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Posted by Paul Konen (Member # 41) on 07-11-2002, 09:22 AM:
Brad's Post about Road to Perdition brings up a question that I have been struggling with.I ask my staff to screen in analog sound. The reason is because that soundtrack is the last option available sometimes and if it is bad, I would like to know right away so that the reel can be replaced rather quickly.
We will play it in digital for the regular run, but want to be sure that the analog track is good.
Usually it seems that as a print get older, it becomes harder to get a replacement reel in a timely manner, and possibly having to purchase the replacement because the defect wasn't discovered right away.
What are your thoughts?
Paul
Posted by William T. Parr (Member # 677) on 07-11-2002, 09:46 AM:
Hey Paul,
I have my staff screen the movie inthe auditorium it is opening in and in the sound format it is opening in. I do this for the same reason you have your staff screen in analog, so if there are dificincies in the soundtrack or bad picture problems we can move the print to another auditorium before the customers see or hear it.
Posted by Leo Enticknap (Member # 534) on 07-11-2002, 09:58 AM:
Check all the sound formats you might have to use.I once had a showprint of The Land Girls in which the SR-D was in sync, but the analogue sound on one reel was about three seconds out. I didn't know this until the show was switched from a digital auditorium to one that had SR only at the last minute... and one reel played out of sync as a result.
A colleague once showed a print of Amistad in which the SR-D track was fine, but the SR on one reel was dubbed into German. He rehearsed the print in SR because it was going into an SR-only house, but imagine what the result would have been if the print were checked in digital only and, with a full house of customers in, the SR-D failed and the dialogue suddenly went into German!
I'd suggest switching through all the formats your theatre can play at least once during each reel to check that there's a soundtrack, that it's the right soundtrack and that it's in sync.
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 07-11-2002, 01:27 PM:
And this brings up the most important point of all, the need to NOT mix and match digital players within one complex. Let's say there is an all DTS complex. During the screening it will be found if the print is playable in DTS and that will never bite them in the rear down the road. The same thing goes for a complex that has all SRD or SDDS. A well designed complex in my opinion has always been to have one (whichever, it doesn't matter) format in every auditorium, coupled with the a rollaround unit or two of the other formats for backup.
By the way, I do disagree about screening in analog. The customers do not want to hear analog. They want digital. Because of this, it is far more important to ensure that the digital tracks are good. Since Paul's theater is half equipped with SRD and the other half equipped with DTS, if I were running that complex I would move ALL print building tables over to the SRD booth and make it mandatory that all prints be screened in SRD. Finding a reel with a defective dts track is very, very rare so it only makes sense to check the SRD track. In fact, it has always been routine for me to run the screening WITHOUT analog backup. That makes any defect VERY obvious to whoever is screening the print. If the SRD track plays properly on the pre-screening, then the track will always play back properly, provided the films are taken care of.
Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 07-11-2002, 03:28 PM:
I'd run it in whatever format the feature is supposed to play in for its first public show, preferably in the same house where it will play on opening day. This is a good time to catch flaky digital tracks and/or misaligned readers before subjecting the movingoing public to digital dropout hell. Also, it's pretty easy to tell if there is anything horribly wrong with the optical track when inspecting a print on the bench, but it is usually impossible to identify digital tracks that will refuse to play without actually playing them.When films aren't pre-screened by theatre staff, it's always good to check the sound for the first show, preferably right around every reel change, in attempt to ensure that the track is good and the digital track (if present) isn't faulting. In single-screen houses, I always leave the booth monitor on (at least at a low level) as a way to check for sound problems.
Having said this, I don't normally pre-screen prints unless either a) I'm personally interested in the movie or b) other theatre employees want to watch it (in which case, if I'm not personally interested, I start the film for them and go home). I tend to think that the value of a pre-screening is overrated, especially for once-only shows. It's also sometimes impossible when prints arrive at the last minute on Friday morning.
I agree with Brad about the benefits of having the same digital format available on as many screens as possible at a multiplex. If I were equipping a multiplex, I'd probably put in all SRD and maybe have a few DTS units available as well.
Posted by Jason Black (Member # 684) on 07-11-2002, 04:17 PM:
Brad,
At the risk of soudning very stupid, how do you screen in SR-D without teh analog backup? I can't readily think of a method of doing this with our Christie packages and CP500's.
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 07-11-2002, 05:08 PM:
I always make it a point whenever possible to set up the analog led on it's own kill switch for precisely this purpose. However on a generic installation, you will probably need to have your tech come in and add a switch.Do you have basement readers or a penthouse reader?
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 07-11-2002, 07:33 PM:
Just put piece of artists tape over the analog reader camera. And fasten it so that it will NOT come off and rub against the film and also so it is NOT touching the lens (even though artists tape does not leave residue, better to keep it off of the glass anyway). But turning off the LED is by far a better method. Also be bareful not to mess up the A-Chain settings of the lens when applying and removing the tape. You don't wanna rotate the lens or accidentally adjust the azimuth trying to get that tape on there perfectly (some readers are incredibly fickle)! If all else fails just break off the analog reader camera from the projector. 
Posted by Steve Kraus (Member # 476) on 07-11-2002, 11:52 PM:
I can't speak as to the other processors but on the CP500D if there is no motor run signal present (see the discussion in the other thread about motor start relays for digital C/O booths) then digital will not drop to analog. If there's a problem you get to hear weird buzzes and ticks or simply silence. I have alternate motor switches that don't activate the motor run relays which can serve to force it to stay in digital. For single projector platter operation you probably have a plug on that connector with a single jumper that is telling the CP that motor #1 is always running. Cutting that and putting a switch on the soundrack somewhere may be a more elegant solution than a switch on the LED P/S or taping the LED itself.
Posted by Stephen Furley (Member # 1277) on 07-12-2002, 10:58 AM:
"Having said this, I don't normally pre-screen prints unless either a) I'm personally interested in the movie or b) other theatre employees want to watch it (in which case, if I'm not personally interested, I start the film for them and go home). I tend to think that the value of a pre-screening is overrated, especially for once-only shows. It's also sometimes impossible when prints arrive at the last minute on Friday morning."You mean you get you prints sent to you in advance? You don't just get handed the print by a visiting guest, who brings the print with them, and it has to be on screen in about five minutes, as soon as they have made a short introductory speech to the audience. Quite often when this happens, there's not even time to check the cues on the first reel, you just have to hope for the best. Sometimes there's not even time to get the first part onto a spool, so you have to run it from a split. I don't like running any film without inspecting it first, and I don't like running from a two inch core, but sometimes, in this situation, you have to do it with the first reel.
Posted by Antonio Marcheselli (Member # 373) on 01-01-2004, 06:21 PM:
I have now the same problem, since I have all 11 DD screens with just one DTS player. I agree with Brad that it is unusual to found a defective DTS track.
I have a suggestion to know if the track is defective without babysitting the entire feature: program a format button on you CP with a Format 11 (User 1 or 2 on CP650 or any SK on CP500). When DTS kicks in, it selects SK5 on CP500 and Format 11 (SK5!) on CP650. Change immediately to the other button you configured for Format 11. At the end of the feature check the CP. If the button selected is the same as you leave the DTS didn't drop to analog/dd otherwise it reverted during your absence!
What do you think?
My main disappointment screening the copy using DD when you know that DTS will be used is for the fader setting. Perhaps, despite the systems are well calibrated, DTS may require a little correction in fader (0.2, 0.3?) perhaps not...
Bye
A
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 01-01-2004, 06:51 PM:
Do you have SRD on every screen, but one of them also has a dts???
Posted by Antonio Marcheselli (Member # 373) on 01-01-2004, 06:58 PM:
Yes, It is a movable unit, I will configure three or five screen for it.
Why?
Bye
A
Posted by Jack Ondracek (Member # 1466) on 01-01-2004, 07:22 PM:
I think Brad has the right idea, even though my place doesn't totally agree with his viewpoint. It does make sense that, if you take the time to screen your print in one auditorium, that print should be playable in all the others, IF you have the same format in all screens.
My initial thought, when the equipment became available at my place, was that if I got a print without DTS, I could still play it in digital on at least one screen, if other factors allowed (remembering the "who choosed the auditorium" discussion). But I think Brad's comments make sense. At least I'm 75% compliant! ![[Big Grin]](biggrin.gif)
As for screening in analog; I never do it intentionally. Since I don't always have DTS audio on certain trailers, my analog side gets a certain amount of default usage (I also check it regularly). But... I have a substantial investment in the digital part of my racks, so I do my screenings in the format that's going to be used on the bulk of my presentations.
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 01-01-2004, 08:05 PM:
If you have SRD in every auditorium, there is no need whatsoever to screw with the dts unit. You are only asking for problems switching between formats. Be happy that you have a common digital format on every screen. It doesn't really matter what format it is, just so that ALL screens are the same.
At this point your dts unit is a backup. Leave it turned off and only use it if you get a print with a bad reel that won't play in SRD.
Posted by Antonio Marcheselli (Member # 373) on 01-01-2004, 08:21 PM:
Brad,
I completely disagree with you!!! How can consider a dts unit a "backup"? It is a "plus" of our biggest houses, the customers will be happy to see the movie with better quality! All of our houses are biamped using DCA amps, our biggest house uses a lot of power and we have three way speakers in all screens. I believe that a difference between the format can be heard, eventually it is just a "marketing" strategy where customer identify the great sound of our theater (with all respects few... none of city little theater can handle our, my presentation!) as DTS sound.
I would also consider my, and my staff, personal satisfaction running another piece of technology!!!
My questions about sound format are made since I'm still cabling the unit and I want to compare my ideas with others, no problem at all running dts movies!
I sincerely do not understand your suggestion! So at my old one-screen theatre eqipped with a JP dts plus DD I should have run all feature in DD and use dts as backup?
Bye
A
Posted by Jack Ondracek (Member # 1466) on 01-01-2004, 09:01 PM:
Here again, is a no-win discussion. There are people here who insist that a properly tuned rack/auditorium combo will be transparent to whatever digital process is used. Others insist they can tell the difference. I happen to be in the first group. My preference of one system over another (and it's a very small preference at that) has nothing to do with subjective quality, and more to do with practical operation. In any case, minds will not be changed as regards this subject, so it's best left to the individual to decide what's best.
Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 01-01-2004, 11:18 PM:
I have say that it's best to screen in analog.
Even if you have digital sound in all of your houses you can never tell when you may need to fall back to analog. You need to know that your print will be minimally playable in the unlikely event the digital sound fails.
Most of the theaters I worked in didn't have digital sound in all houses. If the print is screened in digital only you could put yourself in the situation where the print runs great for the first two weeks of its engagement but, then, it gets moved to a house and the sound goes bad. If you had known (or should have known) that the analog track is bad you would have replaced the offending reel(s). Now you will have to explain to everybody what went wrong.
If your digital sound stops working for some reason you can still let it run in analog while you figure out what went wrong. If your analog sound is bad you have nothing to save you. Prints are supposed to be screened to be sure that they'll run without problems. If a reel needs to be replaced, you're going to need to know it before it gets put into a house where there is no fallback.
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 01-02-2004, 12:53 AM:
Antonio, read Jack's post carefully, then bear in mind my firm stance that anyone who claims there is a noticeable difference in quality is hearing things, or is brainwashed into believing it.
SCENARIO 1:
8 plex with 8 SRD and 1 DTS = run everything in SRD and use the DTS as a backup format. (Screen prints in SRD as well)
SCENARIO 2:
8 plex with 8 DTS and 1 SRD - run everything in DTS and use the SRD as a backup format. (Screen prints in DTS as well)
I don't know how to make it any more clear to you. Don't mix and match formats.
Posted by Antonio Marcheselli (Member # 373) on 01-02-2004, 06:56 AM:
Brad,
You don't have to make it more clear, I fully understand your point of view perfectly. But I do not agree with it!
I understand and I agree that the differences between DTS and DD are minimal and that people has to be brainwashed to say "yeah, this feature is in DTS and sounds BETTER!".
But I believe that is part of our job! Place the sound plaque outside of the theater, place the dts trailer and let the people think that the sound is so good because "there is DTS playing". When the same customer will come to another theater without DTS and hear a crappy sound he/she will say "here is worst because they don't have dts".
Beside this marketing stuff the feature in DTS will sound better than DD (for few people)! And I believe that my (and my staff) work load will not increase so much.
I fully agree instead with your practical and logistic consideration! Left the dts unit as a backup system will be easier and solve a lot of problems. But it is not accepted in my idea of "make film right"! However this doesn't mean that me and you must have the same ideas on how to use the equipments!
Randy,
Since 8 months of opening I showed 2 SR movie because, for my fault, the digital sountrack was damaged. I ask for replacement reel for bad DD sountrack at least 20 times.
I will show it in DD! ![[Smile]](smile.gif)
Agree with Brad that DTS is so reliable (when reader and player in good condition) that it doesn't need screening.
Bye
A
Posted by John Hawkinson (Member # 1135) on 01-02-2004, 09:23 AM:
The ideal thing would be to run in all formats, and let the digital formats do their own QC. Unfortunately this is not realistic for most people, I think.
For instance, DTS keeps track of the number of faults it encounters, and can output that information via VGA (at least on the 6D) or RS-232 (mumble TTL conversion). I can't speak to Dolby Digital or SDDS, but I'm sure they collect that information. Getting it out is the problem.
If it was easy to do that, then you could let human ears listen to the analog, and let the digital boxes evaluate the digital.
(Another problem here is that most theatres aren't set up to let the digital decoders run live while still playing the analog audio...).
Wishful thinking... ![[Frown]](frown.gif)
--jhawk
Posted by Elena N. Solovyova (Member # 1636) on 01-02-2004, 01:04 PM:
Brad, our 2-plex is equipped with movable DTS rack for one good reason: when receiving some mega-blockbuster from Gemini (our major distributor) with an obligation to, say, 150 runs in first three weeks, we always request for DTS disks because we know that SR-D will be dropping 2-3 times per reel after first 100 showings. Unfortunately, Gemini uses an older mega-high-volume printing facility at Mosfilm, and SR-D track wears out too quckly, no matter how good our handling is (this is a well-known issue with their prints). Scrapping a pristine-looking print because of faulty SR-D track print is a supposed solution, but we can save some money thanks to DTS.
Posted by Aaron Garman (Member # 1653) on 01-02-2004, 01:33 PM:
I say screen in the format your customer is going to be seeing the film in. I understand why some would screen in analogue, but if your audience is there to see Return of the King in DTS, you should make sure that DTS is pristine. If you find something wrong with the DTS, then use analogue. For the most part, I have never seen an SR track that was so faulty it could not be played. It's the digital systems that always tend to be more prone to problems.
I do agree with you Brad that mixing and matching stinks. For awhile, we had 8 DTS, 2 SRD, 1 SDDS, and 3 analogue. It stunk because say a film works great in SRD and then two weeks later it has DTS dropouts that we didn't know about. Also, say you build a film with a DTS trailer and they move the print to an SRD house for whatever reason. I'd like to have DTS on all screens (just because in my experience it sounds better and plays more reliably) and have a few SRD houses for backup or those independent films with SRD only. Sure, mixing and matching had to been done way back when studios supported only one format but now, we don't have to do that. Poor AMC...all that SDDS and it's dying out. I'm just thankfull our sole SDDS house got replaced with SRD (yet the tech did not reset speaker levels or do an EQ and left a nice hum going through the system). Ahh, isn't life grand?!
AJG
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 01-02-2004, 02:30 PM:
Antonio, you amaze me.
First off you want to brainwash people into thinking that the reason why your sound is better is because you have dts. That's stupid! You should be teaching people that the reason is because you have better speakers, acoustics and proper calibration. With your current scheme, once another theater installs dts your whole plan doesn't hold water. Plus all of your customers that you foolishly brainwash into thinking dts is better sound will feel jipped when the movie they want to see is in one of your non-dts auditoriums.
Then you think your staff's workload will decrease because you have that ONE screen to have to deal with loading discs and moving the system around. Are you nuts? Do you really not see how dts adds to the projectionist's workload?
And no, I do not agree that "dts is so reliable that it doesn't need screening". WAY too many times I have received defective discs and faulty timecode tracks in the last year and in fact I can firmly report that I have had roughly twice the amount of problems with playing in dts that I have had with SRD. This did not used to be the case, but it certainly is now. My point was that if you have all SRD in a complex and the print plays through fine in SRD, you are set for the whole complex and there is no need to mess with another format (whether it is dts or sdds or whatever). A smart projectionist would save the "different/backup" system for a print that doesn't play in the "primary" (in your case SRD) sound format.
Elena, buy yourself a bottle of FilmGuard as a demo for yourself and use it on one designated print that you know you will be playing for a long time. Your SRD tracks will not wear. In fact, they will improve. This has been proven many, many times.
Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 01-02-2004, 07:08 PM:
Ah Brad, Actually DTS does sound much better, especially on the high end. There is also NO acoustical masking used in DTS...a very poor artifact of SRD that does not occur in any DTS playback. Weather Antonio has good or bad speakers and good or bad system calibration is a whole other matter...and I assume from reading his past postings that he has pretty good stuff over there. Inspite of DTS's other obvious problems which in reality are no more of a problem than any of the other systems inherent problems I'll take DTS playback any day over any of the other digital systems.
As for Elena's SRD problem, I also have to first wonder if the projection equipment she is using has some part of it that is unduly hard on the SRD track...such as some Cinemecaniccas are hard on Sonys tracks. FilmGuard may help out some but using it is no certainly guarantee of good life of print SRD playback.
Mark
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 01-02-2004, 07:25 PM:
Mark, wouldn't you agree that the Christie projectors are about the roughest machine around on SRD and SDDS tracks? Assuming you agree with that, then yes it is a guaranteed thing because I have ran prints through them for well over 1000 runs without a single dropout when using FilmGuard.
When in the Dallas area, I challenge you to a listening test. If you can actually pick which of the 3 formats you are listening to properly, you will be the first person ever to do it.
Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 01-02-2004, 07:32 PM:
Actualy DTS sound better in sideby side test
Idid send a print an interlock between 3 identical screens and a test group walked between all three and the DTS was the prefered one
Elena if you meopta projectors they may have issues with film guard on prints staying stable because of the design of the gate bands
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 01-02-2004, 07:34 PM:
That's not a fair test Gordon. Even if you designed a complex with 10 screens all exactly identical in every way right down to the color of the carpet, each room would sound different. You must A/B/C between the formats live throughout the reel where all 3 sources are precisely level matched and all run through the exact same signal chain to be fair.
I challenge you to the same test next time you are in these parts. Maybe Joe will come down for it and we will roll 2 cameras simultaneously (one in the booth on the sound rack showing the switching and one in the auditorium on your reactions) and offer the results to the world. ![[Wink]](wink.gif)
Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 01-02-2004, 07:53 PM:
Brad been there and done that
DTS has always been the hands down winner
The only one sounded better was the original mags which we also ran on a dubber
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 01-02-2004, 08:07 PM:
Ok Gordon fine, but your example above was NOT a fair test.
Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 01-02-2004, 08:10 PM:
Brad,
Before any serious comparison is attempted you would need to install a good three way system....5671 or 5672, or similar. Even with the better two way systems the differences heard will be very minimal. This is another good reason that neither of the Digital systems will gain you anything over the other in an average every day situation.
I've already had the opportunity to do a comparison using a CSP-1200 processor driving JBL 5672's. With very high end speakers like these the differences between DTS and SRD become VERY obvious. Even though the Sony system sounds great I left Sony out of this test for various reasons.
Remember, I used to be a very big proponent of SRD in past years...till I did the comparison above.
I'd have to know more about Elenas projectors....possibly Meoptas , possibly something else Russian made, as they could very well be chewing up that area well beyond what even Filmguard could take care of. Another issue that is also somewhat possible is that the release film produced over there may have an emulsion that does not harden like the Kodak release stocks emulsion does, although many other countries also use Kodak stock I'd like to hear from her what they are actually using. In this case I would send her a few of the famous sample kits or a complimentary quart of Filmguard to see if it helps her out.
Mark
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 01-02-2004, 08:42 PM:
But Mark...Gordon seems to think that the difference is the "hands down winner" and that was quite possibly a demo being played back on a SMART system with Altec speakers. ![[Razz]](tongue.gif)
Seriously, I understand your point, but VERY FEW theaters have that caliber of a sound system. Even at that, I'm betting VERY FEW people could hear a noticeable difference even on an A/B comparison, and no public showing would ever A/B the sources anyway. The 4675 is pretty much the standard in the industry. Using that for reference is plenty fine. Comparing sound between two physically different auditoriums is foolish.
Regardless, this whole argument is ridiculous.
Posted by Richard Hamilton (Member # 321) on 01-02-2004, 09:03 PM:
How do you measure sound "quality"? Mark says this sounds good.....Gord says this sounds better.....I say my favorite is the best,,
My analyzer is better calibrated!!!!!
Rick
Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 01-02-2004, 09:14 PM:
Actually it was all 4675c with jbl surrounds biamped with USA serries amplifiers
The three rooms were equal room volume and identicale dimension seating and layout
The SDDS was with a DFP3000 the SRD was a CP500 and the DTS was a DTS 6D into a Eprad DSS
The crossovers were all UltraStereo's
The meoptas are usually fairly gentle on SRD tracks but many have teflon gate bands and any lubricant will cause a image steadiness issue just like th DP75 exhibits
Posted by Antonio Marcheselli (Member # 373) on 01-02-2004, 09:18 PM:
Brad,
You amazed me too!!
First, let's assume that I will use my DTS player because DTS sounds better and I will make all efforts to have the best presentation in my multiplex. That's a fact.
I agree with Mark. More, we don't have analog only screens or screens with DD and three stereo amps. As I told all of our screen are bi-amped with DCA and three way speakers. The smallest screen is 37.7 feet wide and biggest 68.8. I believe that a DTS player will make some difference.
Let's come to the customers. Our multiplex have, in my opinion, the best sound and the best sound systems in the town. The customers recognize it. How can I advertise our quality for that ones that does not know us?
The average customers does not know much in projection, they all know that DVDs are used or that there is a bear-projectionist that continuously run a crank on a projector.
Dolby Digital and DTS are coming to average people attention since the growing of dvds. All the special edition of DVDs has DTS and DTS ES. I think that the average customer will think that DTS sounds better. Why? He/she don't know.
So advertise DTS and DTS_ES is a winning strategy, in my opinion. The customer will understand that the sound is faaar superior, and the quality of the projection is the best. But he/she (also) will link this result to the sound logo that plays before the movie.
It's not brainwashing, it is having the best presentation possibile AND let the people think that that amazing sound on Master and COmmander was (partially) due to the DTS player.
When the same customer will go to the next multiplex (that does nto have DTS! And this is true, not an hypotesis) and hear the crappy sound and the crappy presentation he/she will, partially, think that the sound is not as our because he/she hear not DTS sound.
When the same customer will come to our multiplex and realize that the almost same sound quality can be heard in every screen, with every sound format used, he will understand that DTS is not the key of that result.
How would you teach to your thousand of customers that your presentation is due to calibration and speakers?
However, I'm planning special presentation that explain, in few seconds, the technical specs of the projection.
Let's come to the DTS complexity.
I can't see this increased workload using a dts player. I could agree with you if suddenly my boss send me 3 SDDS and 7 DTS... But is is just one DTS player. I will make immediately a mobile device to move the player easier and I'll make all the connections between dolby/projector and sound rack as I saw in one photo here on film tech where the tech install three plug on the rack (timecode-automation-sound) to avoid to have half a rack disassebled each time you have to move your dts player.
When this will be completed and all will be scheduled and all projectionist trained, move a DTS player to another screen will be a very easy operation.
However, I agree that use a DTS player will increase the job load a bit. But I'm a projectionist, I believe that it is part of my job. Changing the sound trailer is not a pain for all of my team. I use Waterfall trailer for EX movie showing in EX screens. When the movie is moved to a non EX house the trailer is changed within 1 or 2 shows. Without any added work load!
About DTS reliability, you told in this post:
[QUOTE] Finding a reel with a defective dts track is very, very rare so it only makes sense to check the SRD track /QUOTE]
And I agree with you!
However with the little trick I explained before I think you will have no problems with DTS.
Bye!
Antonio
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 01-02-2004, 09:19 PM:
Gordon, that's a terrible way to compare "digital sound formats" in my opinion. If that's the kind of demo that floats your boat, so be it.
Oooooooh, a flaw with the mighty DP70???
Antonio, do you not pay attention? You don't do you?