A couple of weeks ago, we had an upgrade kit put in our DTS 6D unit. The reasoning behind this upgrade was 2-fold: to try and correct a automation problem (The CP-65 would trip to Non-sync every once in a great while in the middle of a show) and to also try and solve a "lock up" problem with the deck (The unit would lock-up [all of the drive light freeze and we are forced to power the unit off and back on] right after the initial power-up or in the the middle of the movie during the CD switch from drive A to B). Before this upgrade the digital signal on the reader was not solid green 100% of the time, but the digital never tripped out.

After this "upgrade" we started to have problems in that the digital would "drop" out during the middle of the film. The reader would flicker and pick up a time code inconsistency and at times, it was long enough between the time code reads to make the CP65 trip to Dolby SR. Well, this "swapping" in and out of digital was very annoying and noticing. There were even times when the audio in the theatre would be "cropped" by the 6D unit.

We discussed it with our tech and not much became of it. Next, we had ocean's 11 in the theatre and it played back flawlessly so we pretty much put the problem on the back-burner.

On Wed, we opened LOTRs. Well, starting about 1 hour into the movie, the digital again begins to trip in and out and we have some very unhappy customers. We call our techs and complain and they ship us a new reader. We install the reader and the signal coming off from the DTS reader is great - solid green 99% of the time. We run the next showing of LOTRs and again, about 1 hour into the movie, the digital begins cutting in and out. We swap our other print of LOTRs into the theatre in hopes that the print was back. Once again ,the same thing happens: no digital after reel 3. We call our tech and they bring down an entirely new 6D unit and put it in. We run LOTRs through again and the same thing happens: OK for the first hour, dropping in and out of DTS the rest of the film.

We next try Ali in the theatre. Reels 1-3 are perfects and then starting with reel 4, the digital signal on the DTS reader is falling in and out. During one of the reels, there is absolutely no signal coming off from the print.

We move Ali out and put Oceans 11 back in the theatre and everything is perfect again.

We have tried adjusting the tention rollors on the reader. We have replaced the belt on the motor drive for the projector. We have tried everything that we know of to correct the issue, but have not gotten anything back on the status.

Can any Help???
Thanks in advance -
Cory
 

Past that, what is the firmware version on your timecode board? (It is clearly labeled on the chip.)
 

It seems that you have multiple problems.

1. A weel working timecode reader should stay solid green for almost 100% time. No problem if you have *few* timecode drop (not sound drop!) but not more.
2. If you have some reels with completely NO green led, probably your reel is bad printed or (did you check it?) it doesn't have DTS timecode printed on that reel. In that case ask for a replacement of the defective reels.
3. I found that reader alignement in the projector is VERY important. When new readers come to my theater I found that the timecode signal was not very strong and I was disappointed because there were new readers! I found then that old reader's rollers where not original and not perfectly aligned with the readers. I removed the rollers and now I project DTS encoded movies with NO timecode drop during the entire film. So, pls check that the print does not fold itself into the readers or seems to be not perfectly aligned with the projector.
4. If your reader and timecode LED on 6D is ON, it is a player or Disk problem
5. Check TCR chip version as Brad's suggestion.

A well aligned DTS system works perfectly, so you will surely resolve you problem.

Hope that this helps you!

Karen: why DTS "crop" sound when timecode gone? Why doesn't it drop tu SR/DD BEFORE sound buffer is completely empty????

Bye
Antonio
 

Next you need to open up the unit and make sure, as brad stated, that it is the most up to date firmware chip available.

While inside the unit make sure all the cards are seated correctly. When your unit was upgraded, most likely, the new drives are teac and the old ones were toshiba. When these drive brands are changed you have to add a new card to the system and remove a chip off of the timecode board. Make sure these boards are seated properly.

Finally check all wireing conections inside unit.

The key in this situation was that the scratch was linear to the tracks on the CD-rom. A scratch that's perpendicular to the tracks probably would've played fine.
 

I will follow up on what was listed here, but hopefully one of these will fix the problem. Not being to play LOTRs in DTS sucks...
 

Ok now I know this is a real longshot, but by any chance did your theater run the first teaser trailers for "The Lost World" with the strobe lights hooked up to the dts unit as a lightning effect? I have found that the extra card that was installed in the 6-d units to achieve that provided endless problems like this. The solution was simple...just to remove it. (Heck, there hasn't been a use for it since anyway!) Anyway the odds are probably ten thousand to one, but I thought I would mention it anyway.
 

-Aaron

 

Since your equipment is completely new and Ocean's 11 was played back properly, I think that alignment, tension and grounding are the only thing that you can check. I do not believe that firmware version can cause these problems plus, your TCR chip was shipped by DTS with the upgrade kit.

Karen from DTS is on vacation right now, she will be back on 2nd, Jan. She will be able to help you better with this problem.

Hope that this could help you.

regards
Antonio
 

I agree with you with Print, Disk but not readers!
A bad reader will affect all print.
A bad grounding will affect all print too!
So I would check reader alignement and grounding!

My old (1993) readers started, during last times, to drop signal after 2 hours of work. But there were very old...

Bye
Antonio
 

If you have drop outs at the same point in the film, it is probably a bad reel and you call the distribuator for a replacement.

When seeing timecode, the reader's green LED should be bright and steady. It should not blink a lot - occassional blink is okay.

It sounds like your tech has replaced the reader and the player. Since neither has fixed the problem, indications point to a system malfunction.

As others have mentioned, tension is very important. The film should run smoothly through the reader. Film bounce will cause you all types of problems.

Is there a SDDS reader on top of the DTS readers? If yes, that could be the problem since they use a spring roller at their output.

Try moving the discs around to see if the problem follows a disc. Request new discs if it is apparant that that is the problem.

Please feel free to send me an email for more information.

Karen at DTS
khultgren@dtsonline.com
 

Keep in mind that Ocean's 11 is almost solid green for then entire movie and it had played back flawlessly since we had it in there - 2 different prints of it, 2 different disc sets.

Heres the tally so far:
Play back perfectly: Oceans 11 (2 different prints), Vanilla Sky
Play back poorly and trip in and out of digital from time to time: Beautiful Mind.
Play back great for first hour and then either no time code for long periods of time or the digital is kicking in and out constantly: LOTRs (2 different prints), Ali.

Please Help!
 

Charles
 

The only time I have seen a report like the one you posted at the top of this page, either the setup was running through an SDDS reader before the dts reader...the film cleaner had been dropped and was exhibiting a strong bounce to the film...or the reader was infact defective.

Definitely it is a reader problem!
When Timecode is lost DTS players will continue playing the soundtrack for 4.5 seconds (right?). So it is "normal" that digital sound will continue if timecode is flickering. Digital will drop only when timecode signal is lost for 4 or more seconds. However having a flickering timecode will not help in system reliability!
I had your same problem with my old readers: some films were read perfectly, other ones not. But my readers were very old. Now that I have repaired them I have absolutely NO problem. Every movie is read perfectly, with NO timecode flickering, in any moment.
I beleive that it is an alignment or a tension problem. Did you read the DTS troubleshooting manual? It contains a lot of helpful hints.
This is what Karen said few posts ago:

"When film is running, be sure the timecode light is on solid and not blinking. An occasional blink is OK but if it blinks a lot, then there is a problem. Usually, a blinking timecode light means bad back tension. This is easily checked by using your finger to gently press on the film as it enters the reader (do this while film is running)."

Let's do this tests and let us know the results.

Bye
Antonio

 

I think that print shouldn't stay "loose" in the reader. Try the finger trick to see what happen.
Also, try (while you keep the print with the fingers) to remove the print from the DTS tension roller before the reader. Mine was just not aligned with the reader and caused the print to enter misaligned. I removed the roller and the readers work pefectly. But it is just my case (I have a lot of tension before the reader and the extra roller is not necessary), with platter I believe that extra roller is needed.

Let us know!

Bye
Antonio
 

Cory has tried two different readers, I don't think that both was misaligned...

Cory, Behind the reader's plug you can see the revision of the reader. Can you read it?

Bye
Antonio
 

When I first went to the Galaxy there was one dts system that absolutely would not track. I swapped the reader (and player) and the problem remained with the projector. Turned out whoever had changed belts in the projector last didn't do too good of a job, for when I reset the belt tension, the dts started tracking fine and dandy. Although not a big possibility, it is possible something is vibrating on your projector.

Also to clarify again, "enough tension" is absolutely incorrect. All that matters is "consistent tension". It can be a lot of tension, or basically zero tension. It only matters that it is not changing (such as a bounce from the payout platter). On Christie platters, better performance can be obtained by removing that spring in the center brain roller completely. Even with the spring removed, the platter will still provide more tension than almost every other platter ever made and will no longer require constant maintenance of relubricating the spring.

Didn't know that about the DTS readers...why wouldn't the DTS reader lose the timecode when jumping between randomly spliced trailers? Just curious how that would work...

DTS uses timecode to tell the player what trailer/feature is running and at what frame it is at. Cut up a couple of trailers and watch for yourself. It'll track your edits perfectly.