anyone viewing this portion of the website must accept these views as statements of the author of that opinion and agrees to release the authors from any and all liability.