This is topic Technicolor Reels Suck! in forum Film Handlers' Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.


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Posted by Joshua Waaland (Member # 287) on 01-21-2000, 11:21 AM:
 
Ever notice that everytime you pick up a Technicolor reel from a film can it falls apart on you? How can you remedy this? I must have had about ten broken reels last night when I was breaking down films.
 
Posted by Colin Wiseley (Member # 247) on 01-21-2000, 11:49 AM:
 
I agree. They either fall apart or they're cracked and the edges of the cracks either scratch you or the film.
 
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 01-21-2000, 01:48 PM:
 
You might want to do a search for "technicolor" here on the forum. Always good reading.

Here's one right off the bat. Click here!
 


Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 01-21-2000, 05:47 PM:
 
I said it once before...

Our method of rebellion has been to throw the damn things out. We bought a couple of metal split-reels from Golberg just for the purpose of handling those broken reels. If you can't get one of those, 'usurp' one good plastic split-reel from your next Technicolor can.

If we get a crappy reel, now, we just toss it. Logic is that if we do, they'll be out of circulation and new ones will have to be bought. If anybody complains, we'll just say that they were broken and if we kept them they'd damage film. (The truth!)

I suggest everybody toss out those crappy reels!

Besides, it's great therapy! You can get all of your agggressions out by busting them into little pieces!
 


Posted by Chris Erwin (Member # 176) on 01-21-2000, 05:53 PM:
 
I don't think I commented on the last go-round on this matter,but here's my take...
If Technicolor actualy INSPECTED the film the way they should the reels would crap out on them like they do us.

Think I'm on to something?

--Chris
 


Posted by Ian Price (Member # 14) on 01-21-2000, 06:24 PM:
 
I had the very same problem last night. I think I will be investing in some split reels. My Make-Up table uses a drive pin. Does anyone know if they make split reels for people with drive pins?
 
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 01-21-2000, 06:31 PM:
 
I don't think they really "inspect" the film in that sense. I think they open the cans, make sure all the reels are there, and then close'em up again. I'd be surprised if they did more than that.

Mike
 


Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 01-21-2000, 08:05 PM:
 
The split-reel that we have at TT-17 has drive pin holes. Just make sure you put the drive pin into the hole on the back. Otherwise you'll spin the lid off!
 
Posted by Jason Burroughs (Member # 68) on 01-21-2000, 08:35 PM:
 
Personally I think that the theatres should charge Technicolor for the Lost shows and wasted man hours because of their "service"
Print dosen't show up on time and you miss a show? Bill 'em
Spend an hour picking film up because the reel fell apart? Bill 'em

After a while of recieving and having to pay these bills maybe they'd improve their service. Technicolor has some great ideas... they just need to follow through.
 


Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 01-22-2000, 03:09 AM:
 
This is an ongoing problem. 2 weeks ago we discovered that we had about 8 broken Technicolor reels when we were building up our prints. We always toss and replace them. So I call up the lady at Technicolor and start bitching: "We had 10 reels break apart on us during build-up and the reels fell onto the floor and damaged the film and I was wondering if you could please send 10 empty breand new reels sent to my theatre?!"
TES lady says "Sorry about that, I'll notify the reel department and have them ship you 10 reels right away"

Nothing happens.

Last week, we had 5 more TES reels fall apart during buildup. I called the TES lady and bitched again "5 more reels have fallen apart due to their crappy design and we still haven't gotten the 10 from last week. Send me 15 now!" TES lady says "Sorry about that. Those reels should have shipped, I'm not sure why they haven't, I'll notify the reel department to send you 15 new empty reels."

Nothing happens

This week we have 5 more bust on us during buildup. I call the TES lady and say "Lemme speak to your supervisor!!!!!!" Supervisor lady comes on an I bitch "What the hell is goin' on with these crappy reels??? I am at my wits end because they keep falling apart. It is obvious that your depot does not care about the 'work' that they do. And the other 15 empty relacement reels that I have ordered over the past weeks STILL have not come in!!! What is the deal?" Supervisor lady: "Well, we're working on more flexible reels that don't break, as you may have heard. I don't know why your replacement reels haven't arrived. I'll contact the reel department and make sure they send out as many reels as possible to you. Me:"OK but what about 'Snow Falling on Cedars' which must be broken down tonight by 12:30? I don't have enough good reels to cover it. I guess I'll just have to break it down onto cores and hope that the next theatre that gets it tomorrow can assemble it from that form. If not, oh well, not my problem."

The supervisor lady gave me her extension in case the reels keep busting apart. I still have not gotten any replacement reels.
 


Posted by Michael Cunningham (Member # 210) on 01-22-2000, 04:55 PM:
 
Speaking of "usurping" good reels, which brand or make do you prefer to acquire? When opening a new theatre, I like to get ahold of 3 good "20th Century Fox" reels. Although of similar design to other problem reels, I find that they are constructed of a more flexible plastic that is less prone to cracking and breaking. Also, some of them are a one piece design where the center core is actually molded with the reel flanges and thus not subject to splitting.

-Mike
 


Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 01-22-2000, 06:04 PM:
 
Standard metal Goldberg shipping reels are nice to have around if you can find ones that aren't bent (which is difficult, I admit).

Of course, the best reels for general booth use are Goldberg house reels, which are pretty much impossible to bend under normal use.
 
Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 01-22-2000, 06:40 PM:
 
>>"Speaking of "usurping" good reels, which brand or make do you prefer to
acquire?"<<

Personally, I prefer Goldberg's metal shipping reels. In the plastic department, I prefer Goldberg's again, their 5/16" core design wont tear up spindle keys the way other's do.

Again, I prefer metal shipping reels.

Steve

------------------
"Old projectionists never die, they just changeover!"

 


Posted by Charles Everett (Member # 889) on 12-27-2001, 11:32 AM:
 
Bumping this back up top for our newbie Film-Techers.

Also see "The Royal Tenenbaums" in Features & Trailers. That post will come in handy regardless of when your theater opens that film.
 


Posted by Christopher Wehrman (Member # 806) on 12-27-2001, 12:51 PM:
 
I have a question:
Is it possile to use the cores (that are in any brand of plastic "snap-togeather" reel) on a goldburg split reel?
I basicly would like to just exchange the flanges of the shipping reel with the split-reel when making-up and breaking-down prints. Our make-up table will not turn the plastic reels with the deeply recesed notch hole. When breaking down prints. What do you guys think?

------------------
Christopher Wehrman
Head Projectionist
Belle Starr Theater
 


Posted by Aaron Sisemore (Member # 145) on 12-27-2001, 06:01 PM:
 
>>Is it possile(sic) to use the cores (that are in any brand of plastic "snap-together" reel) on a goldburg(sic) split reel?<<

Absolutely. They fit fine.

-Aaron

 


Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 12-27-2001, 07:15 PM:
 
I liked the Taylor plastic reels
 
Posted by Paul Harnden (Member # 1034) on 12-28-2001, 12:46 AM:
 
My remedy with broken reels is to just keep the half that has nothing wrong with it. Once in a while you'd get another messed up reel with a good half in tact, add that with the other saved good one: voila! Also, my old head projectionist always had a nack for getting brand new reels from other theaters and hording them. With the messed halves, they made good frisbees when throwing them away into the dumpsters from distances.
 
Posted by Frank Angel (Member # 248) on 12-28-2001, 07:02 AM:
 
I understand that TES uses those break-apart reels in their "inspection" machines -- the flanges come off and the machine handles the film roll on the core. The flange sides are then snappped back on when it comes off the machine. Supposidely this makes for a very efficient system -- easy on their inspectors. (I suspect their "inspectors" are every bit as well-trained as lots of the usher-sprocket jockeys that pass for projectionists these days)

I have taken to using industrial strength E6000 adhesive to glue the flanges on when the snaps have broken and won't hold the flanges to the hub. I just gives me that extra bit of pleasure picturing "Mona," who proudly put her "Inspected by" sticker on the print in the first place, trying to pull the flanges off the hub. Hey, it should be as hard for her to get the damn things apart as it is for us to keep them together. Fair is fair.

But actually, guys, FORGET about even talking to TES -- they have no vested interest in making you happy. Talk to the distrib! He's PAYING for the lousy service; it's HIS $10,000 print. Tell him that TES is shipping it out on reels that have broken, razor-sharp edges that will cut his print with every revolution. Find the guy in the studio's print department -- the HEAD of the print control department if need be -- and SEND him one of these print-shredding reels. Bet we can find SOMEONE in the bowels of the studio's distribution arm that is conscientious and will get really pissed if he gets a bunch of these complaints (with indesputable examples) arriving on his desk on a daily basis.
 


Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 12-28-2001, 01:36 PM:
 
I wish there was a way to get to the directors, producers and stars of the movies. If they saw the way their product, which put so much work into, is treated after it leaves their hands, they would revolt and we'd see some changes.

Or at least we'd be on the fast track to digital, with the studios paying the bill!
 


Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 12-28-2001, 03:55 PM:
 
Frank, TES does not have inspection machines, unless by "machine" you are referring to someone who does not know how to inspect film. All they do is spin off 20 feet onto the floor and look to make sure the picture isn't rubbed off and spool it back on. You're giving them WAY too much credit. The whole purpose of using the clip together reels is so they do not have to take the time to physically wind the film onto and off of the reels during mounting and junking. Also, a 6 reel print is at maximium about $1200 actual cost to make one print. When 5000 are made, obviously the cost is substantially less.

I like your idea of super glue. Shall we all take to doing this when we find a reel that won't stay together?


 


Posted by Manny Knowles (Member # 1171) on 06-23-2002, 08:06 PM:
 
After stealing reels from other TES prints, I've finally gotten to the point where I'm fresh out of reels for Technicolor movies.

I requested replacement reels through my booker. I told her I needed a dozen or so and she said that sounded like too much to ask for. Truth is that now I need more than twenty reels. There are a couple of 7 or 8 reel epics here with no reels. Anyway, it's been weeks and no reels have arrived.

I've started returning prints on cores with a note inside the cans saying that their reels kept falling apart and so now we don't have any TES reels to work with.

As somebody mentioned earlier, I think it's important to take those reels out of circulation. Also, this may be the only way to bring this problem to their urgent attention.

This has afforded the opportunity to return a lot of those DTS frisbees that I have lying around here. When the DTS discs arrive as "chasers" there usually isn't room in the can to return, so the discs have to go back "naked" and I'm left with piles of the yellow and black shippers.

Problem is that Technicolor movies take FOREVER to breakdown because we can't mark the reels with a "fill line" because...well...there are no reels! Policy now is that new movies with good reels will get to keep their reels so that we can go back to marking the fill line to help break-down go faster again.


 


Posted by Paul G. Thompson (Member # 655) on 06-23-2002, 09:42 PM:
 
Manny, just use a hunk of masking tape or something to make a "fake" film line instead of marking the reels when you have reels.


 


Posted by Manny Knowles (Member # 1171) on 06-24-2002, 02:52 AM:
 
We never mark the actual plastic reel. We always use masking tape on the inside of the reel and then we draw the line on that.

Oh yeah! I've seen more than a few of those blue, white, grey and clear reels come in with lines drawn directly onto them. I always wonder what those people do when they get a black reel..?


 


Posted by Paul Mayer (Member # 355) on 06-24-2002, 04:26 AM:
 
Manny, why not just call/email TES direct? That's what I did just a couple of weeks ago and they had a dozen reels sent to us within a couple of days.

 
Posted by Manny Knowles (Member # 1171) on 06-24-2002, 07:14 AM:
 
The last time I did that the booker just about died.
 
Posted by Frank Angel (Member # 248) on 06-24-2002, 10:30 AM:
 
TES seems to at least be acknowledging the problem in that they are evaluating five different reels styles, both the clamp types and the flange material -- they are testing the clamps for their ability to resist breakage and the flange material for its impact resistance. I don't know exactly how far along they have gotten with this research but at least they are not simply ignoring the problem, which, if you multiply the experiences of the members here on FTF by the other thousands of screens around the country, must be really one humungus problem for them.

But until they settle on a better mousetrap, I will continue to throw out the flanges that come shattered and that can cause knicks and/or slice the film, yes, but where the flanges are intact but the clips are broken -- GLUE it is. I glue the flanges to the hub when I am making up the show and by the time I need to ship-out, they are as good as the single-piece contruction of the good ole reels which we miss so dearly. Remember those uni-body reels we took for granted -- as the saying goes, you never know how good you've got it until it's gone!

Frank

PS -- Why not put those order in for replacement reels in ANTICIPATION of the broken reels you KNOW you will eventually have to deal with. If you order ten reels now, then when you get down to say 3 or 4, you order another 10 -- you'll always be ahead of the game.
 


Posted by John Hawkinson (Member # 1135) on 06-24-2002, 11:09 AM:
 
Manny,

I think you're better off going through 800 99 FILMS rather than talking to your booker, with respect to ordering replacement reels from TES.

--jhawk
 


Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 06-24-2002, 12:13 PM:
 
Why should the booker care about TES reels? That's not his job and I would expect that most bookers would consider that sort of thing to be a waste of time.

Definitely call TES directly. If nothing else, it will send a message to them...I've never actually managed to get them to send out reels, though.
 


Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 06-24-2002, 12:44 PM:
 
The trick is to call TES directly and tell them that your MUT is incapable of breaking down onto a broken reel and you do not have a split reel. Until they get you more reels, you will not be returning any more prints.

You will have your requested reels the next morning. If they don't send them, don't return the prints that are missing reels. Simple.


 


Posted by Rachel Gilardi (Member # 4594) on 06-24-2002, 10:40 PM:
 
That would be great Brad, other then the fact that most people just don't have a choice. I'm sure many would lose their job if they didn't send a print back on time.
 
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 06-24-2002, 11:58 PM:
 
Rach, if your MUT cannot break down on a core, you have no choice. So long as you have made this clear to TES it's not your problem.

I will say one thing, at least they are improving. Granted I still get on average 1 bad reel per every other print, but that is a vast improvement to before. Also, I've found they are getting much more efficient with replacement reels and their staff is much nicer than they used to be. I've noticed this over roughly the last year, maybe year and a half. They've still got a lot of things to fix, but something is slowly happening.


 


Posted by Gracia L. Babbidge (Member # 582) on 06-25-2002, 01:45 AM:
 
hmm. the one time I attempted to get TES to send more reels to my theater, it worked quite well. the call was made on a friday, and 8 (unbroken) reels arrived on monday.
I didn't make the call myself, I left a note for another projectionist, as I was far too pissed off at having built a print that was shipped on broken reels only... and I think that fact may have been communicated when the call was made.
 
Posted by Peter Kerchinsky (Member # 1098) on 06-25-2002, 12:47 PM:
 
We've called several times for replacement reels and never got them. I guess we are one step ahead of the game because we've got two Goldberg split reels. If those damn reels fall apart while building the film, they go back in the can on cores and the broken reels get tossed out.
I still have a gash on my hand from stopping one of those reels with a large chunk missing on the outer section.

 
Posted by Steve Kraus (Member # 476) on 06-25-2002, 11:05 PM:
 
If you can't break down onto a core and don't have a proper split reel then just snap open a good reel you do have and use that. Surely there's going to be at least one decent reel among whatever prints are present to use and then return.
 




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