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Author Topic: Adios, Windows XP Louis Bornwasser Film God Posts: 4441 From: prospect ky usa Registered: Mar 2005 posted 07-01-2008 05:16 AM                        I thought Dell was inundated with people sending back computers to have Vista surgically removed?? Louis  |  IP: Logged Patrick de Groot Expert Film Handler Posts: 161 From: Sprang-Capelle, Netherlands Registered: Apr 2001 posted 07-01-2008 05:27 AM                     Everyone who has a license of Vista Business (and Ultimate) may use XP legally. The question is how will you put XP on your computer? The casual user will have troubles with this. You have to get the correct SATA driver and put it on a floppy (yes an old 3,5" disk...), get a usb floppy drive and press F6 during setup. Another option is to integrate the driver on your install CD with nLite (great program). If you do not do this the XP setup program won't see any hard disk at all. An easier solution is to disable "SATA Native Mode" in the bios at the cost of some hard disk performace.  |  IP: Logged Steve Guttag We forgot the crackers Gromit!!! Posts: 12814 From: Annapolis, MD Registered: Dec 1999 posted 07-01-2008 06:57 AM                     Microsoft, IMHO, is making a huge mistake. They have a successful product that people want/like. What manufacturer wouldn't want that? They have a product that most do not want or need...yet they feel the need to force people to it. There is no reason to force the discontinuation of XP. Microsoft's practice is one of a monopolistic company. It would not surprise me to see the governments to get involved on this. Forcing a person/entity to purchase a product that they do not want can only be viewed as monopolistic. There just isn't any more realistic choice out there for computer platforms...Yes there is Linux and Macs but be realistic...PCs with Windows is BY FAR the most installed base. I've been using Macs since 1984 like many others....Myself, I only own Macs but at work I use PCs...my wife's laptop is a PC. The cinema industry only writes programs for PCs. Way back when I was in college...I used my Macs to program....PCs. My senior project was a graphics card that only worked in PCs (back when Win 3.xx was current...it used the TIGA interface). As the PC market has matured, the need/desire to upgrade has deminished as the new features only seem desirable to progressively fewer people. For the most part...people just want a stable operating system that works...as glitch free as possible. Those of us that lived through DOS saw it happen there....after 3.x came out...it went into a slow-down...DOS 5 was pretty good for me...but then Microsoft felt the need to go to 6.XX and at first what a nightmare it was. I know many that did not go beyond 3.2 or 5.0 (4 was short lived). As Windows matured...it took until 3.0 before it started to become more stable...and then Windows 95 before it behaved more like an operating system than a program running under DOS. Then Win98 made some decent improvements over Win95 but not necessarily essential to have...until Win98 second edition. Then WinXP came out...again not essential to have, at first..in fact XP, at first, meant Xtra Problems. Then it seemed to become MUCH more stable and programs were written to run on XP and it too became essential. Just where is the essentialness to Vista? It seems like software manufacturers are making patches to their programs just so they will run under the stupid thing. XP, by and large, has been stable for me since we made the switch (not when it first came out). In fact, I'm not too sure about SP3 being such a great idea and I had some problems after it was loaded on my puter by our "IT guy." SP2 always worked pretty well for me. When I have something that works, I like to stick with it. Heck, I have a MAC runining OS 7.1 and Word 5.2 (Mac SE/30, that I've had since it was a mere Mac SE in 1988) because they are just that stable. At the end of the day, I want something that works...more than something that has features that I neither need nor want. If Microsoft was not working in a monopolistic environment...this Vista debacle SHOULD be the door that other manufacturers could capitalize on. Steve  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 07-01-2008 08:44 AM                     There are lots and lots of new copies of OEM XP Pro out there still for purchase so obtaining a copy should be pretty easy for quite some time. Mark  |  IP: Logged Bobby Henderson "Ask me about Trajan." Posts: 10973 From: Lawton, OK, USA Registered: Apr 2001 posted 07-01-2008 09:01 AM                     I think Apple has been trying to capitalize on the issue. But Apple has NEVER understood just how difficult it is to migrate from the Windows platform over to Mac. You're not just buying Apple branded computing hardware at a significant premium. You get to buy all of your applications all over again, if they're all available. Some of your existing peripherals may not work with a Mac. You get to deal with problems in opening and editing documents and other files you created on PC. There's even lots of problems with the damned fonts! Adobe is one of very few companies that have been making any serious efforts to deal with those issues. I thought it was pretty cool for Apple to switch over to using Intel processors in their systems. That made it possible for users to natively run both WinXP and OSX in the same machine without any performance robbing emulation. It gave users who were serious about the PC>Mac switch an actual transition path rather than the far less practical solution. Now with Microsoft pulling the plug on XP that sort of changes the situation. Can a Intel-based Mac dual boot Vista and OSX? The first service pack for Vista was released earlier this year, and that was supposed to address a lot of the problems. If previous history still can be used as a valid example to follow, it might be worth waiting for Vista SP2. WinXP didn't really "mature" until the SP2 release. Win98 wasn't all that great until OSR2. quote: Mark Gulbrandsen There are lots and lots of new copies of OEM XP Pro out there still for purchase so obtaining a copy should be pretty easy for quite some time. I wonder how long Microsoft will allow those discs to be activated. Oh the joys of software that phones home for validation.  |  IP: Logged Chris Slycord Film God Posts: 2986 From: 청주시, 경북도, South Korea Registered: Mar 2007 posted 07-01-2008 09:22 AM                     And that article quotes an expert that "Apple doesn't push their customers." This is like some Apple fanboys making fun of Vista by saying "You should never have to upgrade your hardware just to upgrade the OS" which I found all sorts of ironic considering that OS X no longer supports G3's and most G4's (owners of those had to upgrade their hardware to upgrade the OS). Note: I know those are old, obsolete now and probably would need to be upgraded anyway; just pointing out the hypocrisy of the statement. 2nd note: Not saying I'm a fan of Vista (it's crap).  |  IP: Logged Randy Stankey Film God Posts: 6539 From: Erie, Pennsylvania Registered: Jun 99 posted 07-01-2008 10:42 AM                     You've got to admit that, even though it hasn't always been foolproof, Apple has gone to lengths to make sure that software is as backward-compatible as it can be. When OS 9 was upgraded to OS X they already had Carbon in place so that compliant apps would just run in OS X without much trouble. Non-compliant apps could still be run by dual booting. They also had the classic layer in which OS 9 apps could be run without having to reboot into OS 9. When they changed to the Intel processor Apple created Rosetta which allows PPC-based apps to be translated to the Intel. There are always times when improvements in operating system features make backward compatibility impossible but Apple has tried to ensure that everything is compatible as it can be. Just last night, I ran the old "VR MakePano" Quicktime program I downloaded from Apple's developer site in 1999. Worked perfectly! Try to run 10 year old software with Vista!  |  IP: Logged Bobby Henderson "Ask me about Trajan." Posts: 10973 From: Lawton, OK, USA Registered: Apr 2001 posted 07-01-2008 10:58 AM                     Don't know about Vista, but lots of ancient applications can run on XP.  |  IP: Logged Chris Slycord Film God Posts: 2986 From: 청주시, 경북도, South Korea Registered: Mar 2007 posted 07-01-2008 11:19 AM                     They already removed the classic layer though. Classic is not supported in Mac OS X v10.5 Leopard, or on Intel Macs. Though I disagree that Apple has tried to make things be as backwards compatible as they can be. I believe they make things as backwards compatible as they want it to be. Originally, they NEEDED the compatibility to get people to even consider purchasing OS X. But now the vast majority of users who have OS X have gotten it through a new computer so the backwards compatibility need is nowhere near as great. Note: I'm not blaming them for doing this. I just hate hypocrites who make get mad at one company for doing something that their favorite company does already. edit: And I'm not referring to you, Randy, as one of the hypocrites; just to be clear.  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 07-01-2008 11:27 AM                     quote: Bobby Henderson I wonder how long Microsoft will allow those discs to be activated. Oh the joys of software that phones home for validation. In the past its typically been up to the time MS stops all updates and support for a given OS. That has been two to three years with past OS's. Mark  |  IP: Logged Chris Slycord Film God Posts: 2986 From: 청주시, 경북도, South Korea Registered: Mar 2007 posted 07-01-2008 11:32 AM                     They've said they're supporting XP up until 2013 so that sounds like XPs gonna be the longest-supported OS by them ever. Plus, they're still having XP installed on new embedded computers for niche markets. So that helps push them to keep it supported.  |  IP: Logged Mark Gulbrandsen Resident Trollmaster Posts: 16657 From: Music City Registered: Jun 99 posted 07-01-2008 11:37 AM                     Gee, thats a year past when the Inca's predicted the end of the earth... so thats a good thing. XP-Pro till the end of time . Mark  |  IP: Logged Damien Taylor Master Film Handler Posts: 493 From: Perth, Western Australia Registered: Apr 2007 posted 07-01-2008 11:46 AM                     pfft, 3.11 for workgroups is much better than XP  |  IP: Logged Bobby Henderson "Ask me about Trajan." Posts: 10973 From: Lawton, OK, USA Registered: Apr 2001 posted 07-01-2008 12:19 PM                     Please explain how Win 3.11 is better than XP in specifics.  |  IP: Logged Joe Redifer You need a beating today Posts: 12859 From: Denver, Colorado Registered: May 99 posted 07-01-2008 05:07 PM                        He's just jivin' quote: Bobby Henderson Can a Intel-based Mac dual boot Vista and OSX? Yes, has been able to since day one.  |  IP: Logged

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