This is topic How many projectionists does it take to screw in a lightbul..i mean to run a booth :) in forum Film Handlers' Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.
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Posted by Tom Kroening (Member # 201) on 08-02-2000, 02:23 AM:
Hey, I was wondering how many projectionists are upstairs at a time at your theatre and how many screens it is! Right now i work at an 18 plex and we have one person upstairs at a time (two on thrusday nights). My only gripe is that i don't have much time to do anything else but thread. When I do get the time to do something else I usually end up fixing something that broke the night before or doing filmwork/trailer changes. Id really like two people up there in the day and one at night, or two at night and one in the day. Its not fun having a diode go out in a show thats 2 minutes late and sold out without anyone downstairs that knows how to run the booth while you do repairs!
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 08-02-2000, 02:50 AM:
I run a 16-plex and there is one person in the booth except for Thursday nights. I know what you mean about repairs. Usually I have to wait until the end of the night when I am done threading, and work on stuff as the film drops. Our manager likes to make REALLY TIGHT ASS schedules, so there isn't much intermission time, and everything drops within 35 minutes of eachother. It's not hard keeping up, but it is annoying when you are trying to get something done.
Posted by Tom Kroening (Member # 201) on 08-02-2000, 03:56 AM:
I think that companies just don't see whats involved in boothwork. they think that If you can keep up with the schedule then only one person should be up there at a time. Im sure most of us could keep up with a 30 plex if teh schedule is made correctly, but the point is that there is more to do then just threading( like eating popcorn and drinking soda and using speed dial to keep calling the radio station to be caller number 8 : P) Those little breaks between sets don't even count because all the shows are still running.
Posted by Nicholas McRobert (Member # 205) on 08-02-2000, 05:44 AM:
Very different circumstances in Europe, it would seem. At my cinema, we have 4 full time projectionists; two are present between 2pm and 10pm, with only one covering the start and end of the day, except for the beginning of the week where we bring two in for essential maintenance at about 10am....changing lights at high level etc. We also have two projection rooms, separated by 2 floors, so maybe that counts for something (we also do ALL maintenance...not just projection stuff). I hear that in France, some cinemas run with a screen 
rojectionist ratio in mind. For example, they will have a minimum of one projectionist per 4 screens....so a 16 screener always has 4 people on there.Nicholas
Posted by Greg Mueller (Member # 17) on 08-02-2000, 09:21 AM:
Nicholas
That probably explains why used film in Europe is in better shape than in the US. With more hands to help, more attention can be paid. Maybe if there were more hands available in the US theaters, film would not get beatup as much, the quality would remain higher for longer and the idea that digital projection is a necessary thing, would have no basis (not that it does anyway). ------------------
Greg Mueller
Amateur Astronomer, Machinist, Filmnut
Posted by Paul Konen (Member # 41) on 08-02-2000, 09:24 AM:
At the 24 screen I'm at it works the following way:
2 Open til 5 pm
1 5pm until 11 pm or last start.
1 5 pm until close.Thursday we will have at least 2 extra people maybe 3-4 depending on how many prints will have to be screened, ads changed out, technicolor prints broken down, etc.
Posted by Dave Cutler (Member # 515) on 08-02-2000, 10:22 AM:
At BarryWoods 24 I run with 1 opener, 1 mid shift and 1 closer on Sunday - Thursday. Friday and Saturday I have 2 openers and 2 closers. I am there on Thursday nights non-op to make sure everything is ready for Friday morning.Personally I feel that a projectionist should not have to operate more than 10 projectors under normal circumstances. That way you are assured proper coverage if something were to go wrong (and it inevitibly does).
I also work as a 15/70 projectionist where we have 3 full time projectionists. One opener and one closer with about 5 hours (some times more) of overlap time where both are there.
Posted by John Pytlak (Member # 331) on 08-02-2000, 10:35 AM:
I think the title of this thread, "How many projectionists does it take to screw in a lightbul..i mean to run a booth 
", is very appropriate. When things are running well, one skilled person can competently run quite a few screens (through the miracle of platters, xenon lamps, and automation systems). But when something goes wrong (lamp needing to be changed, film jam, sound outage, etc.), it's nice to have an extra person capable of lending a hand.IMHO, the key is always having a SKILLED person in the booth, who is able to handle normal "emergencies" on duty, and perform routine maintenance. The person making up and breaking down shows also needs to be a COMPETENT film handler, who really cares about quality. In most cases, this means regarding and rewarding projection as a CAREER, rather than a just a part time job or temporary stepping stone to management.
Sadly, projection and sound quality, and the people trying to maintain them, are often too low on the priority list of some of today's theatre circuits. 
------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Eastman Kodak Company
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7419
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: 716-477-5325 Fax: 716-722-7243
E-Mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Posted by Scott McFly (Member # 556) on 08-02-2000, 10:41 AM:
we only have 1 person to run 10 screens and there are times when i have a good 45 minutes with nothing to do, if something breaks i can fix it in 5 minutes or less, so i end up sitting around reading or something. my only gripe is there isnt enough to do! on thursdays we only have one person, the movies get put together either that night if not in the morning.
Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 08-02-2000, 10:43 AM:
John is right. I would make the point that a slow day at a 10-plex (no prints to make up/break down, no trailers to change, only one or two print moves, etc.) requires less actual work than a manual single-screen with carbon-arc lamps, but requires an operator with far more skill. In a large multiplex, there is limited time to fix problems as they arise or to work around flakey equipment, so everything must be maintained to a higher standard in this sort of environment. When things do go wrong, they need to be fixed quickly and properly. Admittedly, it's easy to run around, thread projectors, and set timers, but there is far more to the job than that, even if the theatre has good automation equipment.
Given the choice, though, I'd take a manual single-screen booth over a multiplex.
Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 08-02-2000, 11:31 AM:
I say the trick is to "train" your manager. Nowadays, the booth manager is also in charge of ushers, or something. Get your mgr. up in the booth and "encourage" him to roll up his sleeves and thread.Give the poor guy some slack. Teach him the right way and don't ride him too hard.
Once the mgr. finds out what the work is like, he'll loosen up.
Posted by Dustin Mitchell (Member # 372) on 08-02-2000, 11:57 AM:
Monday's through Thursday's we run 1 projectionist/usher for 12 screens. That's right, run the booth AND clean your theatres. No wonder nothing ever gets done around here. Thursday's the 1 usher gets as much done as he can as far as building up/tearing down. I finish the rest Friday morning/afternnon. Friday-Sunday afternoon we run 2 projectionist/usher's, each take 6 screens. If we only had to run the booth, 1 person could do it EASILY. Even counting in breakdowns and considering we have no timers.
Posted by Kevin Crawford (Member # 469) on 08-02-2000, 01:18 PM:
The chain that I service does not believe in timers, or remote start. So everything must be started at the machine. We have one 14 plex with one operator. The two other gigaplexes (a 16 and an 18) each have two people on at the same time. I just don't see the logic in having one person kill themselves to run more than 10 screens at a time. But then again why would you need a clean booth, or maintained equipment?
Posted by John Walsh (Member # 168) on 08-02-2000, 02:42 PM:
I work in an 8-plex. We have no operators in the booth, except for Thursday night, Friday night, and Saturday night. I'm the Friday and Saturday night guy. If I can't make it, they won't get someone to replace me. Management feels that 8 theaters are not enough to justify any "booth-only" personal except for those nights (and they feel it's borderline on whether one is needed on Friday and Saturday night.)We also do not have any remote alarms, timers, etc. So if there's a problem when there's no operator, a patron almost always has to come out and tell someone.
Posted by John Pytlak (Member # 331) on 08-02-2000, 03:09 PM:
John Walsh said:"We have no operators in the booth, except for Thursday night, Friday night, and Saturday night...So if there's a problem when there's no operator, a patron almost always has to come out and tell someone."
A skilled operator is an unnecessary expense for eight screens? Whatever happened to "Showmanship"? 
Who's going to turn out the lights and board-up the doors when audiences stay home to watch movies on their DLP home Digital Cinema, and theatres go out of business? This is depressing .
------------------
John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Eastman Kodak Company
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7419
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: 716-477-5325 Fax: 716-722-7243
E-Mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 08-02-2000, 03:35 PM:
I agree with John. If customers spend an average of about 10 or 15 minutes (at the most) in the lobby, and the average movie is anywhere between 100 and 150 minutes long, then the onscreen presentation becomes 10 TIMES MORE IMPORTANT than anything else in the theatre, as Brad pointed out in his essay under the TIPS section of this site. And the sad thing is that the booth is usually the most highly neglected area. What's up with that?
Posted by Rory Burke (Member # 512) on 08-02-2000, 03:52 PM:
Early this year a local theater company built a 22 Plex all THX complex in the desert east of L.A. The original plan for booth operation was as follows. Two projectionists on duty threading and running shows all day long and the head projectionist doing nothing but touring the downstairs auditoriums doing physical checks for picture and sound. This is where volumes for trailers(Ted Costas), focus and etc adjustments were made. Sounds like it could have been an ideal situation for the movie-goer. However, the real corporate world mandates fiscal viability and accountabilty and per cap #'s blah blah blah. Cut backs must be made.
The result; One projectionist running around starting 22 consecutive shows with an hour and a half down time and picture and sound quality is check 00000000 times all day. (gate assemblies are purple like grapes) Never mind that a ORC 3k lamp for $850.00 (and its kinda of a high price id say)pays for iself with pennies. If a 3k lamp last say three months that $850/90 days = $9.4 a day for the cost of the lamp. Say five shows a day with 100 seats occupied per showing and it costs $.01880 per person to cover the cost of ONE lamp.
You know the rest.....right?....I dont need to stress the fact that with no interest in the booth and its personel(union or not) that the whole purpose of why people go to the movies to begin with (not for 900% mark up popcorn or soda or uncooked green hotdogs) is to watch that "picture box" (with digital surround sound now a days) that is adequately presented. No interest(support) in the booth and its personell HAS ITS SYMPTOMS. HORRIBLE PRESTENTATION. Should the customer stand for this? Is it not the theater owner's responsibility...no...obligation to stress quality? Are customers really sheep like? Can you just really show CRAP presentations and expect the customer to come back over and over again and get the same quality without receiving any complaining? Should there be yet another beaurocratic organization that evolves to "ensure" quality yet compromises its integrity when the money is right? What is the answer?
I think that If I were a theater owner and had it in mind to have the lousiest quality presentation for what ever my customers could handle all in the interest of saving $money$, I would then rather invest my money into cp-45's with Radio Shack Amps through cheesy speakers and call it quits at that. Why build walls with STC requirements and acoustical panelling. Why cut out holes in baffle walls to house your speakers...why build baffle walls? Why care about gain screens or curved screens to gain light as your unfocused flickering bulb wastes away with less than 2 ft/lamberts on the screen.
What is the point? Anyone? Inquiring minds want to know.Rory Burke
Picture and Sound....not Popcorn and Soda!!!
Posted by Ben Wales (Member # 92) on 08-02-2000, 03:54 PM:
A skilled operator is an unnecessary expense for eight screens? Whatever happened to "Showmanship"? How true this is today, the venue I work at in London has just has two screens, screening the same 40min film everyday for the past 7 months, and there are six of us!
a luxury by todays standards!, although most days we run with just three projectionists.
Posted by Stephen Jones (Member # 16) on 08-02-2000, 10:45 PM:
In the 8 plex were I currently work there are only 1 projectionist on per shift.The same applies on make up day as well.Ad and trl changes are performed by the projectionist on duty as are make ups and breakdowns and any other things that come up and it can get very full on when there is only you on these days.If things dont get finished on time it's just bad luck as they wont put an extra person on even for a few hours,this would be a help but I guess it all comes down to dollars and cents as is the norm these days.
An average shift in our booth is 7hrs 15 min which is a hard day on your own makeing up 4-5 prints and threading etc.Dont worry be happy 
Stephen
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Posted by George Roher (Member # 91) on 08-02-2000, 11:02 PM:
It's too bad so many managers/execs think that threading is all the job consists of. One manager from a large chain told me that a clean bathroom is what the customers want and that the booth isn't very important in the operation of a theatre. I think that when you have enough screens that there are no longer any tangible periods of downtime (shows are constantly starting instead of having "rounds" of shows), then two operators would be a good idea. The powers that be think we're lazy if we aren't on our feet constantly. But having downtime is useful for careful film inspection, maintenance and assorted chores around the booth. Besides, if you get to sit down for a little while and eat your dinner slowly enough that you don't make yourself sick, that's not a bad thing.
Posted by John Walsh (Member # 168) on 08-02-2000, 11:31 PM:
JP wrote: "This is depressing."It sure is. One reason I seem to always be in the "negative" mode is that there's no real pride in this job anymore.
In 1983, I helped design a booth, and worked there for the next ten years or so. (JJ's, CP200, custom subs, Rank automation, both a real traveler curtian and main with footlights.) A pretty nice place. A great guy named Bob Marr (he works for Sony now) ran us, and would actually listen, and pay for improvments if you could prove your theater wasn't meeting SMPTE standards.
Ran a 70mm feature about twice a year from '83 to '87 or so. Never really lost that little "thrill" of seeing a packed house waiting for you.
When a 70mm feature would open, I'd get there at 6:00am and clean the entire booth and wax the floor. The demag'ing ceremony would not be done until that gauss meter didn't move at all. I'd sit on the tech's shoulder and make sure the head alignment was right, the screen was 16+- 2. NOT 14.9 - NOT 18.1. That the image was 0.868" by 1.913" -no cropping. And check the B chain, anyway. Etc, etc, and no "it's good enough" bullshit.
When the print came, I'd remove those 35/70mm intermittent sprockets from their little felt home I'd made, and slide them on their shafts like having sex. The same sprocket went on the same projector, always in the same direction.
Open that first big aluminum 70mm shipping case. Breath in. "I love the smell of mag striping in the morning! Smells like.... showmanship!" To hell with the EPA. Even the labs know not to screw around with 70mm. They almost always come heads-up, on good quality aluminum reels, no lab splices, plenty of thread-up and run-out leader.
It takes a short time to get used to threading 70mm- it's so wide. You can't tuck the loose end in the side of the reel flange like 35mm; it falls out, so it must be taped down. The image is so big, you could'nt possibly thread out of frame. Put your fingers right up next to where the pad rollers hold the film, before closing them slowly- never just snap them closed. After a while, (even with 35mm) you can tell which side is the base and which is emulsion just by feeling.
It's all threaded and I start the projector. It's a little scary to see all that mass move at once. The projector doesn't even sound the same as when running 35mm... gonna have to get used to a whole new set of noises.
But it's all worth it for a picture you think you could almost just walk into, and sound with those crispy highs...
-----
Today, people do come to theaters to see a film, but the theaters are made to sell candy and soda. Management buys a platter from the lowest bidder; you are hoping it has a fast motor so you can finish breaking down and be out before 3:00 am so you can get a few hours sleep before making up a bunch of shows- speed it up and let it rock like an old washing machine. You'd like to watch the trailers all the way through to ensure the cue sets the formats correctly, but there are other shows starting at the same time, (usually at opposite ends of the building- do they do this on purpose!?) The ushers management hired to work in the booth made three out of frame splices way in, you have to change out several stupid ads for other stupid ads, the bulbs in a couple of slide projectors are dead (I don't remember getting any more money when I was made responsible for slide projectors and screen ads), I put the splicer on an electrical trough somewhere but can't find it now, I gotta train this new kid, hope that gate band doesn't break, cause we don't have anymore, when did that sprocket tooth get nicked- is it damaging film? I hear that "crunchy-film" sound at the tail leader- they must have left the end taped again, will they ever learn to put tools back when done? Etc, etc.
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 08-03-2000, 04:24 AM:
John,Is that your version of cyber sex for projectionists? 
Posted by Rory Burke (Member # 512) on 08-03-2000, 11:52 AM:
What the *#&%( is going on in this industry? Im afraid to declare that the typical projection booth has gone to the L.A. Riots!!!! I'm talking the Lakers have won and mahem is now in the streets. Last week, a head projectionist at a local L.A. theater got fired for cutting out all the "good parts" on "Road Trip" (yes it took this long to find out it happened). When finally confronted, his reply was "I didn't think it was a big deal...I do it all the time!"
*#**%(#)%)#(% @(#(%)@%)!!!!!!!
What is going on in our booths? Showmanshp? Im just trying to get to accountability first and decent work ethics. I think the entire responsibility is on the Theater owner. Ultimately its his ship that will sink. No? I cant believe what this industry tries to dish out sometimes. Who pays for it ultimately? The projectionists who has to adapt and overcome and deal with day to day inconsistencies and unknowns? I think that is the best that comes of it; a psuedo resourceful worker. The loser is the customer. They are being robbed daily I feel. Stripped from that "Showmanship" that theater owners compromise for $$$$.
John P. I appreciate all that you do for this forum. Your expertise and info is invaluable.Rory Burke
Posted by Florian Pausch (Member # 708) on 08-03-2000, 04:19 PM:
From 1990 to 1998 I worked at the "Votiv-Kino", the leading arthouse cinema in Vienna / Austria. In that time we had 2 screens, 2 booths (at the opposite sides of the cinema),each equipped with 2 FP 20īs/1800 Meters changeover and Kinoton-Matrix automation.
To increase the quality of our shows, I "re-invented" the Intermission after the commercials/trailers, so the main film had (and has until today) to be started with the operator in the booth (celebrating curtain lights and gong). Usually, we had one projectionist for the evening and one for the schools at morning, at gala openings we were two people in the booth.
I agree to John Pytlaks reply - you have to be a skilled operator AND you have to love the job. Good projectionists have to have the sixth sense for their work. When Iīm training people, we do it usually in a little cinema with projectors from the 30īs, manual c/o and 2000 ft-reels, because only there they can learn the rhythm of the cinema (how long will it take to interrupt coffee and go back to the booth for the next c/o?)and the skill to change over in a manner that nobody will be reminded of that fool behind the wall. You canīt learn this knowledge in a 1800 meter or platter cinema or an x-plex - and that is why the level of showmanship is so low in our multiplexes here in Vienna. (Not to speak of missing curtains and blankings)
So long
Flo
Posted by John Walsh (Member # 168) on 08-04-2000, 01:20 PM:
Brad wrote: ".... cyber sex for projectionists?"Yeah, er.. sorry for the rant! I'm changing my (daytime) job, and my co-workers took me out and made me get drunk. Watch out for drinks that come with little umbrellas in them. Then I came home and over-typed like I usually do. It was their fault! Blame them!
Posted by Kevin Crawford (Member # 469) on 08-04-2000, 11:52 PM:
Damn John, if you write that well drunk, how do you drive drunk? Better yet are you union? Cause we have a nasty reputation of being a bunch of drunks.
Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 08-05-2000, 04:15 AM:
An 8-plex without a designated operator? Now THAT'S just plain sad...We're adding two extra screens that will hopefully be up before Christmas. Our owner called me in the other day and wanted to know if we would need another operator (this will only make it six screens but, with the exception of one twin booth, they'll all be separate and on different levels...old cinema added onto etc...) I said we should be able to handle it with one per shift and two for ad/trailer change out day shift on a Wednesday which is what we have now.
He looked at me and, instead of putting that already budgeted money for an extra operator per shift back in his account, he said: 'Well, in that case, lets use that money and make the other screens as technically hassle free as possible'. Hence, we're now getting retrofits of new electronic payouts on the platters in the other screens etc.
It makes such a nice change to work for a boss who gives a shit.
------------------
The Olympics are coming...RUN FOR YOUR LIVES!!! 
Posted by John Walsh (Member # 168) on 08-05-2000, 02:08 PM:
Kevin: I have no problem driving drunk. It's just that everyone else seems to get in my way...! Besides, I just lean the car into the guardrail, and fall out at my exit. I do have to say one good thing about the company I work for: they buy good quality equipment, and the auditouriums are expertly designed and installed by a top-notch guy.
But when it comes to labor, I feel they are too cheap. Admittedly, labor is the single highest cost item to deal with, but I think I'd rather have mediocre equipment and really good operators- rather than great equipment and poor (or non-existent) operators.
Posted by Kevin Crawford (Member # 469) on 08-06-2000, 11:32 PM:
Really John. I never seem to get into accidents. But strangely, alot of people behind me do.