This is topic DTS-6D Mommieboard in forum Film Handlers' Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.
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Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 07-18-2000, 11:51 AM:
Has anyone out there ever used a generic replacement for this 486 motherboard? Would appreciate a reccomendation from someone that has done this. DTS wants a ton of $$ for a new one and the unit I am repairing was in a fire and I'm trying to hold down repair costs here for the theater. The unit actually still works, but there is so much gunk on the board that I'd rather replace it for reliabilities sake. The SCSI, timecode, and audio card are pretty clean due to their vertical position in the unit and should pose no problem down the road. The owner will purchase a new timecode reader as it's pretty bad.
Thanks,
Mark
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 07-18-2000, 12:36 PM:
While the question is being posed, has anyone found a reliable model of replacement cd-rom drives (to replace the dying Toshibas)? Two year old units and a new one dies each week and DTS is surprisingly NOT replacing them. This is a shocker to me as DTS used to stand firmly behind their products probably better than anyone else in the industry. Their current solution is to spend more thousands and buy their Teac upgrade kits. Yeah right, the money men will jump on that one. Let's see, build a new theater and spend tens of thousands to equip it with DTS sound. Two years later, the units start dying ONLY due to the fault of the cdrom drive. Contact DTS and find out they are not offering any sort of Toshiba type replacement and are pushing spending more thousands to purchase their new cdrom drive kits with new boards and firmware. That's pretty incredible when you step back and realize all that money was good for ONLY TWO YEARS!DTS's reputation has just taken a steep drop in my opinion. I do not believe I will be pushing the format as I did in the past if they can not make good on something that was their fault to begin with (hey, they chose the Toshiba drives, not me...and replacement drives are cheap). BUYER BEWARE! Go with Dolby!
Still, anyone know of some "over the counter" drives that will work properly?
Posted by Dave Cutler (Member # 515) on 07-18-2000, 01:38 PM:
Mark,Any 486 motherboard will work. An idea (that does work) to clean up the current motherboard... Take it out and remove all the chips and expansion boards. Take the motherboard and put it through the Dishwasher (without soap) on the top rack. Let it run through the dishwashers drying cycle too. Make sure it is completly dried off before re-installing though. This really does work for cleaning any computer boards.
Brad,
Any market SCSI CD-ROM drives will work in the DTS processors. You don't have to buy the upgrade kits from DTS. Just make sure you buy SCSI drives that are of the same speed (ie 8x, 16x or 32x). Should say on the drive what speed you have. Check the internet for good prices, drives should be under $20 a piece.
Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 07-18-2000, 03:00 PM:
Dave have you actually tried using other drives as the dts through software slows the fast drives down to 4x speed
The driver for the drives is emebedded in the new ROM Dos on the Aquatek card
Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 07-18-2000, 03:09 PM:
Thanks Dave, I will try it out in the dishwasher. If any board will work then thats only an easy 20 to 30.00 expenditure!! Will a pentium board also work as long as it has enough ISA slots??? Brad,
While I do agree with you and while I am a staunch Dolby supporter the Drive upgrade thing is more than just a drive upgrade. It includes a new Adaptec SCSI board and a new Aquatek ROM card. The combination of all this makes the DTS a very good running, reliable unit. I have not had any Teac failures as of yet with some being out in the field now for about 2 years. Right now I have a DTS in for repair that was in a fire. Believe it or not the unit still functions but sans the audio cause the DC converter on the audio board is bad. DTS is supplying a new DC converter at n/c!! I have had these converters fail in the past as well, but none lately. I want to replace the mother board just as a precaution as its pretty sooty. I think 666.67 list for a 486 motherboard from DTS is a bit way to steep. The Audio Card and Time code card are more in line price wise. Lets face it thats a 20 to 30 buck item in any computer rehab store.
Mark
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 07-18-2000, 09:05 PM:
Mark,I've installed the Teac upgrades before. (I even had to do it in my own screening room where the unit had run perhaps 2 dozen DTS performances at most!) It's the reliability factor that bothers me from a support standpoint. DTS should be taking care of their customers that took care of them originally when they chose the DTS system, and they are not doing so. If they chose to install faulty drives that would not last, they should be footing the bill to replace them now. Customers who bought a unit a year ago with Toshiba drives should not have to buy their upgrade kit when a customer could buy that same player with the Teac drives already installed for the same price today. Get my point? It's like "oh sorry you supported our product previously and we will not be providing any service to you, but we've fixed the failure problem now so be sure and keep buying from us as the new units will not be experiencing these difficulties". Granted that's not an actual quote, but you get the hint.
I'm sticking firmly with Dolby now. Hopefully DTS will change their philosophy before they go out of business.
Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 07-19-2000, 06:56 AM:
I was not aware that they were still selling new units with Toshiba drives only a year ago. Could these have been some of those "B" stock units that were being sold?
Since I primarily sell only Dolby I was not aware that the Toshibas were still going into new units. I'm sure you're right Brad. This has got to be a real sore spot with allot of DTS users.
Any comments Karen?????
Mark
Posted by Dave Cutler (Member # 515) on 07-19-2000, 10:28 AM:
Gordon,I have never had trouble with 'off the shelf' CD-ROM drives in DTS units.
Mark,
I haven't tried a pentium board in a DTS processor, but there is no reason, that I know of, why it wouldn't work. I heard that DTS may even be shipping new units with pentium boards (486 boards are getting harder and harder to find), but it may not be true. Karen would know, she's around here somewhere...
Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 07-19-2000, 10:36 AM:
Dave,
The problem with using a Pentium board would be that the AT style Pentium boards that would be compatable with the DTS supply are about non existant. Everything is now ATX. You could change out the power supply. But how would it power down? Most ATX boards power down through software commands from the OS. Since DTS uses the DOS OS perhaps it won't matter if you just kill the switch?????
Mark
Posted by Dave Cutler (Member # 515) on 07-19-2000, 10:42 AM:
Regarding DTS's decision not to freely distribute new TEAC drives to all theatres who purchased processors with Toshiba drives. I agree that was a little dissapointed that DTS didn't do more for it's customers. Didn't they upgrade the original timecode readers for free? I know that it would have cost a pretty penny for DTS, but think of the customer service. The least they could do would be to sell the upgrade for nearly cost. I got quoted a price of almost $600 for a DTS-6D upgrade kit. That includes a new SCSI card and a new ROM card with 3 new TEAC drives. A bit steep for an upgrade to what in essence was a defective product, it should have been a warranty replacement.I am a big DTS fan and I use DTS whenever possible, but I was dissapointed with DTS in this instance. 
Perhaps Karen will enlighten us a bit on why DTS did things the way they did?
Posted by Dave Cutler (Member # 515) on 07-19-2000, 10:46 AM:
Mark has a good point about the powersupply issue. You would have to find an older pentium AT style mobo not an ATX. The main difference being that AT has 'hard' on/of (switch controlled), while ATX has 'soft' on/off (software controlled). Probably easier to stick with a 486 mobo.
Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 07-19-2000, 11:52 AM:
What make of generic drives
I tried Acer NEC and newer Toshiba's and none would work reliably usually would run half a movie and then quit
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 07-19-2000, 01:28 PM:
Dave,Yes, please provide us with brand/model of the "off the shelf" drives that worked for you.
Posted by Karen Hultgren (Member # 395) on 07-19-2000, 03:42 PM:
Hello eveyone,The DTS-6D motherboards are indeed "off the shelf" but they require a special BIOS chip, one made specifically for DTS.
Yes, we do replace old (JURASSIC PARK) readers at no cost due to a redesign of the reader's circuit.
The drives is another issue. We do not make the drives and we cannot use just any old drive out in the market. We put them through stringent testing that involves how quickly programs can be accessed from the very outside edge to the very inside edge, speed, software compatiblity, ruggedness, etc. The 32X TEAC drives are working splendidly and we are very happy with their performance. They are not, however, a direct replacement for the Toshiba drives. The TEAC drives require special software to slow them down. Once replacing the drives, they are warrantied for a full year. AThe DTS-6D upgrade kit has a list price of $755.00 but can be purchased at a cheaper cost from one of our dealers. The kit contains 3 pre-tested 32X TEAC drives, new SCSI board, new ROM board with special software, new TCR firmware chip, and installation instructions.
As far as having to pay for the kit, that was decided by management. If you are unhappy about having to pay for it, why not give our sales department a call and discuss it? I make NO quarantees but, its worth a try. Susie is our domestic sales manager and she can be reached at 818.706.3525.
Karen at DTS
Posted by Karen Hultgren (Member # 395) on 07-19-2000, 03:44 PM:
I want to be sure you all understand that any unit that fails within a year will be repaired for free. That includes drives.Karen at DTS
Posted by Antonio Marcheselli (Member # 373) on 07-20-2000, 10:34 AM:
Hello Karen.What so you mean with "Jurassik Park" readers?
Antonio (from Italy)!
Posted by Dave Cutler (Member # 515) on 07-20-2000, 11:39 AM:
The Jurassic Park readers are the original readers that were sold to theatres when they bought a DTS-6 back in 1993. They were found to be defective and DTS will upgrade them for free. Although I doubt that there are any left in the market. If your readers don't have serial numbers they are 'Jurassic' readers.
Posted by Dave Cutler (Member # 515) on 07-20-2000, 12:01 PM:
Drives in a DTS-6D:The drives were Toshiba drives that were 6x or 8x (can't remember which) They were installed on 6 DTS-6D's (that's 18 drives), that were in CONSTANT use. About a year latter I left that theatre and they were still working at that time.
Even if they also only lasted for two years it's far cheaper than the upgrade kits.
Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 07-20-2000, 02:06 PM:
The Toshiba 6x drives and 8x are no longer made
In fact i don't think anyone makes anything slower than a 24x nowdays
so the use of generic drives is moot
The higher speed drives require a software patch to slow them down which I would assume is what the aquatec card does
Posted by Kevin Crawford (Member # 469) on 07-21-2000, 02:07 AM:
Karen,I think I just sent in the last of the Jurassic Park readers last week. Unless anyone out there cares to refute that. Believe it or not, it came from the same screen that I was asking for help with the ES.
Posted by Ari Nordström (Member # 288) on 07-21-2000, 03:53 PM:
I talked to a projectionist friend at the local multiplex today regarding using off-the-shelf CD-ROM readers, knowing that they've had to replace faulty readers in the past. He said that they've used Plextor readers (24x, as far as he knows) without any problems whatsoever. According to him, they didn't have to slow them down in any way. They basically plugged in a new unit and that was that.
Posted by Ari Nordström (Member # 288) on 07-21-2000, 04:17 PM:
I apologise if a variation of this message has turned up on the forum, but if so, I can't see any trace of it. Could be a cache problem with my IE5, conceivably.Anyway... I talked to a projectionist friend who works at the local multiplex regarding using off-the-shelf CD-ROM readers in DTS units. He says that they've replaced several faulty CD-ROM readers with Plextor 24x readers without any problems at all. According to him, they didn't have to slow them down ion any way. They basically only had to plug them in and that was that.
Posted by Karen Hultgren (Member # 395) on 07-29-2000, 03:26 PM:
Sorry I was not clear, JURASSIC PARK readers have no serial number. They were our first 1000 readers and have since been redesigned.Karen at DTS
Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 08-10-2000, 09:55 AM:
For those that may be interested the Motherboard in the DTS 486 based units is a Win Tech MV035F. This board is no longer supported by Win Tech.
Mark