This is topic Using a Macintosh iBook with Dolby Setup Software in forum Film Handlers' Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.


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Posted by Manny Knowles (Member # 1171) on 08-17-2002, 08:31 AM:
 
I am about to set up a couple of Dolby CP-650s and I'd like to use my iBook (Macintosh System X) running Virtual PC.

I am running Windows 98 SE on the PC side and I have also bought a USB-to-Serial cable.

The USB/Serial cable came with a floppy but Windows 98 SE doesn't seem to know what to do with it. (There are no .exe files anywhere on this disk.)

The software is supposed to make it so that my USB ports can be used as "Com" ports.

Has anybody done this already? Do I even need the software for that cable?

~Manny (just keeps going and going and going....)


 


Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 08-17-2002, 09:12 AM:
 
Load the software into the Mac.

Hook the adaptor up before you fire up VPC. Then go into the preferences panel and tell VPC to make the COM1 port be the adaptor. I use the Keyspan USB/serial adaptor. If you don't plug the adaptor in first, VPC won't recognize it.

I did this with DRAS, DSP-60, SDDS and Load500. They all work pretty well. DRAS would hiccup once in a while but that was with the OS 9 version of VPC. OS X may have fixed that. I never took the time to figure it out.

We need more Mac people to do this kind of thing. When I did it, I talked to Dolby Labs and USL. Niether of them had heard of anybody trying this. They all told me the same thing... "You're not SUPPOSED to be able to do that, are you?" I just said, "I'm doing it right now!" I think I heard the sound of a lot of head-scratching on the other end of the phone.

I asked them if they planned to make some Mac software for their equipment. They both told me they don't plan to do it right now but IF they got enough call for the Mac software they might consider having some made.
 


Posted by Michael Schaffer (Member # 1204) on 08-17-2002, 10:00 AM:
 
As described in the Windows ME discussion in the Film-Yak Forum, when aligning our systems,we ran the SDDS setup software on a Powerbook running Virtual PC under OS X. It worked very well but my pal said you needed a G4 to make it work. He has one of those new wicked Titaniumbooks or whatever they are called. Randy`s experience seems to contradict that, but then he used OS 9. Maybe OS X is more performance-hungry.
Randy, have you also tried running WinDRAS? I think the whole Virtual PC thing is rather impressive. My next computer may be a Macintosh even though I would really miss the right mouse button.
Michael


 


Posted by Bobby Henderson (Member # 840) on 08-17-2002, 10:38 AM:
 
Virtual PC is an emulation program. By and large any emulator mimicing the behaviors of a different CPU engine is going to use lots and lots of computing cycles. So, yeah, you have to use the most powerful hardware you can get to make performance tolerable.

One of the more clever emulators I saw, years ago, was the one Digital Equipment Corp. came up with for the DEC Alpha CPU version of WindowsNT. It would emulate Intel x86 actions, but then recompile the most used bits of code for native Alpha CPU use. Still, it didn't work as fast as having a natively coded Alpha version of the app. In which case, if demand keeps rising, Dolby needs a Mac OS X version of its CP interface software.

Mac OS X does require more performance overhead than OS 9.x. The move up is somewhat similar to the hardware requirement differences between Windows 9.x and WinNT/2000/XP Pro.
 


Posted by Manny Knowles (Member # 1171) on 08-17-2002, 10:53 AM:
 
Okay, Randy:

I've done a simple check and -- just as you said -- VPC recognizes the adapter if it is plugged in before loading VPC; it is not recognized if it is not plugged in first.

The Dolby software, however asks for a "Com" port. How do I address this?

Something else: VPC is asking for a driver for this "USB Device." The adapter cable came with a diskette but none of the files will run...

SER9PL.SYS
SERSPL.INF
SERSPL.VXD

I get a dialog box asking me which application to use to open the file.

What are these file types? The only .EXE file is the uninstaller. Obviously these are PC file types so I cannot load them on the Macintosh side.

I bought the cable at http://www.usbgear.com/usa/item_288.html and it was manufactured by Prolific Technology. Is there a better product to use in conjunction with VPC?

~Manny (always the lowest prices.)


 


Posted by Michael Schaffer (Member # 1204) on 08-17-2002, 01:39 PM:
 
The vxd is a virtual device driver, the sys a system file which goes to the Windows\System directory and the inf contains inf-ormation for the setup! Right-click it(or whatever you do an a Mac to get the context menue) and select the install option. Or right-click "My Computer", select properties, then the device manager, then the device. If the device was recognised by the system but the driver is missing, it will probably be marked by a yellow exclamation mark. Select properties for the device or double-click it in the list. Open the driver page and then "install new driver" (the terms might be a little different from the ones I am using, since my Windows is in German). In the ensuing dialogue, point to the directory the inf-file is located in.
Or, remove the device from the list, "reboot" Windows, and in the "New Hardware Found" dialogue that you will get after the next start, select the option which in English should be something like "Select Driver from a Specified Directory". Again point to the directory which contains the driver. Same procedure of course when Windows asks for the driver. Always feed it the inf-file then.
Also check in the hardware manager if the COM-port you select in the Dolby setup is free.
Michael

 
Posted by Martin Brooks (Member # 1269) on 08-17-2002, 02:15 PM:
 
You don't have to give up the right mouse button when moving to a Mac. Instead of using the mouse in the box, buy a third party mouse that's compatible with the Mac. Most Microsoft and Logitech mice are.

I had a Microsoft two button mouse, but it died, and I refused to buy another one. Now I'm using a Logitech 2 button + scroll wheel mouse which also happens to be cordless, but they also make a non-cordless model. Model # is Logitech M-RM67A. The scroll wheel doesn't work on every single application, but it works on most under both OS9 and OS X.

Frankly, I don't care that much about the right button, but I'll never give up the scroll wheel.
 


Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 08-17-2002, 02:31 PM:
 
I have a Microsoft optical two button mouse with scrollwheel for my Mac. I love using the right button and I love the scrollwheel. The scrollwheel works on every single application in OS 9. OS X hasn't matured enough for me to care about it yet.
 
Posted by Michael Schaffer (Member # 1204) on 08-17-2002, 03:05 PM:
 
I use the right mouse button all the time especially with programs such es Excel, so I felt somehow amputated when I had to work without it. My life has also improved when I got a wheel mouse. I don`t play with the computer often, but when I do, it comes in handy to switch weapons quickly or for more serious applications such as navigating the pages on this forum.
Michael
 
Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 08-17-2002, 11:13 PM:
 
Tell VPC to route Windows "COM1" port to the driver for the USB/Serial adaptor. Then, if the software you run in VPC wants you to select a port tell it "COM1".

Windows shouldn't need to have a driver for the adaptor. The Mac OS should own it. You should be safe in dismissing the dialog box that Windows presents asking you to choose a driver.

Also, try connecting the serial cable from the USB/Serial adaptor to the processor before you run the software.


 


Posted by Michael Schaffer (Member # 1204) on 08-18-2002, 11:02 AM:
 
Does the inf-file play the same role for the setup under Mac OS as under Windows?
Michael

 
Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 08-19-2002, 09:51 AM:
 
I don't know about .inf files. I don't do Windows.

I can tell you what extensions do.

Under OS 9 and before, extensions modify the system at startup time to handle hardware (drivers) or to add some function that wasn't there before. (Add menu items or alter the interface.) They are all loaded at startup time and stay there until you tell the "Extensions Manager" control panel not to load them. Then you have to restart the computer so that the system will reload, this time without said extension.

This was a major headache that caused a lot of crashes. The ability to load and execute modifications to the system was NOT originally designed into the Mac OS. It was originally a HACK where somebody figured out how to modify the system at boot-up time! After that, every Tom, Dick and Harry would write system extensions to do everything from installing device drivers to make your icons dance on screen. The problem is when you get extension on top of extension... modification on top of modification... you never know what could happen. Most extensions behaved OK. Every once in a while you would get one or more extension(s) that didn't know how to play nice with each other. They would eat up memory, slow the system down and cause crashes for no appearant reason. This is the very reason people used to think the Mac crashed a lot. It's not the computer, or the system software that's crashing. It's all those stupid extensions they are loading. (Or allowing to be loaded without checking first.) OK, so it sounds like I'm blaming the victim but the truth is that, under pre-OS X systems, the user had to be very careful about keeping track of extensions or else face problems with unexplained crashes.

Now, the new OS for the Mac, OS X, doesn't use extensions... OR at least it doesn't use them in the same way. OS X uses something called "kernel extensions". Essentially they have been boiled down to their essence. A kernel extension (.kext) is a piece of code that allows the kernel to communicate with hardware... it's a device driver, or what-have-you. At startup time, the OS goes through the list of .kext files and temporarily loads them. It makes a list of what's available and then unloads them all except for the ones that it finds hardware to match. If at any time the system detects a piece of hardware go on-line or off-line the kernel will attempt to track down what has changed and load/unload the necessary .kext files.
In short, the new Mac OS X uses dynamically loaded device drivers or kernel extensions.

In theory, OS X extensions should not cause crashes. They can, however, bypass the memory protection scheme(s) that the kernel provides against crashes. Normally, if one application crashes, the system keeps it segregated from the rest and shuts it down (or allows you to shut it down) without affecting anything else. IF, on the other hand, some butt-head gets cute and starts mucking around where he shouldn't be, he can make a .kext that will cause crashes. (Kernel panics, actually.) Hopefully, that won't happen. At least not for a while, yet. OS X is still pretty new and a lot of hackers are on the "uphill side" of the learning curve. I guess we'll have to wait and see.

So, does any of this make sense to you?

BTW: I did load the driver software into OS X for my "Keyspan" USB/serial adaptor. I fired up VPC and went into the FILE > PREFERENCES menu. Next to the item "COM1" I selected the driver for the adaptor and everything worked perfectly up to the point where you connect the computer up to the processor. I don't have a processor handy so I can't tell you much more.

Windows didn't ask for a device driver and didn't even notice that the COM1 port wasn't even a real port, but a virtual port created for it out of the Mac USB port and associated drivers for the Keyspan adaptor.

So, it looks like the software will run under VPC/OSX just fine. Let us all know how well this works! OK!?
 


Posted by Michael Schaffer (Member # 1204) on 08-19-2002, 02:04 PM:
 
Thanks for the thorough explanation. It`s interesting to learn how Macs and their OS work. The inf-files for Windows I was referring to are not that kind of software module, they are simply text files containing information for the installation.
I don`t remember how we set the Powerbook up to run the SDDS software, but your description makes sense. It seems logical to point Virtual PC to the adapter`s driver as a software emulation for the serial port since the Powerbook doesn`t have a hardware serial port Windows could detect.
Michael
 
Posted by Manny Knowles (Member # 1171) on 08-19-2002, 03:10 PM:
 
Unfortunately, this particular brand of cable/adapter did not come with Mac OS drivers.

Until a Mac OS driver exists, Macintosh users should avoid this cable! The manufacturer is "Prolific Technology" and I purchased it online at www.usbgear.com.

FYI, the Windows drivers don't appear to work, either. Windows doesn't seem to know what to do with them (I've double-checked this on a real Windows PC).

So it looks like I will have to buy the adapter that Randy mentioned.

Randy: I would appreciate it if you would direct me to a site that sells the same adapter that you have.

I am going to try connecting to one of the Dolby units without a driver. A lot of things in Mac OS X don't actually need them anyway. I will have to wait to unpack the Dolby units first, though.


 


Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 08-19-2002, 11:17 PM:
 
The cable I have is the Keyspan model USA-19W. You can buy it on line at Mac Connection. It's about $40 plus shipping. If you look around you can probably find it at Circuit City, Best Buy, Comp U.S.A. or whatever electronics store turns you on. (Or at least turns you off the LEAST. )

I have used it for several different things... Printers, PDAs and cinema processors. The company gives a list of devices they say will work. Of course, our processors aren't on the list. I called them and asked about it. I got their stock answer: "These are the devices we have tested the adaptor with... blah, blah blah..." So, I pressed them on the issue. The woman at Customer Service kicked it upstairs to Tech Support. I got them to tell me that they know the adaptor will work with many serial devices. The "guys" there have used it to connect GPS receivers to USB ports without problems. We chit-chatted about the things I wanted to do and they told me that they saw no reason why it shouldn't work. Again, I got the standard disclaimer, " We only guarantee our adaptor will work with devices on the list." MY experience proves that any device that uses a serial port in the "normal" way will work. I have only had a few minor glitches in all the time I have used it.

With the above disclaimers I would recommend the Keyspan.

VPC works in a similar way with just about everything you hook to the computer... printers modems and even the ethernet connection. It uses a "virtual switch" to route any network connections the way they need to go. I have used Lotus CC:Mail through the virtual switch and out through my AirPort wireless card to the internet connection at the college, finally, to the remote mail server. I was TOLD that we were SUPPOSED to dial directly into the server. It worked perfectly!

And I wasn't even SUPPOSED to be able to run CC:Mail on a Mac!


 


Posted by Manny Knowles (Member # 1171) on 07-14-2003, 12:53 PM:
 
Well...that time around, I had to resort to borrowing a PC laptop. Since then, I've learned that you don't NEED a laptop to EQ the CP-650 (but it sure makes life easier).

Thank goodness for the search engine!

I've just ordered the Keyspan adapter and can't wait to try it out. Thanks, Randy for the link (it still works!)...and everyone for the help. I'll report back with the results. Stay tuned.
 
Posted by Randy Stankey (Member # 64) on 07-14-2003, 04:02 PM:
 
Since the last time I wrote here, I have done some fine tuning of the process. I have found a way that works better for me.

I prefer to use Dolby DRAS or LOAD500 under DOS. It saved me a lot of headaches to ditch Windows. I got myself some DOS installation disks and installed a DOS machine on Virtual PC. Then I loaded DRAS into that and modified the "AUTOEXEC.BAT" file to run DRAS upon startup.

I got onto this idea when I was working on a project for work. (On the stage at Mercyhurst.) I had to write a program for the Strand lighing console and I didn't have time to sit in front of that big board and enter commads all day. I got the bright idea to load the software from the console into my Mac (VPC). I got a lot of crashes and hangups with Windows. I finally got so peeved off at it that I had to think of another way. I though, "Hey! This thing runs under DOS... Can't I make a DOS "partition" in VPC? I tried it and it worked.

Since then I have made DOS partitions for two different versions of console software. (Strand GSX/LBX and Strand 500i.) I have also made DRAS and LOAD500 into their own partitions. Now when I want to run a console program I start Virtual PC and choose which Virtual Machine to start up. It's Da' Shit!

Here's where it gets good! Virtual PC handles all the network and USB connections for you. If you have VPC configured correctly you can literally plug in a peripheral or network connection to the Mac and the virtual machine will think it's a real conection. I can plug my Mac into the college's network via an ethernet cable. (Actually I use AirPort. The AP Base Station is on the network.) The main console in the theater has an ethernet connection on the back. I can plug it into the network and control the lights on the stage with my iBook from anywhere in the theater that the Airport Base Station can reach!
(Evil possibilies abound here! [evil]

Do you have a set of DOS installation disks that you can use to make a DOS virtual macnine with? If you do (or if you can find some) I would suggest that the time you spend experimenting would be worth it.
 




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