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Posted by Thomas Ferreira (Member # 96) on 08-07-1999, 01:20 AM:
I was going to bring this up in the Thomas Crown Affair thread, but I figured I'd just start a new one. I didn't sneak the picture, but I did receive a used print for my booking(I have no idea why I'm playing this film instead of Mystery Men or Sixth Sense, but that's neither here nor there). Anyway, I was dismayed and shocked to see that each reel was marked with the dreaded SHOE POLISH!!! Who the hell is still doing this? We ceased this practice years ago when we found out what it can do to a DTS reader, not to mention the projector, polish slopped on the soundtrack, etc. I hate the Zebra tape, because I can never find it quick enough when doing a breakdown. My DM sent my the latest this week, yellow tape the width of cue tape to mark the changes, but I found it difficult to apply, so I went back to my old method-I trim a small Avery sticker, and fold it over under the reel change splice, taking care not to overlap the soundtrack. I rely on this, and the film stock changes when breaking down, and it never takes me more than 15 or 20 minutes, depending on which platter I'm breaking down off of. I'm curious to know others methods for marking reel changes.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 08-07-1999, 03:18 AM:
It sounds as if your method is fullproof, however it still takes extra time during buildup. Usually when a print is resting on a platter, you can literally count each reel as they are all slightly different in color than the others. When you stop at a color change in the film, it is either a reel change or a lab splice. I usually use zebra tape just so I can tell the reel changes apart from the lab splices at a glance. Very rarely do I have problems finding the splice.
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 08-07-1999, 03:30 AM:
Thomas, first you should mention this thread in the Thomas Crown forum so people will know it is there. (But starting another one is certainly fine.) This is yet another example of the poor service Technicolor is offering to the movie industry.In reference to your question, I use nothing. I build up with ultrasonic splices and the theater across the street must HATE ME for it when they get a built up print from me! 
I am against leaving an identification frame on the leader and making any mark on the film that isn't removable. Care to swing by and break down a print one day? So how do I do it?
Putting the ultrasonic splices aside (as they're damn near impossible to find) with a "tape" spliced print...gently curl the film in between your "bird" finger and thumb as you are breaking down. When you see a reel change coming up (by the color shade difference on the edge of the roll) start "feeling" for the splice. Trust me, you will definitely feel a tape splice run through your fingers with the film slightly curled! No need for zebra tape either.
Another tip I can offer is to take a piece of masking tape and put it on the edge of all the reels with the reel number and a "-" mark at the full point. This way, you will know how much film is supposed to be on each reel, if there is any question. Just make sure to always make your marks with masking tape or should the practice become widespread, you won't be able to tell the new marks from the old ones.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 08-07-1999, 05:06 AM:
I guess I should have mentioned that I replace the cement lab splices with a clear tape splice, hence why I use zebra only at reel changes. I find that a single missing frame is far less annoying and distracting that a big, white, ugly cement splice rolling by with possible sound cut outs (Dolby Digital is far from perfect, even with penthouse readers). Everyone in the audience will see the lab splice. Maybe .001% will notice a missing frame. I have also noticed many times that the very first and last frame of a reel is slightly fubar'd. If so, off it goes.
Posted by Thomas Ferreira (Member # 96) on 08-07-1999, 06:56 AM:
I do leave two identification frames on the head and tail when making up, but I have received used prints with as many as eight or ten! I'll never understand why some people need so many.
The reason I don't use the Zebra tape, is that someone in our company bought a big supply of red tape. You can't see it anyway.
When I first came into my theater, there were two splicers there. Neither worked. One of the conditions of me becoming manager was to get a functional splicer. I just figured it would be a pain to have to keep switching the rolls of tape. Maybe I can get an ultrasonic splicer by 2010.
Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 08-07-1999, 09:34 AM:
Brad--do you lose frames when breaking down a print that was spliced together with an ultrasonic splicer? The main reason why I don't like cement splices (on acetate-base prints) is that two frames are lost at each splice, whereas good clear splicing tape can easily be peeled without the need to make a new cut when splicing leaders back on for shipping.
When I was working in a theatre with 6000' reels, I did all the inspection and breakdown with clear tape. I didn't even have zebra tape that was easily accessible, since I was afraid that someone would use it for a repair splice (which defeats the purpose of zebra tape) or for splicing head and tail leaders back on for shipping (which just looks really tacky to me). Besides, clear tape is cheaper and Neumade tape peels more easily than the zebra tape that I had (not sure of the brand). Since this was a single-screen house, I usually just watched the film on the last show and used little strips of paper inserted in the take-up reel to mark the reel changes.
In most cases, it would take me about an hour or so to inspect a print and rewind it heads-out on 6000' house reels. Actually, it takes about the same amount of time to inspect a print for 2000' reels, since I had to measure out each set of cue marks (and add them if needed). I don't know how long print breakdown took, since I usually broke down the first large reel while the second one was running. Often, for the last show of a film, I'd rewind the last 2000' onto a separate reel, so that I could have the entire print (except for the last reel) broken down, labelled, and banded before the end of the show.
Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 08-07-1999, 09:52 AM:
I should probably also mention that I actually enjoy print inspection (am I the only one who does? what is wrong with me?), and tend to be quite particular about it. I always remove automation tape from the image area (does anyone know how to get it off of the sprocket-hole edge? I've had very little success in this regard.); also, I always replace lab splices or zebra/opaque repair splices with clear tape. I also am pretty particular about print breakdown, labelling each reel with the film title, picture format (flat/1.33, flat/1.66, flat/1.85, scope), analog sound format (Dolby A, Dolby SR, mono), reel number, and head or tail. If the print is in unusually poor condition, I include a note to the next theatre with my name, the theatre name and phone number, and the date, and an explanation of the damage and a statement that the print arrived in that type of condition and that we didn't cause it.
If a print arrives without head or tail leaders, I return it with countdowns (salvaged from old trailers) on reels #1 and 4 and clear leader at the head and tail of every reel.
This was probably a bit excessive, but I think that it was mostly a reaction to having received a lot of prints in godawful condition and a faint hope that someone might actually appreciate receiving a print that could be shown without repairs. I would say that fewer than one in ten prints that I have handled have actually arrived from the distributor in fully runnable condition.
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 08-07-1999, 12:40 PM:
As to automation tape on the edges, the trick is to pick at one end until it is loose, then pull upwards at a 45 degree angle at a moderate/slow speed very steadily. Most of the time it will pull right off that way. Change your angle or speed during the strip and it will break.Gotta love having that second projector for those Thursday night breakdowns! Even if running platter, the last reel could be pulled off and ran separately without the chance of making a tiny mark on the first few feet on the last reel from the "break the splice" platter trick.
Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 08-09-1999, 02:07 PM:
I don't usually have problems finding the ends of reels when I break down. First, you can find the ends of reels because of the difference in the color. Second, I put my (gloved) finger on the corner of the print and feel the splice go by as the print spins. The first time you don't feel the splice, stop. By the time you get the plater stopped, the splice will usually land right on the reel. (I slow way down when I get close)I guess it takes a little practice but after a while, it's easy.A lot of other guys here at TT17 put tape at the splices or stick little clips of film in between. To me, it takes too much time. As far as I'm concerned, the more time you save the more you have to splice it back together right.
Posted by Alan Brandt (Member # 426) on 04-12-2000, 01:48 AM:
In the past, I have seen people use tape to mark splices between the reels, but I have figured out a way to do this without ever missing a splice. AUTOMATICALLY. Before I breakdown a movie I find all the necessary splices in the movie. Then I simply use a utility knife to gouge a notch in the print. Because the breakdown table rewinds so fast, it causes that sucker to rip when it gets to one of thoses tears. I'd say only 75% of the time, the rip will cause the reel to stop suddenly, and pull the breakdown table into the platter. But in any case, when that does happen the platter stops anyway because the 3 amp fuse at the base of the SPECO platter has blown. Only once have I broken down a movie while a show was playing on the same platter and this occured, but it was a dumb movie so it didn't matter anyway.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 04-12-2000, 02:31 AM:
Um, do you want to elaborate on that method? The way I understand it, you are physically damaging the print when you are breaking it down. The idea is to keep the print in as good of condition as possible. Better than the condition you recieved it in.
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 04-12-2000, 02:46 AM:
Alan, ever hear of slowing the platter down as the splice is nearing? Not to be too rude here, but that method is definitely damaging the first and last few feet of each reel and if I ever get a print that you have broken down, you can damn well bet your theater will get charged for it because I will reject it. It's sloppy and uncaring film handling any way you word it.
Posted by Dustin Mitchell (Member # 372) on 04-12-2000, 09:56 AM:
Maybe you guys should lighten up a bit. I think it is fairly obvious he is joking. I mean, what person would post that here, even if they did do it. Besides, the parts about it yanking the makeup table into the platters 75% of the time and blowing the fuse kindof gives it away, doesn't it?
Posted by John Walsh (Member # 168) on 04-12-2000, 12:07 PM:
I thought it was a joke, too, but I've heard some totally crazy stuff from people trying to project, so....
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 04-12-2000, 12:25 PM:
People generally associate a wink ( 
) with a joke or make some notation of it. The way it was written, I believe it is not only true, but that he is very proud of his automatic breakdown method.(Alan, if you are indeed joking you should consider wording things a bit more carefully in the future. You should also respond to this thread if you were just making a poor joke. It doesn't look good on you.)
Posted by Dustin Mitchell (Member # 372) on 04-12-2000, 12:46 PM:
I agree, a smiley would have helped. And even if people do crazy stuff like that to film I just can't believe they'd post it here, unless of course they are trolling.
Posted by Tom Ferreira (Member # 70) on 04-12-2000, 06:18 PM:
Reread the last sentence of his post, and tell me he's not joking with us. I don't know any projectionist that would treat a Pauly Shore film differently from a Steven Spielberg film.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 04-12-2000, 08:44 PM:
Judging by some of Alan's other posts it really is hard to say. He really should indicate if he is joking. Most of his other posts are littered with an abundance of smileys to the point where they are annoying. But this one had none. There are a lot of dumbasses out there who don't know what they do is bad (or don't care). That's why I asked that he elaborate. If it does not come off as he intended it to, then he has a problem communicating his message. That's why I always use smileys or (J/K)'s when I am joking. I don't want to take a chance that ANYONE will take me seriously and think I am an idiot.I think that there are a lot of projectionists that will treat film differently based on what it is. I've heard comments before like "Oh that movie is not doing very well, so who cares if it is dirty?" Just because you don't personally know any doesn't mean that they don't exist.
End of discussion.
Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 04-14-2000, 03:12 AM:
quote:
Originally posted by Tom Ferreira:
I don't know any projectionist that would treat a Pauly Shore film differently from a Steven Spielberg film.
The gouges wouldn't need to be so deep in a Spielberg feature as they generally run at least twice the length of a Pauly Shore film and as such, the added weight would compensate for the lack of 'gouge depth' and would pull the film apart more easily.
But I should think that would be the ONLY time they would be treated differently.
------------------
"It's not the years honey, it's the mileage".
Indiana Jones.
Posted by Ari Nordström (Member # 288) on 04-14-2000, 08:34 AM:
I'm with Brad here; I don't usually mark reel changes in any way. That is, I don't when I'm not screening archive prints. When I do, however, during film festivals where a print is made up in my booth and broken down in the booth across the street, I always use small stickers and place them _above_ the clear tape I use, between the frames. These stickers are small and barely noticeable on the screen except to a trained eye, but they nicely mark the reel change and save a lot of time for that other booth, especially when the print is used and comes with a hundred splices in each reel...
Edge inspection of the print is necessary, of course, to find the splice at all.
Nice thing about those stickers that they come in different colours and sizes. During film festivals I sometimes use obscure colour codes to confuse my colleagues... 
Posted by John Pytlak (Member # 331) on 04-14-2000, 10:42 AM:
Wonder if splicing tape manufacturers would consider a tape that had a single 0.10 inch wide colored stripe across the tape for each splice, so the colored strip could be placed only over the perforations on the side of the film OPPOSITE the Dolby Digital track? Current "Zebra Tape" was a good idea, but the wide colored stipes on the framelines can certainly be seen on the screen (especially for "scope"). And nothing should interfere with reading any of the soundtracks.IMHO, any splicing or marking technique that can cause a sound default/pop, or is visible on the screen should NOT be used.
------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Eastman Kodak Company
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7419
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: 716-477-5325 Fax: 716-722-7243
E-Mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 04-14-2000, 03:13 PM:
John: Hitchhike to my theatre and I'll turn off the ultrasonic splicer just long enough to show you how to use zebra tape. The bar should NOT go across the frameline. Tacky! But otherwise I agree.
Posted by Dustin Mitchell (Member # 372) on 04-14-2000, 06:23 PM:
I had an idea the other day. I've heard about the white shoe polish method of marking splices. Now I know this is a bad idea becuase it covers up the SDDS/Dolby tracks and can drip down into the optical tracks and even the picture. BUT, what if you marked the buttom edge of the film (opposite the soundtrack)? This wouldn't do any of the above damage to the film.Now I know what your all think, "Yeah, but you can't see that when your tearing down, how the hell is it supposed to help?" Well, how about rewinding the print upside down the last show? I down becuase of the natural curl in the film it should be wound emulsion out (soundtrack up), but doing this for one show wouldn't warp the film would it?
Posted by Ian Price (Member # 14) on 04-14-2000, 06:27 PM:
The long and the short of it is;I don't need to mark the splice to see it or to find it when breaking down a print. Our booth is poorly lit but I still don't need to mark the film and you shouldn't either.
Just think, Brad Miller uses ultrasonic splices and he doesn't mark the edge of the film. An ultrasonic splice must be twice as hard to find as a clear tape splice. And yet, I assume, Brad has no trouble breaking down his prints.
Posted by Dustin Mitchell (Member # 372) on 04-14-2000, 06:35 PM:
Well, before I get to many responses let me clarify, I have no need for splice marking either. I am in the same boat as you Ian, poorly lit booth. But I still find the splices just fine. I just thought that some people night not be able to.
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 04-14-2000, 06:46 PM:
Lately I have taken to leaving the inboard edge "tab" on the ultrasonic splices to make breakdown more operator friendly, as I have recently found it does not affect the stability in the gate. This makes them not too difficult to find. However, before I trimmed both edges perfectly and once I showed each operator the correct way to hold the film during breakdown, wasn't a problem for them either.I think the best solution is the old idea of mine to put a strip of tape on the side of the reel and mark how full the reel is before buildup. I've not done this in the past personally, but it really does only take perhaps an extra minute of prep time before the building process commences...so no big deal.
Posted by Jason Burroughs (Member # 68) on 04-14-2000, 07:21 PM:
I too have marked reels in much the same manner as Brad does, a piece of masking tape on the inside of the reel and a line at the "full" mark of the reel, gives you a General area to find the splice, other than that I prefer clear splicing tape (Neumade if possible. I have used the ultrasonic splicers on a IWerks setup, and I have to say they're quite nice. That was a strange setup if I've ever seen one. It was a super modified Ballantyne 70mm projector that ran forwards and BACKWARDS, so we had to file the splices down where they ran through the gate so that they were about the same thickness as the rest of the film.
Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 04-15-2000, 11:19 AM:
I still like the old EPRAD edge marker I never had one of them cause a dribble down the print with the silver marker
In fact I use it to mark the Imax splices before I remove the tape ones and Ultrasonic them on build up of new prints
Posted by Ian Price (Member # 14) on 04-15-2000, 01:18 PM:
We used to like the Eprad Edge Marker untill the discount house down the block told us that it acted like a cue to their failsafes and shut down the show on the first reel change. We didn't know, because we used bar-code automations.From then on, we just used the silver pen to mark up stuff in the booth.
Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 04-15-2000, 03:47 PM:
I wonder what type of sensor they used? It would have to be very sensitive to read it
I usually buy a Yellow marker from Pental
It is very easy to see in the dark booth
Posted by John Pytlak (Member # 331) on 04-17-2000, 07:10 AM:
Joe:I agree that a colored bar across the frameline that shows on the screen is "tacky". If you reread my post, my suggestion was for tape with a 0.10 inch colored stripe across the TAPE, so it could carefully be placed over the perforations on the side opposite the Dolby Digital soundtrack --- the colored stripe would NOT cover any soundtrack, and would NOT intrude into the picture area.
But the BEST idea in this discussion is to temporarily mark the shipping reel to show how full it was, so that on breakdown onto the same reel, you'll know when the splice is coming. That way, you don't need to mark the film at all 
.
The WORST idea is to use white shoepolish, "whiteout", or any other material on the film that will flake, bleed, or get the film dirty. 
------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Eastman Kodak Company
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7419
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: 716-477-5325 Fax: 716-722-7243
E-Mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Posted by Michael Brown (Member # 890) on 11-21-2001, 09:20 AM:
I am in the UK and since film is shipped on cores the idea of marking shipping reels is not possible. Our policy is to mark a ring around each reel change with white china marker. The problem is that is does leave the inside of the projector a bit messy. Anyone have better suggestions.
Posted by John Pytlak (Member # 331) on 11-21-2001, 10:18 AM:
Michael:I would also discourage using China Marker (or crayon) to mark the print. Not only does it leave debris in the projector (as you note), but some of that same debris gets stuck in the image and soundtrack areas of the print --- definitely not "film done right".
For film on a core, simply measure and record the diameter of each reel as received. When respooling onto the cores, look for the splice when the roll approaches that diameter. If you use flanges (split reels) to handle film on cores, mark the calibrations of roll length directly on the flange, which will be valid as long as the film type and core diameter are constant.
------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7525A
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: 716-477-5325 Cell: 716-781-4036 Fax: 716-722-7243
E-Mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Web site: http://www.kodak.com/go/motion
Posted by Steve Anderson (Member # 364) on 11-21-2001, 12:37 PM:
To find the splice when breaking down a print I also use the gloved finger method that Randy referred to. I also took my mini mag-light and attached it to a small goose neck so that I can shoot a small beam of light just across the platter of film so that I can see where each reel of film ends.
Posted by Les Brock (Member # 1041) on 11-21-2001, 01:22 PM:
One of the easiest and Digital soundtrack friendly ways of marking reel change splices is to use an Ultraviolet pen marker down the edges of the film.The marker is invisible to SDDS / SRD tracks.
On the breakdown of the print a hand held UV ( Blacklight ) is used and the splice / end of reel marks can be clearly seen.
Posted by Ken Lackner (Member # 1002) on 11-21-2001, 07:03 PM:
Great idea!! How much do those pens and a small portable blacklight cost? I guarantee you my GM will not spend too much money on it. I probablly wouldn't either, cause it's not "necessary," but if it's not expensive, I'd like to try it.
Posted by John Brookshire (Member # 1013) on 11-21-2001, 07:06 PM:
I've found that if you use zebra tape, if you position it just right, it covers neither image nor soundtrack, and sits up above the film very nicely - roughly a 1/16 of an inch - marks the reel changes perfectly, when I get my camera I'll take a pic so you can see.
Posted by Andy Muirhead (Member # 712) on 11-21-2001, 07:55 PM:
Michael, an absolutely terrible idea, who taught you that? Because you work(!) at a student cinema, the chances are you are handling 2nd, 3rd run prints. If you want to mark your splices for easy breakdown, go to WH Smiths or whatever and get a pack of those self adhesive dots. When your making-up place a dot over the edge of the splice (and do it before you tape your splice), but so it doesn't cover the soundtrack area. Basically your just trying to mark the very edge of the film.If you do that you can find your splices again almost with a blindfold, well not really, but you can spot your splices easy.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 11-21-2001, 09:08 PM:
I would encourage everybody who gets film on reels to read the "Building 101" page on the "Tips" section of this site. It shows the best way to mark reel changes without using zebra tape or any external substances (like china marker) on the film. The method is fullproof unless you consistently lose several feet per reel due to damage during a film's run. Just as long as you use tape on the reel to mark how full it is (like the picture shows on the page) then everything will be kick-ass. I really can't stress enough how good this method is.
Posted by Les Brock (Member # 1041) on 11-22-2001, 08:21 AM:
Ken:The cost of a pen and UV lamp is around $24 USD or £16 UK Pounds. Both items can be found at Actsecurity. Their website is at www.actsecurity.com
Posted by Michael Brown (Member # 890) on 11-22-2001, 10:57 AM:
I might try the dots idea. I just though about the ultra violet idea. Would there be any maybee felt or marker pens that i could use that would show up without a special light. Basically something that would not flake off in the projector.
Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 11-22-2001, 11:06 AM:
Kodak used edge mark there safety stock with a UV material to make it show up in inspection for nitrate stock combined on the same roll back in the 50's
I use the silver coat wide tip by sanford and even the IMAX doesn't flake it off.
I use the Eprad edge marker holder ad none ever drips over the edge
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 11-22-2001, 12:28 PM:
I don't know if I've told this story before, but if I have you are about to suffer through it AGAIN!At UA Greenwood we used to use silver marking pens to mark the reel changes at buildup. Easy to see on the platter. But we stopped doing this. Why? Well most of the times we would get in many of our prints a week early (sometimes even earlier than that) so that the big boys at the corporate office could watch the prints at home. We would build up the movies onto two or three 7,000 foot reels. All of their home projectors had foil-sensing cue detectors so that they wouldn't have to get up and do the changeover themselves. What happened? You guessed it... the silver marking actually triggered cues.
And yes, if it was a highly anticipated title we would platter it and watch it before it was sent out to the boys (if we had time).
Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 11-22-2001, 12:40 PM:
Funny I would love to now what cue detector read them as I have yet to find one that did.
In fact we tried to use silver paint marker to permanently cue a ride film and we couldn't find any sensor other than a Omron LED Cell type that would read it
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 11-22-2001, 02:28 PM:
Well MY guess is that Ian (yes, IAN) just put the silver paint on waaaay too sloppily and it seeped across the entire width of the film. OK that is an exaggeration. Perhaps Ian will come and tell us what cue readers they were using. Ian was the one who told me that it was cuing their projectors (or someone's projectors).
Posted by Ian Price (Member # 14) on 11-22-2001, 02:57 PM:
That was too long ago. I have moved on. Get a life. 
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 11-22-2001, 03:20 PM:
Not to be pushy here, but if that was indeed happening to at least ONE type of cue detector, I'd really like to know whatever info you could find about it, Ian. Being that we all still run film, the guys here are discussing various methods of marking reel changes and most of us use some form of cue detector, I don't consider this outdated technology that we should "move on" from.
Posted by Ian Price (Member # 14) on 11-22-2001, 06:15 PM:
When we used the silver marking pen our executives with the in-house screening rooms reported that their machines were turning off after the first reel. When we stopped using the silver marking pen the problem stopped. They were using the standard Kelmar cue detectors. That's all I know. I never verified the problem, I never witnessed the problem.
Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 11-22-2001, 06:59 PM:
was that the kelmar roller type or prox type
If it is the roller type that is odd as I tried a continuity test on some and it didn't conduct
Posted by Ken Lackner (Member # 1002) on 11-22-2001, 08:18 PM:
I wouldn't recomment purposly trying to use a marker or paint pen or something like that to make the cues. Remember, every theatre is set up differently. An inboard cue may be a lens change or a house lights cue at one location, but it could be the shutdown cue at another location. And that is why, as courtesy, I always remove my cues when breaking down. I greatly appreciate when the operator who used a print before me has done the same.
Posted by Adam Martin (Member # 641) on 11-22-2001, 08:25 PM:
I've had the silver markers trip Kelmar roller-type failsafes before. The kind with the inboard and outboard and cross cues. That's all I can tell you, 'cause it was ten years ago. I thought I was gonna be slick with a festival print that was supposed to play in two houses at the same time. My plan was foiled. 
unintentional punAnd before you yell at me for messing up a festival print, I was young and stupid and it came right off with a little Renovex.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 11-23-2001, 01:03 AM:
I think the best person to ask about he silver marking pen/cue problem would be Gary Stanley. Unfortunately he hasn't registered, but I'm sure he'd have some interesting information about it.
Posted by Andy Muirhead (Member # 712) on 11-23-2001, 07:11 PM:
A good tip for cueing prints is to place splicing tape over the area first, then add the cue. That way the next place can just peel off the tape and cue. I usually find that removing cues otherwise can be messy because the adhesive on the cue really sticks to the print. Otherwise i either have to cut a frame out, or treat with some unidentifiable stuff called 'Duck Oil' that usually removes the stickyness. And what is the score with the many films i get that has a cue running about 8 frames on the edge, and folded over both sides? Honestly i don't have a problem getting prints already cued up, i'll find them and get rid of them and to be honest i expect them, but these massive 8-framers really get me. Is somebody just trying to make sure - stand up people that use these cues, cos i am just a bit curious!
Posted by Craig Hanham (Member # 1010) on 11-23-2001, 08:58 PM:
When it comes to marking prints I dont have any problems since I do C/O except for those slobs too lazy to remove their marks.
The hours i've spent removing multlple automation, breakdown and other marks along with redoing sloppy tape splices 
makes me wonder about peoples sense of finesse and responsibility.
I dont care what you do, as long as I dont see it.Isn't the whole point to do what works for you and then send the print on as if it was never in your hands, except for being in better condition where possible?