This is topic Carmike no longer THX, WTF?! in forum Film Handlers' Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.
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Posted by Dustin Mitchell (Member # 372) on 03-15-2000, 09:08 PM:
I was just informed today that we will be pulling all forms of THX advertising including trailers, signs, newspaper ads, etc. Supposedly Carmike no longer likes the overly strict THX standards. I think they don't like the pricetag. Anyone here know more about this?
Posted by Andrew D'Vrey (Member # 285) on 03-15-2000, 10:58 PM:
I'm sure they don't like the pricetag. Nobody I know "likes" the price tag. Personally, I'm not completely convinced THX is that important to the majority of customers these days.THX means the theater's equipment, auditorium, etc are peachy keen. It DOESN'T mean the monkey flipping the switch behind the port-hole window knows what he's doing. And it doesn't mean you will get the experience THX promotes.
The only time I every hear people talking about THX anyway is when Star Wars movies come out.
We're doing a World Premier this weekend and TAP is coming to check the screens we are running it on. I guess in this situation, their critical minds are a calming effect. Something going wrong or not being perfect during an event of that magnitude would be a catastrophy, IMHO.
Maybe it could be reccomended to Carmike to spend the money on Kodak's Screen Check. A brilliant idea on their part. Not a clue on cost tho.
------------------
"And the monkey flips the switch."
- Major Don West, "Lost In Space"
Andrew D'Vrey
IATSE Local 219
Posted by Dustin Mitchell (Member # 372) on 03-15-2000, 11:18 PM:
Yes, I am well aware of the price tag and think it is ridiculous. Some of the restrictions they put on us to achieve THX certification are just ridiculous We had to lock our sound cabinets for example. None at the theater had keys, only the MTS techs. Apparently that kind of stuff is to complicated for our simple minds, not that we ever messed with it anyway.It isn't a tragedy, just interesting that the 2nd largest theater chain is saying "screw you" to Lucas. Bout time IMHO. It gives me a project for an otherwise boring Thursday afternoon-pull the two THX trailers and add Dolby's. Course that will take all of 10 minutes, leaving me nothing to do for the rest of the 40 customer afternoon
.
Posted by Mike Blakesley (Member # 26) on 03-15-2000, 11:55 PM:
I noticed that the Carmike in Billings MT stopped putting THX in their newspaper directory a couple of weeks ago...wondered if something was up.I attributed it to bad ad writing...this same theatre constantly puts STEREO next to films that are in DTS. (they have DTS in all screens.) Unless they have a couple of malfunctioning units......
Posted by Dustin Mitchell (Member # 372) on 03-16-2000, 12:30 AM:
Probably malfunctioning units. We aren't allowed to do in house repairs, gotta send them into the shop. This means it takes a long time to get one of our DTS houses back up if it goes down.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 03-16-2000, 12:38 AM:
Locking the sound racks? That's the first I've heard of this. Of course, all of mine are locked anyway, and I have a key, but it's not because of THX. I just don't have anything better to do. Also, I keep tools at the theatre and they are stored in some of the racks.What's THX going to come up with next? A projectionist REQUIRED to run the machines and not a manager? Now that would be ludicrous.
Just kidding, of course!
Posted by Greg Anderson (Member # 235) on 03-16-2000, 07:51 AM:
You can bash Lucasfilm all you want, but this is a disturbing development. A few years ago here in Utah, Cinemark was the only chain around which had anything to do with THX. Their theatres were among the rare with good presentations and seemed to be the ONLY theatres which maintained their equipment.Then, about 5 years ago, Cinemark dropped THX and within seconds their theatres turned to crap. A few months later, Carmike came to Utah and eventually they built some THX houses. If they drop it here, then we'll run low on quality again.
At least with THX, there's SOME kind of notion that the equipment will be maintained. One of the greatest theatres in Salt Lake City (the big house at Trolley Corners) was great in the 1980s but, after a half-dozen bad shows there in the early 90s, I haven't been back since THE FUGITIVE. They never had THX.
(I remember asking a Cinemark manager why they dropped THX 5 years ago and he said something like "Now we have DTS and that's better." I guess managers thought DTS was a cure-all back then. Thing is, they'd already had DTS for 18 months while they still had THX... and THOSE were good presentations. I can't wait to hear some other bone-head explanation from someone who will instantly reveal he doesn't know what he's talking about. Of course, another manager at a different theatre once admitted that the DTS player was at the shop but said "We just turn it up louder and people think it's digital." Unfortunately, he was right, since the average customer's mind has been numbed by too much VHS.)
[This message has been edited by Greg Anderson (edited 03-16-2000).]
Posted by Dustin Mitchell (Member # 372) on 03-16-2000, 09:41 AM:
Well, our sound systems get regular maintanence by MTS. But the last time Lucas came out to re-certify us was in 98. I think this is why we dropped THX. Lucas probably said, "Hey, either have us re-certify you (and pay an outrageous fee to do it) or stop calling your screens THX cetified," and Carmike said, "Ok, bye."
Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 03-16-2000, 10:14 AM:
Well 98 is a long time between recertification it is supposed to be every year. And it doesn't cost all that much I am supprised that MTS is doing recterts. If not there are many people who can doit a person from THX doesn't have to come out only a engineer certified to do it.
As to the cost of the license that is a different matter but typically the standards that THX requires usually mean a better audio presentation with maintained and properly aligned equipment whose compatability has been designed into it from the start.
I think most the circuits are just bleeding to much redink to pay the license fee and they are under the mistaken impression that audiences just don't care.
I have never heard of the racks having to be locked that sounds more like a internal decesion not THX's
Posted by Greg Anderson (Member # 235) on 03-16-2000, 11:04 AM:
Call me names if you must (others have), but I'd much rather have the imperfect THX seal of approval than have quality assurance which is backed up by nobody... or by Cinemark's "Front Row Joe" the dancing cat.
Posted by John Walsh (Member # 168) on 03-16-2000, 11:47 AM:
I agree that having THX certification is better than nothing, but I don't think it is a guarantee of anything. Basically, nothing beats a person who cares about presentation.I think Gordon is right; theaters are loosing money, and this is a cost they can "save" on right away.
I never heard of a requirement to lock the THX cabinets, either. Ours do lock, but the keys are just stuck in the lock itself. Knowing us, we would loose them if they were anywhere else...
About 5 years ago, it was $10,000 for the first year of THX; $1,000 per year after. Those amounts could change, depending on how many screens you were doing a one time.
We also went for over two years (twice) without any one from THX comming by to re-certify. When they did, it had to be at their convenince. Our tech guy had one day notice to meet THX and spent all day (from 6:00am to 6:00pm; break for dinner while shows were running; then from 11:30pm to 3:00 next morning.)
Posted by Andy Davis (Member # 262) on 03-16-2000, 02:07 PM:
I removed the doors to our sound racks to keep the amps and processors running cooler. I haven't had a problem with people messing with the equipment because our booth operators are competant.
Posted by Dustin Mitchell (Member # 372) on 03-16-2000, 05:31 PM:
All I know is what they tell me. I know that we had to have our THX cabniets locked, and only those. If it had been an internal decision, I imagine all of them would have been locked. And no, no one at our theater ever misses with the sound systems, exception being replacing DTS units, which is easy.Possibly I was unclear, MTS is not doing recerts, just general maintanence. They came through our theater back in January for their bi-annual complete theater check. They went through each projector very thouroughly.
Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 03-16-2000, 09:56 PM:
Well MTS has an R2 and used to be certified to do recerts so something is very fishy
possibly that the theatre doesn't want to pay them extra for the time it takes
also a lot of amps have the gain controls on the front so locking the racks is almost pointless because any one could open the processor anyway
"something is rotten in the state of denmark"
Posted by William Hooper (Member # 71) on 03-17-2000, 12:04 AM:
quote:
I was just informed today that we will be pulling all forms of THX advertising including trailers, signs, newspaper ads, etc. Supposedly Carmike no longer likes the overly strict THX standards.
Ads in today's newspaper for Carmike theaters in Mobile, AL still tout THX. Plus an ad for a new Carmike theater opening in April says it will be THX also.
[This message has been edited by William Hooper (edited 03-17-2000).]
Posted by Dustin Mitchell (Member # 372) on 03-17-2000, 12:54 AM:
Well the memo got was sent out on Wednesday, which is too late to change print ads. As far as advertising as THX, well that was probably cooked up before the memo.I just know we're boxing up everything that has THX on it and sending it to the District office.
Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 03-17-2000, 03:38 PM:
>> Call me names if you must (others have), but I'd much rather have the imperfect THX seal of approval than have quality assurance which is backed up by nobody... or by Cinemark's "Front Row Joe" the dancing cat. <<Didn't you hear? Popcorn Penny decided she prefers "bad boys" and ran off with Clyde! Front Row Joe was do depressed he stuck his head in a popcorn popper and popped himself to death!
As goofy as it was I like Front Row Joe much better than those dumb "Image" trailers!
Posted by Greg Anderson (Member # 235) on 03-17-2000, 04:48 PM:
I was unaware of Front Row Joe's woes. Just goes to show you how infrequently I choose to waste my money at Utah's inferior Cinemark theatres.
Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 03-17-2000, 07:56 PM:
I used to do a THX house or two in every plex I worked on in past years. However LucasFilm doesn't seem interestd in the indies anymore and I have given up on them. The THX division has had so many people problems and it seems that they had a huge turnover every time I did another system. These hassles are not worth the headaches. I still design at least two houses to THX standards in all the plexes I do. I also still use my R-2 on every house I eq. No exceptions there.....ever. The results obtained are way to good to consider anything else. Seems to me that when they were moved off "The Ranch" they went downhill and have not been heading back up. Perhaps George has even had enough.
Mark
Posted by Dustin Mitchell (Member # 372) on 03-17-2000, 10:07 PM:
My knowledge of sound systems is patheticly poor, especially since I'm a college student
. I'm sure our MTS tech uses one of these R2 units when equalizing our sound systems, which he did in Janruary.You know what they found wrong in 98 when they recertified us? Our lights were too bright during the feature. We knew about this and it was scheduled to be fixed. Really wasn't that bad and hadn't recieved any complaints about it, but things should be as perfect as possible. The only other problem we had was that our entry doors closed to loudly. Five minutes with a wrench fixed that for both theaters. So we dropped all that money for Lucas to tell us that. Not worth it in my opinion. Our projectors and sound systems recieve regular maintanence. Maybe THX was needed a few years back to bring up standards, but until the bar needs to be raised again having the certification is just dumping money down a drain in my opinion.
Posted by John Eickhof (Member # 323) on 03-17-2000, 11:36 PM:
I agree with you Mark, The R2 is a wonderful
device, I have always dis-agreed with the
LUCA$ way of doing bu$ine$$ But the tools of the trade are the best buy!! Lets keep using them! And forget the tradenames!!
Posted by Chris Erwin (Member # 176) on 03-18-2000, 09:26 AM:
I mentioned the fact a movie was playing with THX to a bunch of my friends and they said "huh?". These are people who faithfully go every week to the movies. I think this represents the movie going public. If it sounds good,most people could care less if it said Dolby,DTS or whatever.--Chris
Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 03-18-2000, 10:12 PM:
Dustin if they hadn't foudn out about the light level and the noisey doors would it have been fixed, or why hadn't it been fixed
that is part of the recert process getting things fixed that the theatre forgets about
Posted by Dustin Mitchell (Member # 372) on 03-18-2000, 11:13 PM:
quote:
Originally posted by Dustin Mitchell:
You know what they found wrong in 98 when they recertified us? Our lights were too bright during the feature. We knew about this and it was scheduled to be fixed.
Yup, it would have been.
quote:
The only other problem we had was that our entry doors closed to loudly. Five minutes with a wrench fixed that for both theaters.
I don't know about this. You must understand they weren't closing that loudly, I mean, the whole building didn't shake. But yes, they were closing kind of hard. At this time I was only in the concession stand though, so I don't know for sure if that was on the to do list before they came out or not.
Posted by Bryan Redemske (Member # 354) on 03-20-2000, 10:28 AM:
As far as I'm concerned, George Lucas and his THX crap can go jump. We're not certified and most of the people could care less. The only people who know what THX is have only seen it on their Star Wars reissue tapes and don't really know what it means anyway. Soooo...with Dolby Digital in place and good-sounding stereo everywhere else, we're fine. And not feeding George Lucas' money-wasting empire known as "The Star Wars Prequels." Episode I gets my award for worst movie of the year.
Posted by Evans A Criswell (Member # 381) on 04-27-2000, 03:24 PM:
I just heard from a manager of a local Carmike theatre that although THX certification was originally going to be dropped, negotiations have been made and THX certification will remain in place at our location. Does anyone know the details of any recent company-wide negotiations with THX?
Posted by Dustin Mitchell (Member # 372) on 04-27-2000, 03:28 PM:
The only thing I've heard recently is the big stink over the Screenvision ads not being run. I'll have to see what's come in over the IQ tommorrow.
Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 04-27-2000, 05:11 PM:
One reason a few chains have dumped THX is cause the cost every year for the recerts. If you have a hundred screens at one chain thats alot of dough paid out to recert every year. I suspect some company hauncho decided he needed a new Rolls every year instead. But really even at a discounted price its alot of money to forkout every year, and things are not so good money wise in exhibition right now. I hava pretty much goven up on THX as far as indies go. THX really does not seem to have much interest in doing them anymore....heck they can't even properly deal with what they have out there either.
Mark
Posted by Greg Anderson (Member # 235) on 04-28-2000, 11:42 AM:
So... I went to the Carmike web site this morning and the first thing it did was play the audio of the THX "Broadway" trailer. What's up with that?
www.carmike.com
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 04-28-2000, 02:23 PM:
Carmike probably paid some fee to use that logo on their web site. Mann uses it in their non-sync radio program as well.
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 04-28-2000, 03:00 PM:
So does Century. In fact, Mann Radio is the same thing as Century Radio. They both come from the same source, and my guess is that it is CMN, or Century Media network, who also do the slides.