This is topic HELP! Has this ever happened to you? in forum Film Handlers' Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.
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Posted by Sara Serine Orton (Member # 208) on 04-17-2000, 03:37 PM:
A "Sitcom" print arrived Friday in a box. I've never seen a film arrive in a box. This box looked like it had been chewed up in a trash compacter first. I opened the box to find all the reels in cans. The reels were on a center piece with NO SIDE SUPPORTS. I have been working in theaters almost 5 years and have NEVER EVER SEEN THIS. We run a platter system so we have to transfer all these reels onto the platter. I've tried taking apart one of our plastic reels to fit over the plastic center piece but it doesn't fit. The only thing that I can think of is to transfer it to a reel in the rewind machine and then transfer it from that reel to another reel to make it heads first again. This packaging seems very unprofessional to me. I called the booker and he said he has never gotten complaints about this sort of packaging before. He said that this is normal for films.
I'm sorry, I'm having a really hard time believeing that.
Have you guys ever seen anything like that?
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 04-17-2000, 03:57 PM:
Ever had a Technicolor reel fall apart on you? It leaves you with the same thing, a print wound onto a core. Not to worry, it's a very common practice in the industry.Now, if it is a 3" or 4" core, you can go through some of your orange Technicolor cans and search for one of their original designs that was a black pull apart reel with a metal centerpiece. If you can find one, pop it apart (it's probably already broken anyway so this won't be difficult) and them sandwich the film onto the reel.
If it is on one of the smaller cores, you can use your trailer flange on the rewind bench to mount it on and rewind to another reel. I'd recommend building it up on the bench anyway to large reels. Then when you're done, simply rewind the large reels and load to the platter.
Posted by John Walsh (Member # 168) on 04-17-2000, 04:17 PM:
Brad's right; there are several plastic reels which use the same center core as the ones that were shipped to you. You may find one style that will work.That is the way a new print is shipped from the labs to a film exchange. If the exchange is in a hurry, or if it is a one shot thing, they won't put it on reels for you. They will just ship it to you as is.
You might want to purchase a "split reel" which is a reel with one side that comes off. You put your print on it's center hub, then screw the side back on. You will really need a split reel when it comes time to ship the print back, unless you exchange will send you empty reels to use.
It happens fairly often, (I'm actually surprised you've never seen prints this way) but I totally agree; It's unprofessional. Not every theater has a split reel around.
Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 04-17-2000, 05:00 PM:
In most of the world (outside North America) this is how most prints are shipped on lab cores in tins
Posted by Tim Reed (Member # 137) on 04-17-2000, 06:58 PM:
I keep hearing complaints from my customers about these cheap reels. I tell them whenever they get a bad reel in, throw it in the garbage and just send the film back on a core. End of problem.
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Better Projection Pays!
Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 04-17-2000, 07:56 PM:
Shipping on cores is really pretty common for oddball stuff like foreign films (which often have non-standard changeover cues, too...check out the cues on German prints, for example!).
As others have said, Technicolor or ETS snap-together ("fall-apart") reels can be used with the larger cores, but the proper way to handle a print like this is with a 2000' split reel. Before I bought myself a 2000' split reel, I managed to get by with a 1200' split reel with a 16mm 2000' reel masking-taped to one side. It worked and allowed me to rewind film onto cores without damaging it, but it wasn't pretty and only worked on a handcrank rewind bench.
Posted by Jason Burroughs (Member # 68) on 04-17-2000, 08:07 PM:
About 5 years ago I had a print of a Japanese movie I don't remember the title, but it arrived in a padded nylon bag type thing, each reel was only on a 3" core just simply stacked inside. It appeared to have been shipped from overseas but was new when we recieved it and it was in good condition. I have also recieved Fox prints and New Line prints in heavily waxed cardboard boxes and courigated plastic. Those shipping methods seemed to be ok, but were a pain to carry around.
Posted by Bryan Fournier (Member # 264) on 04-17-2000, 08:33 PM:
Sara,I agree with John and Scott. The best way to handle reels shipped on cores is with a 2000' split-reel. I have two, one is manufactured by Goldberg Bros. and the other is by Neumade. One side of the reel screws off allowing you to place the core/film right onto the reel. Just screw the side back on and your ready to go. This is the only proper way to make-up or break-down films shipped in that way. If I remember correctly the split-reels cost about $100 a piece. Worth the investment!
Posted by Michael West (Member # 428) on 04-17-2000, 09:38 PM:
most films from the film festivals i have had send their films this way, and of course a replacment reel from a lab or distributor come in this way - you should order a split reel.
Posted by Andrew D'Vrey (Member # 285) on 04-17-2000, 11:28 PM:
I received all three prints totalling 30 reels of Green Mile in boxes on cores. Just snap the sides from another reel on and walla! I've seen it quite a few times actually.------------------
"And the monkey flips the switch."
- Major Don West, "Lost In Space"
Andrew D'Vrey
IATSE Local 219
Posted by Ari Nordström (Member # 288) on 04-18-2000, 02:05 AM:
This thread feels a bit strange to me, since I'm used to the plastic cores and using the split reel. This is how we get just about every print here in Sweden, distribution, archive, or otherwise.Only during film festivals do I encounter the plastic reels used by Technicolor and others for the American prints fresh from American theatres or labs. Those reels give me additional work since my rewind setup lacks the right adapters for the reels (the axle dimensions are all wrong). A screwdriver and a VERY low rewind speed usually solves this, but somebody else always has to rewind the print back to the original Technicolor reels.
OTOH, I've received prints with wooden cores (no sides), prints without ANY kind of cores, some of them in potatoe sacks, prints on 6000' transport reels that use the 70mm axle diameter (12.5mm; I don't know if you guys use the same axle diameter for your 70mm setups but the Danes sure do), russian prints without cores in about two dozen tiny little tin cans (they look like land mines to me)...
Very few things about print transportation surprise me these days. 
Posted by Christos Mitsakis (Member # 143) on 04-18-2000, 03:58 AM:
quote:
Originally posted by Gordon McLeod:
In most of the world (outside North America) this is how most prints are shipped on lab cores in tins
Gordon is very right. ALL films foreign or domestic come in cans rounded in cores (for the first run) and without cores after the first run theatre returns them back to the distributor.
The most common practice in the make up is to use either split reels, or a core (sometimes custom made) with metal plates at the sides, OR ...just plain core -in fact that is the way I learned 20 yrs ago.
The whole procedure is totaly unprofessional since different theatres use variable diameter cores (even the distributors) and most of the time you have to tighten or loosen the film to fit the core you have. The result is the one can imagine. SCRATCHES.
Most of the time you can tell when a reel is going to change from the many scratches at the head and tail of each reel (unfortunately even sometimes in the FIRST run of a movie)
In such cases you have to be carefull and of course respect the print in your hands.
Posted by John Pytlak (Member # 331) on 04-18-2000, 06:17 AM:
Kodak supplies print film raw stock to laboratories in rolls wound on new 3-inch (75mm) plastic cores. Laboratories usually recycle these cores by using them to wind the processed prints. Prints are usually shipped from the labs to the exchanges on these cores. The exchanges usually "mount" or wind the prints onto shipping reels for shipment to theatres.Information on how film is supplied by Kodak can be found in Kodak's publication H-1 "EASTMAN Professional Motion Picture Films". It includes information on film identification, cores and spools, and film dimensions. It is available for free download on Kodak's web site:
http://www.kodak.com/US/en/motion/support/h1
Check out the section on "Selecting Your Films", and the subsections on "Sizes Available" and "Film Identification".
Every theatre should have "split reels" or "flanges" to properly handle film when it arrives on cores rather than reels. Manufactured by companies like Goldberg Brothers Inc., these are available through theatre equipment dealers.
The Goldberg Brothers website is: http://www.goldbergbrothers.uswestdex.com
Another site is Editorial Equipment Parts Co.: http://www.eepco.com/products.html
Another supplier is L&M Editorial Inc.: http://www.lm-inc.com/price.html
------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Eastman Kodak Company
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7419
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: 716-477-5325 Fax: 716-722-7243
E-Mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 04-18-2000, 08:20 AM:
Years ago I work for a chain of chineese theatres and all the prints came without cores so we machined a teloscoping centre peice for a split reel (a inverted collet) that was used quit sucessfully for many years
Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 04-18-2000, 08:55 AM:
By the way, most of the 2" cores that are out there were originally used for shipping camera stock. Since camera stock only runs through the gate once (and then through printers), the core size is less of an issue than the size of the roll, so 2" cores are the standard. Film really shouldn't be stored on anything smaller than 3" cores for any length of time and 4" cores are preferable. The standard shipping reel (even before the Technicolor days) has a 4" hub; standard 2000' house reels have 5" hubs. Large reels and platters, of course, have larger hubs.