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Topic: STAR WARS The Force Awakens getting great reviews

Mike Blakesley
Film God

Posts: 12767
From: Forsyth, Montana
Registered: Jun 99

posted 12-22-2015 11:58 AM

quote: Bobby Henderson
Not around here, and this isn't even the big city. Ticket averages could only dip anywhere near $8 by including every discount available at theaters and equally weighing small town theater ticket prices against bigger city theaters that have far more customer traffic.

Uh....that is why I used the word AVERAGE. According to NATO the nationwide AVERAGE price was $8.14 last year. I think it's around $8.60 so far this year, thanks mostly to our "friends" at Imax.

Also even though more people live in big cities, not everybody does. Why shouldn't you have to "equally weigh small town theater ticket prices against bigger city theaters?" Everybody is seeing the same movies, after all. Why shouldn't smaller towns get to figure into the average?

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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001

posted 12-22-2015 02:11 PM

Small town theaters don't draw nearly as many customers as bigger city multiplex theaters.

To me, that $8 average looks like NATO is using a crude, vague Location A versus Location B formula, comparing what the two theaters are charging for ticket prices and averaging only from that. I don't think they're factoring the issue Location B might have 100 times the customer traffic of Location A yet is charging quite a lot more for tickets than Location A. NATO may not even be adjusting their average for how many people watch matinee shows versus how many pay full price for evening shows.

That very example can play out right here in my region. Someone could see Star Wars in digital 3D at the Liberty Theater in Carnegie, OK for just $6. But that's a little theater in a little town an hour's drive from Lawton. It's not drawing anywhere near as many people as the new Carmike theater on Lawton's west side.

Even in the new Carmike things are going to skew in favor of the IMAX-branded house rather than the standard priced auditoriums charging between $4 and $7 less for the same show. The IMAX house has a lot more seats than the other auditoriums and is getting the most favored show times. Customers have to carefully and deliberately pick one of the smaller houses to see the movie, especially if they're wanting to avoid 3D.

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Mike Blakesley
Film God

Posts: 12767
From: Forsyth, Montana
Registered: Jun 99

posted 12-22-2015 02:27 PM

In the big picture when you're talking about an average, nobody gives a crap about any of that qualifying stuff.

What are they supposed to do, put out a whole list of different averages based on different sized cities or different-formatted theaters or different-aged theaters?

An average is just that, an AVERAGE. It doesn't make a bit of difference whether some places draw more than others. Anybody knows that a small town is going to be below the average and a big town will be higher.

At the end of the day it's just a number for the industry to use in the media, that's all.

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Claude S. Ayakawa
Film God

Posts: 2738
From: Waipahu, Hawaii, USA
Registered: Aug 2002

posted 12-22-2015 03:09 PM

Getting back on topic, I am now at a Sam's Club snack bar downstairs enjoying a hot dog /drink and waiting for the 12:30 pm showing of STAR WARS The Force Awakens in 3D at the Regal Pearl Highland Theatre in their largest house that seats about 600 and has a nice wide scope screen. Unfortunately, it does not have Atmos. I had planned to see SWTFA at the Dole Cannery in IMAX but their 3D shows at 4:00 in the afternoon is too late and hard to fit into my schedule. I was not planning to see the movie so soon after it had opened but I do not think I will have any problem getting a good. seat especially when 3D showings are not too popular compared to 2D. Based on the reviews and favorable comments
here snd elsewhere I am now very eager to see the movie and I will post my
comments after I see it

-Claude

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Claude S. Ayakawa
Film God

Posts: 2738
From: Waipahu, Hawaii, USA
Registered: Aug 2002

posted 12-22-2015 08:17 PM

I just saw STAR WARS The Force Awakens and as expected, the movie was great! All the three movies in the original trilogy were equally good and this one fits right in. The presentation in house 12 at Regal's Pearl Highland was perfect with a very nice film like image and the 3D was fantastic as well as the sound with s lot of deep LFE from the theatre's sub woofers. I rate SWTFA four out of four stars.

-Claude

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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001

posted 12-23-2015 11:35 AM

quote: Mike Blakesley
In the big picture when you're talking about an average, nobody gives a crap about any of that qualifying stuff.

If nobody gives a crap about the "qualifying stuff" then the reporting of those stats, in big headlines, is just another example of the media insulting the intelligence of the general public. Dollar grosses, averages, etc. are pretty worthless without the qualifying stuff.

Here's a stat I would find impressive: "100 million people went to theaters to see Star Wars." That kind of stat would be impressive in any decade and not be subject to things like ticket price inflation.

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Mike Blakesley
Film God

Posts: 12767
From: Forsyth, Montana
Registered: Jun 99

posted 12-23-2015 12:42 PM

My comment about the "qualifiers" was a response to you stating that "smaller places" shouldn't be included in the average price, because (you think) it makes the price seem artificially low. That's why I said "in the big picture."

Of course all the individual stats are important but NOT when you're computing an average. If you want to break it down further that's fine, but an average is an average. You HAVE to include all the variables in the picture if you want to get an accurate average.

If you were applying your logic to ticket sales numbers, then the media might say the average theater had (for example) 1000 people seeing the movie over the weekend, but you would say the number should be closer to 5000 because the "small" places shouldn't be counted into the average because they don't get the same amount of traffic as the "big" places.

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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001

posted 12-23-2015 01:52 PM

I never said the small theaters should not be counted. They should be counted, but with the price affecting the average according to their number of tickets sold versus other theaters.

If theater A sells 1000 tickets at $6 a piece and theater B sells 10000 tickets at $18 a piece there is no way that average ticket price is going to be $12. But that's how I suspect NATO is pushing things.

IMAX says $48 million of Star Wars opening weekend revenue came from its screens, $30.1 million of it in the US on 391 screens. That seems pretty impressive until those dollar values are divided by the ticket prices, most of which included additional 3D surcharges. Our local Carmike's IMAX screen had no 2D shows of Star Wars and only one of the three standard priced screens showing the movie was running it in 2D. Using a $15 per ticket value (which is on the low side), a little over 3 million tickets may have been sold opening weekend. The actual number may be fewer than that.

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Mike Blakesley
Film God

Posts: 12767
From: Forsyth, Montana
Registered: Jun 99

posted 12-23-2015 03:35 PM

quote: Bobby Henderson
I never said the small theaters should not be counted. They should be counted, but with the price affecting the average according to their number of tickets sold versus other theaters.

Well then, like I said, it's not an industry average anymore. It's got a lot of qualfiers attached when makes it confusing. Confusing isn't good when you're dealing in small sound bites.

quote: Bobby Henderson
If theater A sells 1000 tickets at $6 a piece and theater B sells 10000 tickets at $18 a piece there is no way that average ticket price is going to be $12. But that's how I suspect NATO is pushing things.

Nope. They just take ALL the tickets reported sold and ALL the money reported and divide the money by the tickets. It's as simple as that. In the example you gave, the average would be $16.91 per ticket.

We might as well quit debating this because it's pointless anyway. They SHOULD report the number of butts in seats, but the dollars are a much bigger number, thus more exciting.

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Steve Matz
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 672
From: Billings, Montana, USA
Registered: Sep 2003

posted 12-23-2015 08:18 PM

No matter how you look at it; This Film is going to make an Absurd amount of Money just on it's theater run. Then the Blu-ray will follow and that will start out at $22.00 or higher. It just pisses me off that a large Chain like CARMIKE acts like there giving you the best of everything. Refill your Popcorn Bucket and will give a theater size Candy for 2 dollars. I can walk across the Street and buy the same thing at the Dollar tree for a Buck. If they weren't going to install a true IMAX Facility then they don't need to be charging the same amount per person as a legitimate IMAX Facility. I'm done with both Carmike Theaters in this Town. After you get Hosed enough times; you almost start asking the employees there if that Price includes the Vasoline also... [thumbsdown]

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Mike Blakesley
Film God

Posts: 12767
From: Forsyth, Montana
Registered: Jun 99

posted 12-23-2015 08:46 PM

See that's what I mean about you dumping on everything.

The Carmike "Imax" IS a true Imax -- Imax has changed the definition of what an Imax is. It used to be a premium experience with a five-stories-tall screen -- now it's just a little larger screen and dual projectors. But Carmike didn't do that, Imax did when they started whoring out their brand. Can't blame Carmike for wanting to jump on that train.

As for the prices ... you should know the difference in economics between whatever is across the street, and a movie theater. Theaters HAVE to have higher prices in order to make enough profits. Even here, it's about 3x as much for a 32oz soda as it is at the convenience store. It's just a fact of life. No amount of complaining is ever going to change it.

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James Wyrembelski
Expert Film Handler

Posts: 114
From: Beaverton, MI, USA
Registered: Sep 2015

posted 12-24-2015 01:50 AM

I always laugh when people bring that up

I serve beer all day....the same six pack they could get for 5-6 dollars costs 16.50 at the bar....they could easily go next door to the convenience store and get an average domestic six pack for about 10.00 less and go home....yet they still come in and pay it. in the service industry you pay for service and availability....not necessarily the item itself...

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Steve Matz
Jedi Master Film Handler

Posts: 672
From: Billings, Montana, USA
Registered: Sep 2003

posted 12-24-2015 02:51 AM

Gee Mike since you seem to think your the Big Wheel up here, do we need your permission to say anything Negative about anything. Your the one just awhile back calling it LIEMAX. Now your saying it's OK. Ask people that saw real IMAX Presentations and see what there opinion is when they have to pay the same price for what there showing now !

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Bobby Henderson
"Ask me about Trajan."

Posts: 10973
From: Lawton, OK, USA
Registered: Apr 2001

posted 12-24-2015 09:19 AM

I've seen some small "Lie-MAX" auditoriums, but that one in Billings is setting a new standard for tiny. Unfortunately that tiny size doesn't extend to the ticket price. It's roughly the same price as the new IMAX screen here in Lawton, and that theater is at least a respectable size. I'd be pretty pissed off if I paid top dollar for the IMAX Experience and then walked into a room to see a screen that small. I'd probably walk right back out of the theater and get a refund.

As for concessions prices, they've always been high. It's common knowledge the snack counter is really what helps keep the doors open and light bill paid at the theater. It is worth noting over the past five years snack counter prices have gotten a bit ridiculous around here. $7 or $8 for a large drink? Really?

quote: James Wyrembelski
I serve beer all day....the same six pack they could get for 5-6 dollars costs 16.50 at the bar....they could easily go next door to the convenience store and get an average domestic six pack for about 10.00 less and go home....yet they still come in and pay it.

For most bars the price of admission is worked into those drink prices. Bars do have to compete with each other on pricing and even do additional things to keep a crowd interested in the place. I've seen plenty of bars and night clubs here in Lawton go bust very quickly by assuming they could charge whatever they wanted on drinks or even a cover charge. If you're lucky enough to be running a hang-out that's drawing attractive women then you'll have more freedom to charge more for drinks and even tack on a cover charge.

quote: Mike Blakesley
Nope. They just take ALL the tickets reported sold and ALL the money reported and divide the money by the tickets. It's as simple as that. In the example you gave, the average would be $16.91 per ticket.

I have my doubts. I think NATO is putting in every ingredient it can find to skew that average ticket price number as low as it can -kind of like how the government's inflation figures are reported deliberately excluding fuel and food costs, things that consume a big portion of "little people" pay checks.

quote: Mike Blakesley
We might as well quit debating this because it's pointless anyway. They SHOULD report the number of butts in seats, but the dollars are a much bigger number, thus more exciting.

The media only thinks the dollar figures are exciting. It's not exciting to me at all. I'm not getting any of that money. It's nothing for a movie to gross $100 million now. That can be done with less than 10 million tickets sold, or only 6 million tickets if we're talking IMAX pricing. A movie can be a financial failure while grossing $100 million or $200 million. We're living in a time now where some companies have posted over $10 billion in profits in just one quarter. Some petroleum companies were doing that before the industry hit its current bust cycle. Exxon-Mobil has a market capitalization of nearly $400 billion. Apple is currently worth over $700 billion. And I'm supposed to be impressed by some raw dollar figure on how much a movie made -and it's just in the hundreds of millions?

Dollar grosses like $100 million were impressive back when it was dirt cheap to go to the movies. When I was a kid living in Yuma, AZ all four in my family could pay $2 for the car load to see a movie at the drive-in theater. That was the age where Jaws crossed the $100 million mark. That was damned impressive.

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Mike Blakesley
Film God

Posts: 12767
From: Forsyth, Montana
Registered: Jun 99

posted 12-24-2015 03:44 PM

quote: Steve Matz
Gee Mike since you seem to think your the Big Wheel up here, do we need your permission to say anything Negative about anything. Your the one just awhile back calling it LIEMAX. Now your saying it's OK.

I didn't say it was OK, I just said it is what it is. Just like when Coke changed their formula, it wasn't the same Coke but it was still Coke.

I never said it was good -- I said Imax was whoring out their brand and I haven't backed off from that. It's still Liemax.

You can post all the negative comments you want, but when you are constantly posting stuff like:

quote: Steve Matz
After you get Hosed enough times; you almost start asking the employees there if that Price includes the Vasoline also...

it just gets a little old. (That's just my own opinion, I'm not in charge of anything around here.) Carmike isn't doing anything that any other big chain isn't doing. And they keep saying that the Billings theater is one of their better performers. Of course that's mostly because they're the only game in town.

quote: Bobby Henderson
I have my doubts. I think NATO is putting in every ingredient it can find to skew that average ticket price number as low as it can

I highly doubt that. The average number isn't even generated by NATO -- it's done by an independent accounting firm. NATO doesn't receive the data from the theaters, the accounting firm gets it directly. Of course they are including discount theaters and small places because (like I have said before) it's an AVERAGE PRICE based on all of domestic exhibition. I guess if you don't want to believe that, it's your privilege.

quote: Bobby Henderson
The media only thinks the dollar figures are exciting. It's not exciting to me at all.

Just because you don't find something exciting, doesn't mean the rest of the world feels the same way. I frequently have people saying things like "I heard this movie did $150 million!" and you can tell they like those kinds of info bits. People like it when something that they like does well. It's human nature.

quote: Bobby Henderson
Unfortunately that tiny size doesn't extend to the ticket price.

That's because the cost of the projection and sound equipment is fairly close to the same across these kinds of retro-fit installations. If they had an 80 foot screen instead of the 50, or whatever, they'd probably still use a similar projector (or one that costs about the same $) and sound system.

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