Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Kinoton Dowser

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Posted by Ken Lackner (Member # 1002) on 07-19-2002, 10:58 AM:

On one of my projectors (Kinoton PK60D), the dowser won't open all the way. I can push it all the way open by hand, but then it springs back about a quarter of an inch. This doesn't block enough light to be noticeable to most people, but I can notice it, and so can one of my managers. Suggestions?

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 07-19-2002, 12:25 PM:

If your projectors were ordered for 220VAC, that is most likely your problem. All Kinoton projectors are based on 230VAC. USA 3-phase is typically 208 which is 10% under voltage! The 24 volt rail is unregulated so it may have been 24 volts (or even higher at one point) but by the time the douser opens...everything that can be running is and the douser gets the lowest voltage available. Depending on the complexity of machine and the actual incoming voltage in your area...it can dip down below 18 volts!

If this IS the problem, then a solution is buck/boost transformers on your input to the projector. A simple 24volt buck/boost will get you up to 232VAC nominal or less than 1% over. If you order the Kinoton as a 110VAC machine, the buck/boost is included. In short, always order Kinotons for 110VAC 60Hz for USA operation.

Now if it isn't a voltage thing, then the spring may be too tight. You can adjust the spring tension, the angle of spring pull and the plunger that keeps it from bouncing closed to yield a rather nicely controlled douser.

Steve

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"Old projectionists never die, they just changeover!"

Posted by Ken Lackner (Member # 1002) on 07-19-2002, 12:30 PM:

OK, I'm gonna have to go with the spring option, since none of the other projectors at my 16-plex do that. So, how exactly do you adjust it??

Posted by Larry Shaw (Member # 388) on 07-19-2002, 04:19 PM:

Steve,

Actually the PK 60D can't be ordered as a 220V or 110V machine, its BOTH!
The 60D's all have both 110V and a 230V input terminals, one just connects to the desired terminals. To accomplish this there is an autotransformer in each machine, and the taps can be changed to accept any of these voltages: 110, 125, 230, 240. In addition, all 60D's produced in the last year or so have (and all future ones will have)a regulated 24VDC supply so the potential for the low voltage/weak changeover scenario is eliminated.

Larry

------------------
Larry Shaw
Boston Light & Sound, Inc.
North American Distributor of Kinoton GmbH
290 North Beacon Street
Boston, MA 02135-1990
Tel: 617-787-3131 x104 Fax: 617-787-4257
E-Mail: larry@blsi.com
Web site: <A HREF="http://www.blsi.com/kinoton" TARGET=_blank>http://www.blsi.com/kinoton</a>

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 07-19-2002, 05:38 PM:

The up-side to the voltage regulator should also be prolonged framing lamp life. If one goes too far over the voltage and on a light load, like a PK-60, the 24 volt rail could be high...especially when the framing lamp is on...C/O is off, motor is off all of the relays are off....etc...this the framing lamp often get more than 24VDC and they didn't last too long.

Checking Kinoton PK-60D order list...last digit in the item number sets the voltage and frequency...
1= 220VAC 50Hz
2= 110VAC 60Hz
3= 220VAC 60Hz

However, even if an FP-30E is ordered as a 110VAC, the autoformer still lets one have it "their way." It is one of the nice flexibilities of the system.

This 24VAC regulator though is good news for sure.

As to the spring tension, it should be somewhat self expanitory...it is only attached in two places. With an allen wrench (think metric) you can change how far it is stretched. If the douser doesn't have too much bounce, then I would go for the fixed side.

Steve

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"Old projectionists never die, they just changeover!"

Posted by John Hawkinson (Member # 1135) on 07-19-2002, 06:47 PM:

Err, Larry, your voltage list still omits US 3-phase (208V hot-to-hot). I suppose most people just run them on 110V though.

--jhawk

Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 07-19-2002, 07:12 PM:

Most electrical codes don't technically permit a 208 single phase device

Posted by Larry Shaw (Member # 388) on 07-19-2002, 07:21 PM:

Steve,

Whichever you order, 1-2 or 3, you get the same thing. This is a quirk of the ordering dept. And yes, I know the order codes say 220 and the autoformer is 230. Again, the order dept just calls everything near 220 "220".

John,

For wye you are correct, but the 60D set on 230 will run OK on 208. The autoformer output goes to devices that have their own PS and regulator. Still, nearly all are connected to 120V in the US. And there are lots of older areas -like across the river here in Brighton- where our 3 phase is delta at 240, and we have a seprate single phase 110/220 service. (But I installed a 100 kVA zig-zag to derive wye for our testing needs).

BTW, I sent a message to engineering a while ago asking them to be on the lookout for autoformers with another tap around 208.

-Larry

Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 07-19-2002, 08:15 PM:

So long as nothing depends on the frequency...then 1,2, and 3 can be the same. Whereas I've always dealt with 60Hz...I've never bothered to investigate...now the lamphouse with an hour meter has an obvious 50 - 60Hz issue.

110 is the generic number used for that voltage range. As in, the sticker will say 110 at the input terminals.

The whole voltage thing isn't too much of an issue but it can be if one is significantly off on a non-regulated system...That is why 208 wasn't sufficient for 230 volts...particularly if your area doesn't quite make 208...like on one installation that was closer to 203.

Steve

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"Old projectionists never die, they just changeover!"

Posted by Richard Fowler (Member # 893) on 07-19-2002, 09:13 PM:

The invertor drive on the Kinoton should make it frequency independent. We shipped out recently a project to a client where we have done field measurements ( 190 to 197VAC for 208wye @ 59HZ ) so his package was modified to work with his power. Mario Faucher, a Dolby field consultant has a laptop program for checking electrical service for voltage sags / spikes, frequency problems which he troubleshoots electrical in studios and labs.
Richard Fowler
TVP-Theatre & Video Products Inc. www.tvpmiami.com

Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 07-19-2002, 10:17 PM:

What program is that

Posted by Larry Shaw (Member # 388) on 07-22-2002, 03:15 PM:

Steve,

Of course I was speaking about the PK-60D where frequency is no issue. The selection of correct voltage and frequency for some of our other products - such as your hour meter example - is important.

-Larry