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Author Topic: Lets see more cinema pictures!! -> OT Computer data backup jabber Scott Norwood Film God Posts: 8146 From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas) Registered: Jun 99 posted 01-02-2008 09:55 PM                        The best bargain right now in backup technology is DLT7000 drives. They go for about $120 each on Ebay and the tapes hold 35 gigs native (tapes are $25-35 each). The format is stable and widely used, although it hasn't been in current production for several years. For higher capacity, look at LTO-3, which can write 400 gigs (native) to the tapes. DLT and LTO are not like the crappy QIC, 4mm, and 8mm tape drives of the past. They are well designed formats that rarely have issues. Restoring a single file is not a problem, unless you are using some really horrible backup software. The time to restore a file can vary widely depending upon how the backup was made. Some systems (e.g. AIX) actually let you make a bootable tape that will automatically restore the system in the event of a complete disk failure.  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 01-02-2008 10:00 PM                     And that is just it...we back up daily. For us, it is merely to avoid catestrophic crashes from destroying the data...it isn't to look back 5-years and see a snap shot of the hard drives. The streaming tapes have done us pretty well thus far. Steve  |  IP: Logged David Stambaugh Film God Posts: 4021 From: Eugene, Oregon Registered: Jan 2002 posted 01-02-2008 10:07 PM                        I'll put in a vote for Sony AIT. Been using AIT-1, -3, and now -4 drives and media for almost 5 years. I'm getting 300GB-400GB per AIT-4 media and averaging ~1.3GB/min. throughput which is still serving us well. I think AIT-5 is out now.  |  IP: Logged Mike Blakesley Film God Posts: 12767 From: Forsyth, Montana Registered: Jun 99 posted 01-02-2008 10:44 PM                        I've been doing a weekly "system" backup at our store using the same tapes for about 10 years. The system does a "verification" pass on the tape after writing it so it makes sure the data is all there. Never a problem. I'm kind of amazed the tapes all still work...I know it's risky but we've never had to restore a backup yet (knock wood) and in March we're replacing the whole system with one that does its backing up online, so I'm hangin' tough with the tapes.  |  IP: Logged Frank Angel Film God Posts: 5305 From: Brooklyn NY USA Registered: Dec 1999 posted 01-03-2008 05:58 AM                        We backup alternating between two Maxtor 250G external hard drives three times a week, and like Steve says, it isn't so much that you want to be able to go back years to find stuff, it's just in case your server blows up (in a place that had a major fire which gutted our complex AND the servers -- you tend to think more catastrophic than just a hard drive or two failure). But now we have a mutha of a server with 6 hot-swapable raid array and pretty much the physical box would have to blow up in order for you to really be in trouble. Aside from protection from really serious failures, our backup system really is there so that it lets us go back about two weeks, so we are protected from situations like Steve's where a User comes to me and says they accidently deleted or accidently changed a file but they want the earlier one back. I need to be able to go get that particular file and easily restore it. Does anyone do the off-site thing? I.e, you take at least some backup copies away from the building where the server resides? That's supposed to be important. And let me tell you, once you've had a major catastrophy, not to just the computer hardware but to the environment where the hardware sits, you are a little more impressed with the need for off-site backups. We are looking to using one of those internet companies for storage. Mike, how will you be handling this? What company are you going to go with, if you don't mind my asking. Do you find this backup method is cost-effective?  |  IP: Logged Rick Raskin Phenomenal Film Handler Posts: 1100 From: Manassas Virginia Registered: Jan 2003 posted 01-03-2008 07:21 AM                     We once used an off site independent backup facility. The only time we needed to retrieve a disk they were unable to locate it. We cancelled the contract but they continued to try and bill us. Now backups are done in house and reside on numerous servers both on and off site as well as archived tape.  |  IP: Logged Scott Norwood Film God Posts: 8146 From: Boston, MA. USA (1774.21 miles northeast of Dallas) Registered: Jun 99 posted 01-03-2008 08:04 AM                        Commercial off-site storage is generally a waste of money for smaller operations unless a) you are storing sensitive data or b) you have a huge quantity of media. It's generally easier and more cost-effective to get a safe-deposit box or send the tapes home with a trusted employee. Remember that in order to restore from the tapes in case of fire/flood or other situation in which your hardware is destroyed, you will need new hardware and also a copy of whatever backup software you used to do the backups (hopefully the same version). Another option (more for quick recovery from accidental deletions than for long-term storage) would be to have an off-site or colocated server somewhere and use "rsync" (or similar) to copy daily (,hourly, weekly...) changes to important files. This is mostly useful for business-critical stuff (accounting system, source code, etc.) than for someone's MP3 archive.  |  IP: Logged Tim Reed Better Projection Pays Posts: 5246 From: Northampton, PA Registered: Sep 1999 posted 01-03-2008 09:14 AM                       All of my Screen Attractions work is archived on OnStream 30GB DLT tapes. The (now defunct) OnStream drive and software are clunky at best to work with and I've never been happy with them. It can take forever to locate a file and get it off a tape, which always worries me. Further, I'm becoming increasingly concerned as the equipment and media age... I suppose DVD-ROM would be a good alternative?  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 01-03-2008 09:28 AM                     Our tapes do indeed leave the building (I guess with Elvis). As I'm not involved with that at all, I don't know the quantity of tapes or the frequency that things move about. I do know that there are tapes labeled with the days of the week that I've had to make sure were in the drive prior to leaving when the people that normally do that are on vacation and I was going to be in the office. Steve  |  IP: Logged Mike Blakesley Film God Posts: 12767 From: Forsyth, Montana Registered: Jun 99 posted 01-03-2008 10:33 AM                        quote: Frank Angel Mike, how will you be handling this? What company are you going to go with, if you don't mind my asking. Do you find this backup method is cost-effective? Frank - we are a Carquest store and we're switching to their new computer system which includes online backups as part of the package. For our own local stuff (checkbook and such) we just use a regular PC which I back up onto a CD-R every week or so.  |  IP: Logged Phil Hill I love my cootie bug Posts: 7595 From: Hollywood, CA USA Registered: Mar 2000 posted 01-03-2008 04:31 PM                  I use Maxtor external hard drives for backups. I keep one hidden here at home (in case of a break-in or theft of my computer) and a duplicate one at my parent's place in Texas. That way, if one or the other place gets destroyed, I still have a backup to restore from. I use a separate folder or a disk partition for all data on all my computers so it's easy to backup. Ya always can re-install the application/program...but it's the data and files that are important to safeguard. I would never use an online backup service...ya just don't know what they do with all your personal files and porno pics. I stopped using tape for backup YEARS ago...  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 01-03-2008 05:28 PM                     I have had my OS on a completely seperate drive for many years now and split up storage between two other drives, all are SCSI type drives and they've been very reliable over the past several years.... When I ran IDE type drives that "C" or OS drive always seems to be the one that dies for what ever reason. Phil's idea is good and with the hot pluggable drives on the 1550 I could keep an entire set of RAID 5 drives elsewhere and rotate them every once in a while. Mark  |  IP: Logged Monte L Fullmer Film God Posts: 8367 From: Nampa, Idaho, USA Registered: Nov 2004 posted 01-03-2008 08:32 PM                     What's the reasoning in not using any form of optical disc devices for HDD archiving? Using RAID systems, or mirrored HDDS for daily backups, that I can see.. I've never had a problem with the CD thing, but just curious.  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 01-03-2008 11:05 PM                     Using CD's is just not a "clean green" way to do it... How many of the silvery disks do you want all over the place or sent to the garbage dump? Even data tapes can be used over and over for many years before they go bad... Some might say re-writable CD ROMS's but I've had a few problems with those and they seem unpredictable. Ok for stuff thats not important though. Mark  |  IP: Logged Daryl C. W. O'Shea Film God Posts: 3977 From: Midland Ontario Canada (where Panavision & IMAX lenses come from) Registered: Jun 2002 posted 01-05-2008 12:30 AM                        quote: Monte L Fullmer What's the reasoning in not using any form of optical disc devices for HDD archiving? Optical media is none of reliable, media cost efficient, time/labour efficient or even practical in terms of storage capacity.  |  IP: Logged

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