This is topic Defective dts discs for "Dragonfly"? in forum Film Handlers' Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.
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Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 02-21-2002, 02:40 AM:
I was screening a print of Dragonfly in dts tonight and at the end of reel 4 is a scene with heavy use of music and sound. While the movie is mostly a "talkie", confined mainly to the center channel, this scene stood out horribly because there was no screen right channel playing. All of the music appeared to be coming from the left screen channel.So perhaps an amp died. Maybe someone was screwing with the system and has it horribly off balance. Wait, no the trailers sounded fine. Hmmmmm. Right about that time (the music still being loud) the reel change went through into reel 5 and right on the very first frame of the incoming reel WHAM, the right channel came on right at the level it should be. Coincidence? A problem with the sound system? I think not.
Will others check for this as they screen their prints of Dragonfly? I have a sneaky suspicion that this was an overlooked "oops" with the dts track. I'm betting the SRD and SDDS tracks are ok, but would like to know what everyone finds as they screen their prints. It doesn't take a sound expert to know exactly what I am referring to. Just watch the scene in the airplane at the end of reel 4 and watch it into the start of reel 5.
Karen, can you investigate this for a disc re-issue?
Posted by Keith Peticolas (Member # 971) on 02-21-2002, 03:48 AM:
Brad, previewed that last evening and my print sounded okay. Ran DTS and had no problems. Had 5 or 6 folks watching it with no complaints.
Not to rub it in, but finally a problem that didn't hit me. Hope you get yours fixed soonest.
kp
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 02-21-2002, 04:04 AM:
Were these your typical staff personnel who wouldn't notice a problem if you ran the whole movie through the wrong lens, or was there at least someone in the audience who you feel would've noticed? I have a feeling a lot of people wouldn't notice this since it did not affect the dialogue.
Posted by Keith Peticolas (Member # 971) on 02-21-2002, 04:41 AM:
Actually my staff rocks. I take care to train them in a professional manner and they pay attention to detail like you wouldn't believe. And my guests included a couple of broadcast engineers. They would have noticed.
Posted by Karen Hultgren (Member # 395) on 02-21-2002, 11:56 AM:
Hi Brad,Thanks for letting me know. We'll check it today.
Karen at DTS
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 02-21-2002, 03:21 PM:
Karen is there just one "master" cdrom that is responsible for printing all dts discs, or is it like having multiple internegatives where it is possible the "internegative/cdrom" that mine was printed from could've been defective?If you find the discs are fine, would you please send me another set and I will ship you this one back for evaluation. You can ship to the address in the "contact us" section.
Posted by Karen Hultgren (Member # 395) on 02-21-2002, 07:10 PM:
Brad,We are still checking the discs. We only make one master disc and all copies are made from that.
Karen at DTS
Posted by Steve Kraus (Member # 476) on 02-21-2002, 07:31 PM:
Brad, why not play that reel off the disks again, sans film, when you get a chance?
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 02-21-2002, 07:41 PM:
I don't think I will have a chance to for a few days, but I plan on it if Karen doesn't turn up with a problem in the disc manufacturing. I suppose it could've been a fluke, but right exactly as the splice went through on the reel change???
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 02-21-2002, 11:20 PM:
UPDATE: I was able to arrange things this evening to run that print in a different auditorium. Reel 4 in dts not only does not have a right screen channel, but there is no right surround audio either! (The auditorium I screened the movie in yesterday was set up by an engineer who does not believe in surrounds and intentionally sets them very low, hence the reason I did not notice the lack of a RS channel during the reel. He also likes to crank the center channel for some reason. To hell with THX standards, right?) Anyway, the only thing that plays on reel 4 is left, center, left surround and subwoofer. I sat right beside the sound rack and monitored this through the booth monitor as well as watching the levels on the CP500.So the big question now is, what about the SRD and SDDS tracks? Can someone please confirm if the right and right surround tracks are dead through reel 4 in either one of these formats? If so, then it looks to be a fault in the original master. If not, then it appears to be a dts problem.
(Keith, watch tomorrow as your print runs through. Since Karen has confirmed there is only one master dts disc made, it seems the broadcast engineers that attended your screening don't have as good of hearing as you might think. It's actually pretty obvious and not something I am being nitpicky about. Go listen for yourself tomorrow.)
Posted by John Hawkinson (Member # 1135) on 02-22-2002, 12:46 AM:
So, Brad, how does it sound in analog?--jhawk
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 02-22-2002, 03:23 AM:
I have no idea how the SR track sounds, but I would assume it would be ok.Further update: I have received confirmation from Jeremy Spracklen (that guy who never posts but should) that the SRD track on reel 4 does indeed have all channels.
I will have SDDS confirmation info posted tomorrow.
Posted by Steve Kraus (Member # 476) on 02-22-2002, 12:24 PM:
I can confirm this as well. I'm running R4 monitoring only R and RS and not a peep out of them. SR-D seem fine as is SR. Unusual for me to be screening a film that's in release other than for Academy or DGA yet that's exactly what I'll be doing this afternoon for a VIP. Given disks I'll usually run in DTS but thanks to Brad I'll stick to SR-D today!
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 02-22-2002, 02:20 PM:
Further update: Our good friend Darren Crimmins has verified all tracks play properly on the SDDS version.
Posted by Keith Peticolas (Member # 971) on 02-22-2002, 05:37 PM:
Gee, now we're insulting my friends, nice. I've run "Dragonfly" 3 times now, everytime in DTS. Mine sound fine. Not going to worry about it anymore.
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 02-22-2002, 08:10 PM:
I'm not trying to pick on your friends, but you posted that your discs were fine as *a fact* based upon staff and professional broadcast engineer friends of yours that quite simply did not hear the problem, because Karen has already confirmed that if one set of discs is missing two channels that ALL discs will be missing two channels. Sorry about that, but the situation is pretty cut and dry. There IS a problem whether your friends and/or customers noticed it or not. I'm actually surprised you aren't more concerned about it, as this is affecting the quality of your presentation.Now we must all wait for Karen to come tell us when new discs will be shipped out.
Posted by Darryl Spicer (Member # 711) on 02-22-2002, 11:06 PM:
Yes Brad, it is definetly a bad DTS master. Have the same problem on ours. No audio in those two channels for the entire reel #4. I hope they reprint and send out new disks soon.
Posted by Dustin Mitchell (Member # 372) on 02-22-2002, 11:21 PM:
Recieved a Fax from Universal today:"Projectionist please note
'Dragonfly'
Due to technical difficulties, do NOT play with DTS until further notice.
Mark Link
VP Print Control
Universal Studios"
Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 02-23-2002, 12:37 AM:
Hmmm Brad, perhaps your post wasn't so insulting after all! 
Now my friend Mark G. has no digital format to choose from since it is either the prints (for the sound-on-film guys) and now discs (for the disc guys) that can be an issue.
Steve
------------------
"Old projectionists never die, they just changeover!"
Posted by Steve Kraus (Member # 476) on 02-23-2002, 03:35 PM:
This could have been cleared up before the first evening shows if the R4 file had been made available online for folks to download and burn a new disk getting the rest of the files from the old one. The file is on the B disk as you might expect on a 2-disk, 6-reel movie.
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 02-24-2002, 12:02 AM:
...and the offer continues to stand. 
Posted by Paul G. Thompson (Member # 655) on 02-24-2002, 01:09 AM:
We received an official notice (I saw the notice tonight) not to use the discs.
Posted by Sean McKinnon (Member # 612) on 02-24-2002, 03:42 AM:
I was hoping Steve would post an apology to brad...
Posted by Sean McKinnon (Member # 612) on 02-24-2002, 03:52 AM:
I apologize I meant to say kieth I do not know where "Steve" came from. (My previous post has not shown up on my browser yet for me to edit it)
Posted by John Wilson (Member # 269) on 02-25-2002, 04:52 AM:
Now you have to apologize to 'Steve'. ------------------
"It's not the years honey, it's the mileage". - Indiana Jones.
Posted by Karen Hultgren (Member # 395) on 02-25-2002, 11:46 AM:
Thanks to Brad for the alert!Yes, there was a problem with DRAGONFLY and new discs were made and shipped. Theaters that are playing the film should soon be seeing new discs arrive. The studio is handling the distribution. So, if you do not get them by Wednesday, please let me know.
Karen at DTS