Rather than purchase platters and an automation system, theatres with only one or a few screens already having two projectors per screen may have decided to "automate" by simply using 6000-foot reels to allow an hour or so between changeovers. Could even get away with keeping carbon arcs that allowed a 1-hour trim. Works great on paper, but many of these "conversions" to 6000 foot reels did not pay enough attention to maintaining the proper low tension on the film, per SMPTE Recommended Practice RP 106. The simple friction clutches used for 2000-foot reels usually leads to erratic and often excessive tension when handling a 6000-foot roll.

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John P. Pytlak, Senior Technical Specialist
Worldwide Technical Services, Entertainment Imaging
Research Labs, Building 69, Room 7525A
Rochester, New York, 14650-1922 USA
Tel: 585-477-5325 Cell: 716-781-4036 Fax: 585-722-7243
E-Mail: john.pytlak@kodak.com
Web site: http://www.kodak.com/go/motion

I used to run 5K or 6K at the drive-ins until late in the season when it was stub burning time.

Not to twist the subject to much, why did Norelco have reel cases that fit a 5K reel but not a 6K?

 

Fact is, we have 6000ft magazines originally designed for 3D interlock and a bunch of very good 6000ft floating hub reels, but I never use them, precisely for the reason John pointed out -- I find the design of the take-up friction/slip cluch not nearly accurate enough to keep a safe tension on the film. When you set it to turn a full 6000ft reel, the pull on the film when the reel is empty is much too tight. If you set it to allow a gentle tension on the nearly empty reel, you may find film all over the floor as the reel fills to capacity.

I would probably look more favorably on making up 6000ft reels if I could use a takeup that was designed specifically for this size reel or my existing takeups could be modified to be driven by a separate motor whose torque could be controlled by the tension required to wind the film safely.
 

I like running 6000 footers in the unlikely event that a projector goes down. Losing a show here is not an option for our clients, so I can just throw in an intermission. I don't think that they mind 5 minutes while I rethread instead of writing off the whole night as a loss!
 

Joe: Why on earth would you run 20mins when you could run 80min changeovers?!
 

I have one question for you, Barry. Your set-up makes sense for 6000'. Is there room in your booth for a platter, too? I assume not, as I haven't seen a changeover booth that was big enough for two projectors and a platter, but I am curious.

However, the number one reason that I will not change to a platter is reliability. I have nothing against platters per say as I have had a number of theatres over the years with them. Properly used and maintained they will serve well, BUT... just think for a moment, is there anything mechanical that you own that NEVER breaks down? How about your car, your washer or dryer, heating system, dishwasher... they all break down at some point no matter how well they are maintained. And so does projection equipment. A projection system is just like a chain... only as good as the weakest link. Blow a bulb, strip a gear, lose a platter or projector motor, blow the power supply or even a exhaust fan and you're out of business. It's refund time! And it always happens on Saturday night during the 7 o'clock round. This website is filled with posts of stories of various booth and projection/sound disasters of every sort. Almost every one of them would not have happened or could have been rectified quickly on a reel to reel system.

The bottom line is that in thirty one and a half years of operation with reel to reel I have NEVER, please let me say that again... NEVER given a pass or refund for a lost show, as I have never had a lost show. Have I had breakdowns... YES, of course I have. But, I'm back on the screen within two or three minutes on the other projector. How many of you with platters can make that statement?

Now having said all that, I will agree that I wouldn't want to run a 15 plex with all reel to reels with only one operator. But in a single or a twin... 6000' reels is the best way to go.
 

Lots of the old palace single screen, first run theatres had booths with THREE(!) change-over projectors. Now THAT's the way to run a festival!
 

I liked running large reels, but haven't done it in a while. Everything around here is either small reels or platters, it seems.
 

The following quote from you is where I must take exception:
"I must point out one very important argument here. If a show stops
for any reason, even if only for 2-3 minutes, the entire audience should be refunded." That statement shows that you really have little regard for your patrons. You also say "your customers are important" and yet you would chase them home and ruin their evening rather then have a small interruption in the show that most will forget ever happened. I think the average moviegoer would be much more upset about not getting to see the rest of the show then they would about a brief interruption of several minutes. I know I would. After having gotten my family ready, made the trip to the theatre,purchased refreshments, and have gotten into the storyline I would be pissed that it couldn't be completed. What about the annoyance of having to go through the refund process for possibly several hundred people? And doesn't that take away from the attention that should be given other customers coming in to see other shows?

It has always been my policy that if something happens that can not be corrected in a matter of a minute ot two, I go downstairs and explain to the audience why there has been an interruption and how long it will take to get the show back on screen. I can only think of three times that I have had to do that over the past thirty one years. One time when I was running the first showing of "City Slickers 2" when we got to the middle of the fifth reel, suddenly the picture was upside down. In the middle of that reel was a three minute segment that had been put in backwards at the last theatre when they obviously had had a breakdown. They probably threw a print. I learned a big lesson that day. Even though I checked every splice, I hadn't looked to see that the frames were headed in the same direction. I always do at the beginning or end of a reel, but as that was in the middle of the reel I missed it. Never again was that to happen as I have checked for that at every splice since. However, when it happened I knew it would take a while to correct and went downstairs to explain that it may take up to ten minutes, and that if anyone wanted a refund or pass they were welcome to one. No one ask for one, everyone wanted to see the end of the show. It took seven minutes for me to get back on the screen. I had many comments from patrons as they left about how quickly things were restored... not one complaint. A few people even ask why when things go wrong at the mall theatres that they can never fix anything and they are forced to leave. That was the one time I came close to ruining my perfect record of never having to refund for a breakdown, but the patrons were with me and wanted the show more then a refund. Lucky me!

Brad, have you even been a theatre owner? Not a manager, but an owner. The one who must pay the bills! I can't believe that you would jeopardize the financial sercurity of your theatre and your employees due to a brief two or three minute intteruption of the show. Possibly thousands of dollars in refunds as well as hundreds of unhappy patrons who may never come back again. A very poor management decision. A decision that would get you fired at almost any theatre in America. And rightly so.
 

My statement is that these people pay a lot of money to experience a show in any theater, including yours. If your show stops for 2 minutes because a gear broke and you can simply move the film over to the second projector then I have two things to say about that.

#1 You are VERY lucky to be running changeovers in this situation, for you can keep the show running with only a minimal interruption. A platter theater would have to take the time out to repair the projector.

#2 If you allow these sort of interruptions and only offer an apology, then shame on you. That is not good customer service in my book and if I was a customer I would not be back.

No I have never been a theater owner and yes I know how difficult it is to make ends meet, but I feel very strongly about customer satisfaction. I am getting the impression that you do not. Please correct me on your standpoint, because that's just pathetic if that is how you treat your valued customers. "Shit happens" is not an acceptable excuse for giving your patrons a flawed performance.

#1 You are VERY lucky to be running changeovers in this situation, for you can keep the show running with only a minimal interruption. A platter theater would have to take the time out to repair the projector."

Sorry Brad, that is often wrong. A true story follows, it happened to me as a true manager-operator on the last show of a Friday night at Centerpoint Six in B'ham about a month after its opening (with rebuilt projectors). That would be about August of 1982...

I was manager operator with one inexperienced employee with me at the time. An intermittent seized and froze on me on a projector that was playing to a near full house (house 4). The money had already been deposited, and there was literally no way I could give refunds to all the people in that auditorium. The house across the booth (same size, house 3) was playing to two couples.

I flipped the manual douser in that house a couple of times, cut off the light and stopped the projector with the sound on, then went into the house with four people and lied my ass off that the film had broken, gave them refunds AND double passes and directed them into another film with profuse apologies, while at the same time I had the employee go in the other auditorium to let the audience know we were working on the problem and to please remain seated because the film would be restarting momentarily.

Once the four people were satisfied and out of the way, I went into the packed house and announced "I've got some bad news and I've got some good news. The bad news is that the projector showing your film just broke and can't be repaired, but the good news is that there is an empty auditorium across the hall and we'll continue showing the movie there in four minutes. Anyone who wants passes or refunds, please wait until I've started the rest of the show for those people who want to see it."

I did a splicer cut on the film, used a scrap trailer for leader and threaded from the top of the platter to the top of the other platter, through the projector, to a roller on a MUT and back to the platter.

Once the show was running comfortably, I showed the employee the stop button and told her to watch for glitches while I went down to take care of the few people wanting passes "Sorry about the problem, You have your choice of two passes for upcoming movies or one refund, your choice." Everyone except one couple took passes.

I made sure that I was on the floor as the movie finished, to hand each person a pass, and in case there were complaints. As with Richard's example, there were none, and there were compliments about the ingenuity of saving the show.

I think Spock said the operative phrase in one of the Star Trek movies just before he died...

I mention this not to get in the middle of your discussion with Richard, but to show that there can be alternative ways to handle problems that result in everyone being happy. To be honest, I might not have thought about this particular solution if it hadn't been for Bob Wall casually mentioning of the idea of interlocking auditoriums when he introduced me to that booth. I had already been thinking, "...if I just put a roller here, and threaded this up there.."

 

Having a problem of any nature (large or small) and not offering a refund (or "passes") for the brief interruption or inability to finish the presentation is just poor showmanship. Perhaps that is a more clear way to put it?

Remember, passes to return mean just that...your customers will be returning and there is a very good chance they will buy concessions. We all know that theaters don't make their money on the box office, plus NOTHING lights up people's disappointed faces better than a "free pass".

Believe me, I see your point on offering some good will during a mishap (either human or electro/mechanical) but I say let the situation dictate the appropriate response. And I do put a distinction on if the customer knew about the problem BEFORE buying their ticket than if their perfect show comes to grinding halt. I do tend to think that the short time it takes to rethread a projector (couple of minutes, tops) is within the realm of not too severe but I am clearly biased on this view point.

Steve

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"Old projectionists never die, they just changeover!"
 

Also, I haven't paid for a movie since 1986, so it is not I who feels cheated or "entitled to a refund". It is just a matter of treating my customers right. You may forget Steve, but I was a manager for many years. If a single screen indie theater cannot afford to offer cash refunds, they can at least do SOMETHING like offer a pass, or perhaps a free popcorn or soda on their next visit coupon. For people to pay full price, only to have their show breakdown (again, even if for only 2 minutes) and NOT be offered SOMETHING, that's just bad...which is how I read Richard's response to the theoretical situation.

I believe that I was quite clear about my offer for refunds when I knew that there would be a lengthy interruption. As I am the projectionist, I am the one who will be making the switch or repair in the booth, and if I know that I can restore the show in under three minutes I'm not going to waste time going down to explain what has happened, but rather will resolve the problem and get things running again. Obviously if a patron or patrons want a refund during that time they can go out to the lobby where a staff member will inform them that I will adhere to there request as soon as I have restored the show and return downstairs. However, no one has ever come out and ask for a refund. Doesn't that say something? And remember that the number of breakdowns at my theatre have been so few to begin with... less then one per year is not a bad record in my book.

Because of this post I decided tonight to query both my staff and patrons. Before the show I ask each of my staff members this question. If you were attending a film showing and an interruption of the presentation occurred lasting no more then several minutes, would you want a refund, or to have the restored presentation completed? While people came into the show I stopped patrons and ask them the same question. The answer was 100% wanted the show completed. I also asked several if they would hold the interruption against the theatre when deciding where they would go to the movies in the future. I only ask this question of three people, but all said something to the effect that they wouldn't if the show was quickly restored and they got to see the rest of it without any problems.

You say that you feel very strongly about customer satisfaction and I believe you, well so do I. That is why I put so much emphasis on preventing problems from occurring in the first place, and therefore the reason why I have had so few interruptions to my shows over the past thirty one years. I wish I could prevent all of them, but I can't, but that doesn't prevent me from trying. You said that you were getting the impression that I'm not concerned about customer satisfaction. What on earth did I say to give that impression? I don't think that I could have taken an old downtown, single screen, smalltown theatre and made it a success all these years if I didn't put customer satisfaction at the top of the list. Presentation is VERY important, but it alone is not showmanship. Showmanship covers every aspect of theatre management. I have been successful, and continue to be so even with all the competition from many mega-plexes not just because I'm a good projectionist, but because I work hard at being a good SHOWMAN.

"If you were attending a film showing and an interruption of the presentation occurred lasting no more then several minutes, would you want a refund, or to have the restored presentation completed? While people came into the show I stopped patrons and ask them the same question. The answer was 100% wanted the show completed."

Now that you've read your own words, what does that imply? That implies one or the other. Watch the rest of the show OR get a refund. NEVER did I say that if something went wrong that the show should not at least TRY to be completed. However this is THE point I am trying to make. When something does go wrong, it is not a matter of "you can have one or the other", but that is the way I perceived your post. Refunds or not, passes or not, the show should be completed if at all possible in addition to whatever passes/refunds/concession coupons are given.

I also don't believe I specifically said that people's money should be forced back at them, but there should ABSOLUTELY be an offer of something for the disruption. Even if you are running a single screen that may or may not be struggling financially, if you are only having one breakdown a year, you can definitely afford to take care of those customers by being at the exit with a roll of passes saying something like "our apologies for the interruption in your feature - please accept this pass and come see us again." Sure some people refuse and say it's not necessary, other people would have been just fine without it, but there are people who won't think quite as highly of your establishment if you simply wait for someone to complain. MANY people believe it or not are too embarassed to complain when something is wrong that makes them unhappy with something they spent their money on. I know several people personally who if their soda tastes bad, or the popcorn tastes bad, or the picture is blurry simply will not say anything...but will not return. All I am trying to say is that something should be offered, and for those theaters/managers that don't, shame on you.

Now is THAT explanation of my opinion clear yet, or shall I try again?

Now THAT sounds like the good ole American way. Seems like a lot of us here, Brad, Richard C.W., me, all see the audience as an extension of ourselves and our policies are based on how we would expect to be treated. But in reality, the megachains don't work this way. I have NEVER seen a policy of refunds, passes or free concessions for technical problems in any megaplex I've ever gone to as a paying customer. In fact, when I was working in Texas, my very first commercial job, the owner of a small chain once had a bull session with a few of his staff and I recall his policy: "NEVER EVER give any money back. Once you've got it in the box office, you hold on to it -- that's commmandments one thru ten of the theatre business." He conceded that for customer satisfaction for whatever reason, you can give passes, you can give bags of popcorn or refillable soda, but NEVER give back money. I think that would be the policy of the big chains if you pressed them for a policy. They certainly don't post a stated policy anywhere in the lobby BEFORE you purchase your ticket.

In fact, I would like to see a law in advertising passed saying that the theatre must post information regarding things like the sound format -- theatres that still run analog mono tracks should be forced to make that very clear at the box office. If they are projecting a scope image at 2:1, that should be posted. It should be like the information that food processors have to put on food packaging. I would have it that there would be two columns -- on showing what format the film was released in -- Digital, Stereo with surround/6 tracks, for example. The other column would be what the theatre was actually playing it back in: Analogue, mono with no surround, 1 track. And for the image: Image ratio: 2.4:1 -- This theatre's screen ratio 2.0:1. Why shouldn't patrons know BEFORE they walkinto a theatre what kind of presentation they are going to experience. It would be one thing if the mono theatre charged $4 to see LORD OF THE RINGS, but it doesn't it charges the same $9.50 as the 6 track digital screen. Seems like when theatres charge the same price no matter what technology they've got in the booth, they should be forced to disclose that consumer information before the customer plunks down his $$. But true to the American way, should such a truth-in-advertising law be proposed, you can be the chains would lobby to fight it to the death.

My policy is much like Brads, and Richards (who are really on the same head of this pin) is to make the customer happy. I find that free concessions sooths even the most savage of beasts -- it's immediate, it's free -- passes are weeks maybe months away and not nearly as immediately rewarding; yes they will take passes, but offer them free candy, popcorn or soda and you've won their hearts and minds. And let's face it, giving them passes is really making the studio eat the cost of the pass. Giving away popcorn is coming directly out of the theatre's bottom line.

I suppose I would give real money refunds if a show has to stop and can't be completed, but knock on wood, that's never happened to me. But then to be fair, I work at a non-profit -- my salary isn't dependent on the box office gross; I might think more on the lines of my first boss if my theatre was a poor indie that was eeking out a living amongst the giant godzilaplexes all around me. All I know is, if you treat people decently, they will come back; give them the impression that you are ripping them off and you've lost them, many times for good.
 

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- dave
Look at this! His chin strap has been cut!

This seems to be the standard policy announcement for theatre tickets since the early days of theatres. Every ticket that I have purchased since the late fifties has had that printed on the back. I also have boxes of old tickets that go back to the thirties with that on as well.

I find it hard to imagine that any theatre or chain wouldn't give refunds or at least passes for a show that couldn't be finished for one reason or another. But then again... after seeing how some of the chains run things, maybe I shouldn't be surprised.