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» Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE   » Community   » Film-Yak   » TV Station Videotape Formats (Page 2)

 
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Author Topic: TV Station Videotape Formats
Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

Posts: 12859
From: Denver, Colorado
Registered: May 99


 - posted 08-22-2001 01:55 AM      Profile for Joe Redifer   Author's Homepage   Email Joe Redifer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
You can get the real AVID on the Mac platform and I believe the PC as well. Cheap it certainly is not.

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Phil Connolly
Film Handler

Posts: 80
From: Derby, England
Registered: May 2000


 - posted 08-22-2001 03:01 AM      Profile for Phil Connolly   Author's Homepage   Email Phil Connolly   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
True 16:9 in the UK just uses different shaped pixels, but the same resolution as 4:3 overall. Many 16:9 broadcasts are shot using a camera with a 4:3 CCD and anamorphic lens.
Or their are DV cameras like the Sony DSR500-WSP, which record on DVCam (same data as miniDV) and have a 16:9 CCD, when you switch to 4:3 on this camera you actually loose horizontal resolution.

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Matthew Bailey
Master Film Handler

Posts: 461
From: Port Arthur,TX
Registered: Sep 2000


 - posted 08-22-2001 10:32 PM      Profile for Matthew Bailey   Email Matthew Bailey   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Is anyone familiar with the Ampex ACR-automatic cassette reproducer/
recorder? This is probably an early videocassette machine but the
cassettes used 2 inch wide tape. The cassettes were easy to dismantle
& replenish with tape.The machine had a vertical changer carousel
which held the cassettes positioned between a pair of video
record/playback mechanisms which had transverse rather than helical
video heads.

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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001


 - posted 08-22-2001 11:57 PM      Profile for Bobby Henderson   Email Bobby Henderson   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
With the future of DV photography definitely going 16:9, it is pretty frustrating if you want to buy a DV camera today. I have been really tempted to pick up a Canon GL-1 (my pockets are not deep enough at the moment for the XL-1), but I hesitate on spending over $2000 on a camcorder if the thing is already on the verge of being obsolenscent/obsolete.

The computer/electronics industry needs to get off their duffs and get more true 16:9 CCDs made, and made at higher actual resolutions. Many people are now expecting their digital video camera to function also as a digital still camera. That might be asking a bit much for doing both jobs without watering down either video or still work.

One thing that should be a requirement for just about any DV camera, be it consumer or professional, is a 3 CCD array. One single composite CCD just sucks. And they should do 3 CCD arrays for many digital still cameras. I have seen only a handful of digital cameras and large format digital backs utilize 3 CCDs. ALL professional digital video cameras employ 3CCD array systems to process the Red, Green and Blue components of the video signal separately. The color quality and sharpness of the video is always going to turn out better with a 3CCD array than it will with only one single chip trying to do the entire job.

So basically I guess what I would like to see is a good digital camcorder sporting true progressive scan 16:9 3CCD chip arrays. A nice supertelephoto flourite lens (or even better yet, interchangeable lens housings) would be nice too. What would be really great is if such a camera could come out below the $3,000 or even $2,000 price barrier.

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Sean Weitzel
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 619
From: Vacaville, CA (1790 miles west of Rockwall)
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 08-23-2001 12:40 PM      Profile for Sean Weitzel   Email Sean Weitzel   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
This is what I think Matthew is talking about:
http://www.lionlmb.org/quad/acr225.html

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Bruce McGee
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1776
From: Asheville, NC USA... Nowhere in Particular.
Registered: Aug 1999


 - posted 08-23-2001 01:07 PM      Profile for Bruce McGee   Email Bruce McGee   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
WAGA in Atlanta had 2 ACR's in Master Control. They were always jamming and eating carts. It finally got so bad that spots aired during the 6pm news (big money--we were first in the market) were re-dubbed onto a separate 2", or later, 1" tape.

My last job in TV, after the phase-out of film, was in commercial operations. Had to watch every single commercial that came through the place. Yucck. I also had the fun of loading ACR carts with 2" tape. We had a small machine that wound them to whatever length that we wanted.

Stuff like this kinda burned me out. I left the industry soon after.

Another station that I worked in had an RCA 2" cart machine that ran the carts around a big oval track. Somewhere deep inside it lurked a 2" tape machine. I can still hear the video head running to this day... not constantly, of course!

I have a few 3/4" dubs of 2" video that was made in the late 70's. If I turn up the audio during the silent commercial break slugs, I can faintly hear the whine of the video head. Could possibly bring on a flashback if I listened long enough...

Our local station has a nice S-VHS industrial machine hooked through their switcher in the newsroom. They encourage viewers to bring them their video coverage of "news." Some of it would qualify for one of those funniest video shows on TV. They only ask that the tape you submit be recorded at SP "standard" speed. They still get things at EP, though. These they dont use.

There was a fire on the riverfront here in Asheville 6-7 years ago that devastated 3 blocks of real eatate that was built in the early 1900's.
The station made a video available to the viewers of this fire. Most of the footage was viewer-submitted, with
on-screen credit! I dont think they can do any other consumer formats.


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Mark Gulbrandsen
Resident Trollmaster

Posts: 16657
From: Music City
Registered: Jun 99


 - posted 08-23-2001 03:34 PM      Profile for Mark Gulbrandsen   Email Mark Gulbrandsen   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I kind of agree with Josh's statement about 1" format. Its really a bullett proof format that still exists in almost all stations today. Its was the most reliable format in the stations I worked at, 2" Quad and 3/4" were the most trouble plagued formats.
Mark @ GTS

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Joe Grace
Film Handler

Posts: 44
From: Maine
Registered: Feb 2000


 - posted 08-23-2001 04:46 PM      Profile for Joe Grace   Email Joe Grace   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Joe, Which Avid software are you talking about? I believe that All of avids Real Time editing systems are not available for mac, Avid DS isnt and its more of a hardware thing then a software thing. Now if avid cinema is more your thing then that is available for mac :-)


Joe

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Joe Redifer
You need a beating today

Posts: 12859
From: Denver, Colorado
Registered: May 99


 - posted 08-23-2001 04:52 PM      Profile for Joe Redifer   Author's Homepage   Email Joe Redifer   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Hell I don't know I've never really researched it. FInal Cut Pro is plenty fine for me (although you can't edit 35mm film with it, unless you just go by timecode). And with the Matrox card FCP is really fast. I have no need to research Avid, I just know that they make products for the Mac.


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Matthew Bailey
Master Film Handler

Posts: 461
From: Port Arthur,TX
Registered: Sep 2000


 - posted 08-23-2001 11:13 PM      Profile for Matthew Bailey   Email Matthew Bailey   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
I wonder if there is a digital reel to reel videotape format.
I assume that some TV stations use rewritable DVD equipment.
Pioneer used to make a rewritable laser video disc recorder.
It used 12 inch rewritable laser video discs enclosed in
a cartridge. The machine was sort of like the RCA CED videodisc players. I am wondering if you can connect one to your computer
& use it as sort of a 12 inch rewritable CD-ROM drive.

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Bruce McGee
Phenomenal Film Handler

Posts: 1776
From: Asheville, NC USA... Nowhere in Particular.
Registered: Aug 1999


 - posted 08-23-2001 11:41 PM      Profile for Bruce McGee   Email Bruce McGee   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Mark G.:

My first station job ran all spots, and some shows on a threesome of Sony VO-2850 3/4" monsters. Talk about tapes jamming... Downstairs, we recorded the 3/4" tapes off of 2" originals with a pair of VO-2600's.

The station owner bought thousands of used KCA-60 tapes from Studio Tape Exchange in NYC. You saw alot of wrinkles on our air, not to mention TBC errors galore.

When our studio-to-transmitter microwave would die, I would drive the 19 miles with a load of pre-recorded programming to the transmitter site and load them in another 2850 that was there for such an emergency. At least we stayed on the air. You can imagine what our signal looked like.

There was a standing joke at the time:

Tune your TV to a dead UHF channel.

"You are watching Channel 17 on a good day!"

I still have a Sony VO-1200 player, a VO-1600 recorder, (yes, they do still work,)
and a Sony BVU-2008 that I use for the 300 or so master copies that I have.

I dubbed everything to VHS recently. Now, the 3/4" just sits there taking up space.


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Sean Weitzel
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 619
From: Vacaville, CA (1790 miles west of Rockwall)
Registered: Dec 1999


 - posted 08-24-2001 12:49 AM      Profile for Sean Weitzel   Email Sean Weitzel   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
the Avid M1000 system was a series of NuBus cards, software and a set of Mitsubishi(?) DiamondScan monitors for 68040 based Macintoshes (Quadras) that came available around 1993 or so. I clearly remember to this day getting to mess around on a setup belonging to a friend of the family (Pediatrician by day/video hobbiest by night-he could afford such toys). Bearing in mind that this was 1993, it was amazing to me to see not one but TWO 9 GIG scsi-2 hard drives tied to his Quadra 950 tied to these gorgeous monitors. I was amazed enough by the crude little 160 pixel 10 frame quicktime clips that had just come to be the norm on macs at the time. To see that quadra crank out BROADCAST quality FULL SCREEN video was almost unfathomable.

I believe it was a series of three cards, one was a motion jpeg card, one was a duel monitor card, and the third was a SCSI-2 raid type high speed hard disk interface.

very cool, VERY expensive at the time.. i think he said the system not incuding the mac cost approx $20,000. He still has it, i think.

-sean

(at this guy's house was also the first time i ever saw a Laserdisc player back in 1985. It was a top loading Maganvox. I vowed to have one of my own some day and finally did get a pioneer cld-990 in 1992)

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Joe Grace
Film Handler

Posts: 44
From: Maine
Registered: Feb 2000


 - posted 08-24-2001 05:17 PM      Profile for Joe Grace   Email Joe Grace   Send New Private Message       Edit/Delete Post 
Joe, Have you tried the Matrox RTmac? Does it realy do what it says? The Render times in Final Cut Pro is not all that bad unless you are aplying gama corection filters or other processor intensive filters. There are people at ILM using Final Cut Pro, I saw it on TechTV one day, it was some special talking about video editing and it suprised me to see that a piece of software that I thought to be a consumer level editing suite being used in such a high end application. Have you tried Final Cut Pro 2? Is it worth upgrading?


Joe

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