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Author Topic: Film Preservation school...HELP! Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 11-27-2004 09:24 AM                     A Videola(MFG by Moviola) although obsolete and pretty scarce is a very good and safe way to transfer Nitrate film for general purpose viewing. Even very shrunken film will run quite well through a Videola although expect some image unsteadiness. Mark  |  IP: Logged John Pytlak Film God Posts: 9987 From: Rochester, NY 14650-1922 Registered: Jan 2000 posted 11-27-2004 09:33 AM                        The familiar rectangular "Kodak Standard" KS perforation for 35mm prints was developed to reduce the perf tearing at the sharp corners on the BH perforation. KS perforations are also used for 65mm negative films, and 70mm print film. http://www.kodak.com/US/en/motion/support/h1/sizesP.shtml#perfs In the 1989, Kodak developed a method of slightly rounding the corners of the BH perf and maintaining compatibility with existing camera/printer registration pins, helping reduce the wear on printing elements.  |  IP: Logged Ed Inman Expert Film Handler Posts: 103 From: Jackson, Mississippi USA Registered: Jul 2004 posted 11-27-2004 06:44 PM                        Steven, Your question about the font on your nitrate frame caught my eye as I am one of relatively few printers who still casts hot metal type slugs on a Linotype. The letters on your nitrate frame appear to be drawn by hand. There are minor inconsistencies in several letters which indicate that it was probably drawn and not proofed from actual type. However it could have been based on an actual cast metal type style. It has certain elements of Parsons which is said to have been Charlie Chaplain's favorite font for titles: http://www.myfonts.com/fonts/barnhartbrother/parsons/familytree.html It also has certain elements (such as the "g") of what in digital type is called Fritz, which is also based on sign lettering of that era: http://fontbureau.com/fonts/Fritz But to ID it as an actual font...well frankly I'm stumped. If there ever was an actual metal type cast to look exactly as your film letters do, I suspect it must be pretty obscure and probably cast only by a small regional foundry as opposed to a large national foundry like ATF or BB&S. But again, I'm not certain. Ed  |  IP: Logged Steve Kraus Film God Posts: 4094 From: Chicago, IL, USA Registered: May 2000 posted 11-27-2004 07:08 PM                    Random thoughts: Now I know why they call those places "type foundries"...because they once really were. Parsons is the name of the orginal poster...what are the odds on that? And the molten lead and nitrate film...poof.  |  IP: Logged Allison Parsons Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 630 From: East Peoria, IL Registered: Oct 2004 posted 11-27-2004 11:56 PM                        Parsons is a gooood name Having written the original topic about film preservation schools and now reading all the reply's... I REALLY don't know jack about film stock. I thought I knew some but boy, it looks like i know nothing. Hopefully, if I get accepted, I can chat about all this with you but for now I have to sit back in awe.  |  IP: Logged Leo Enticknap Film God Posts: 7474 From: Loma Linda, CA Registered: Jul 2000 posted 11-28-2004 05:22 AM                        quote: Mark Gulbrandsen A Videola(MFG by Moviola) although obsolete and pretty scarce is a very good and safe way to transfer Nitrate film for general purpose viewing. Sounds like a similar thing to a 'video Steenbeck'. There was a company in London which bought normal ones and then modified them by removing the mirror and screen unit and replacing it with a CCD video camera behind the rotating prism. The film transport was synchronised to the scanning rate (fixed at 25fps to enable two-field scanning for PAL) and although the picture quality wasn't brilliant (for one thing the camera only had composite video output) it was fine for viewing copies. The added attraction for nitrate was that Steenbecks only use a slide projector bulb and even then it's nowhere near the actual film, so heat exposure is practically non-existant. Steenbecks are not at all kind to shrunken elements, though.  |  IP: Logged Steve Kraus Film God Posts: 4094 From: Chicago, IL, USA Registered: May 2000 posted 11-28-2004 09:08 PM                    I believe the Videola was based on Moviola's 35mm flatbed editing machine. KEM offered the same thing based on their KS series flatbed; possibly also as a module for existing RS/KS/K800 type machines. I think in their case they simply deliver an image to a camera you supply. In all these cases we are talking about a non intermittent system where the film rolls through the gate continuously and a rotating prism compensates for the motion of each frame and does a dissolve of sorts from frame to frame without a blackout period. I don't see any reason that the film speed has to be locked to anything. Seems like you ought to be able to run the film at 24 while the camera runs at 25 fps. Even without shrunken film these are not a very good way to make a transfer. The prisms arent always that great at tracking the image so there is some flutter and of course there is a loss of resolution. And least in the case of the KEM and probably on all three the prism facets are close enough to the focal plane that dust and dirt on them will be visible as each face comes around.  |  IP: Logged Stephen Furley Film God Posts: 3059 From: Coulsdon, Croydon, England Registered: May 2002 posted 11-29-2004 01:17 AM                     There were several shutterless film projectors as well, which used various arrangements of either prisms or mirror drums, with continuous film movement. All the ones that I've seen dated from either the '20s or '30s. The BBC used a modiified version of the Mechau, a mirror drum machiine, for both telecine and film recording.  |  IP: Logged Leo Enticknap Film God Posts: 7474 From: Loma Linda, CA Registered: Jul 2000 posted 11-29-2004 04:17 AM                        quote: Steve Kraus I don't see any reason that the film speed has to be locked to anything. Seems like you ought to be able to run the film at 24 while the camera runs at 25 fps. You'd get interlace flicker if you tried. None of the PAL telecine systems use anything like the NTSC 3:2:2 pulldown. Instead, to sync up to the 50hz scanning rate of a PAL TV, the film speed is simply increased from 24 to 25 and each frame is scanned twice. If you ever see an 'off the wall' PAL video transfer made using a 24fps projector, the interlace flicker will give you a bit of a headache before long! The video Steenbecks synchronised the rotation of the prism so that it was at its 'darkest' point as one scan finished and the next started. That made replacing belts on them an absolute bastard - get it just one tooth wrong and the flicker on the video is horrendous.  |  IP: Logged Steve Kraus Film God Posts: 4094 From: Chicago, IL, USA Registered: May 2000 posted 11-29-2004 11:15 AM                    Well on the KEM (speaking about the later "flickerless" picture modules) the image intensity doesnt change. The major downside is that even these which were a huge advance over the older module's optics the incoming new frame disolves in at a slightly different point on the screen than the old one which is fading out and the new frame moves very slightly upward on the screen before it starts to fade and the next one comes in. If they could eliminate that they'd be much better. Perhaps they already have. Major interframe flicker sort of eliminates 50% of the reason to have a prism system: Partly for the gentleness on the film from continuous motion and partly so the image is always there no matter where it stops! When I worked for the post-production center we had a 16mm projector from MTM built like a dubber and using a continuous motion prism system. Interesting machine and good for mixes etc. but not the ideal way to show a movie. [ 11-29-2004, 09:45 PM: Message edited by: Steve Kraus ]  |  IP: Logged Leo Enticknap Film God Posts: 7474 From: Loma Linda, CA Registered: Jul 2000 posted 12-13-2004 04:48 AM                        Returning to Allison's original question, I've had a few calls and e-mails from people asking about film preservation school in the last couple of weeks, as a result of which I've put links to all the courses and programmes I know about on our website here. If there are any I've missed please let me know and I'll add them on.  |  IP: Logged System Notices Forum Watchdog / Soup Nazi Posts: 215 Registered: Apr 2004 posted 01-16-2008 03:17 AM                 It has been 1128 days since the last post.  |  IP: Logged Allison Parsons Jedi Master Film Handler Posts: 630 From: East Peoria, IL Registered: Oct 2004 posted 01-16-2008 03:17 AM                        Third times the charm. (hopefully) Wish me luck!  |  IP: Logged Tim Reed Better Projection Pays Posts: 5246 From: Northampton, PA Registered: Sep 1999 posted 01-19-2008 12:18 AM                       Bless your heart, Allison. Good luck. You're an ol' pro at this game now...  |  IP: Logged

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