This is topic Processor Questions in forum Film Handlers' Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.
To visit this topic, use this URL:
https://ft-forum.com/ft/cgi-bin/ubb/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=1;t=004092
Posted by John T. Hendrickson, Jr (Member # 849) on 10-12-2002, 09:10 PM:
Our owner has an opportunity to buy two Sony DCP 1000's second hand, and wants to upgrade two of our smaller houses. I ran a search and could find no information on this product, and I have no experience with Sony equipment. So...I have several questions:First, what is the vintage of these processors?
Second, for those of you who have worked with them, what is your opinion as to their quality and reliaibility?
Third, what is the availability of replacement parts and ease of repair?
Fourth, as we do not intend to go with SDDS, are these processors able to run DTS?
Lastly, what would be a ballpark fair price?
Steve, Mark, Gordon, Brad, or anyone else- can you help me out on this one?
Many thanks,
John
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 10-12-2002, 10:41 PM:
Sorry, I've never used them so I can't be of much help here.
Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 10-12-2002, 11:29 PM:
There are many better used processor on the market that I would recomend to any one ahead of those
Posted by Michael Schaffer (Member # 1204) on 10-13-2002, 12:07 AM:
A friend of mine has one and he loves it. It is quite versatile and never in all the years he had it (6-7 years or maybe longer?), it needed a repair. The cinema is very big - 800 seats, 22 meter screen - and they run a lot of arthouse programs there, so analogue sound is very important. They also have a CP200 and we were able to compare the sound quality directly in a blind test. Everyone agreed the DCP was way better. It also has some nice features, for instance, you can play Klangfilm Mono, which is an European standard without the Academy filter. The formats and the format screen are fully customisable.
The sound quality is very good, some of the units are used in recording studios here.
You can hook up several external sources to the processor. I am not sure if you need an extra a/d-converter card for dts or if the board is already included. This theater has dts-6D, DA20 and MPU1 all connected to the processor.
As to prices and availabilty of parts, I will send you the e-mail address of a friend who has installed a couple of these. He will be able to answer all your questions. In the meantime, you could also check the manual available from this website for features.
One more thing: you said you weren`t planning on playing SDDS, so you realise the DCP-1000 doesn`t play SDDS? Just mentioning it to avoid later disappointment should you change your mind.
Michael
Posted by Darryl Spicer (Member # 711) on 10-13-2002, 12:10 AM:
Digital Cinema Processor: DCP-1000.
The DCP-1000 is a cinema processor for processing analog soundtracks. Unlike other cinema processors, all signal processing is performed in the digital domain. It is compatible with all current analog soundtracks. . The above is what is said on the SDDS web site. It is a discontinued unit so getting information and help from Sony may be tough. I doubt but not for sure that you could use it for DTS.
I would go with Gordon's suggestion and look into something else.
Posted by Sean McKinnon (Member # 612) on 10-13-2002, 03:22 AM:
I use them and I do not like them. I would look into something else.But to break it down for you 
S eriously
O verrated
N ever works correctly
Y ou dont want it!!!
Posted by Shaun Flichel (Member # 1435) on 10-13-2002, 12:13 PM:
Good one Sean, never heard that one before. Although I have to totally agree with it, many sony's dont work right out of the box, neither does the replacement, or the replacement after that, this continues until you finally realize to go with Dolby.Sony sucks
Posted by Michael Schaffer (Member # 1204) on 10-13-2002, 03:10 PM:
Maybe you gentlemen could be a bit more specific in your criticism. It would probably help John better to reach a decision if you gave more detailed opinions than "Sony sucks" or "Sony never works". I have had a lot of good experiences with Sony equipment. If you read and follow the installation manual, it works most of the time.
Michael
Posted by Sean McKinnon (Member # 612) on 10-13-2002, 03:26 PM:
"it works most of the time."Well that is one problem right there it should work ALL the time.
I just think that it is a poorly though out proccessor and that it does not sound as good as say a Dolby CP500. Maybe I dislike it more because it is part of an SDDS set-up but we wont even get into SDDS right now!
Posted by Michael Schaffer (Member # 1204) on 10-13-2002, 03:40 PM:
Sean,
no known piece of technical equipment works ALL the time. That is why we congregate here on this forum.
How do you know it doesn`t sound as well as the CP500? Have you heard both processors in the same room with the same setup? I never liked the CP500`s analogue playback very much.
Please let us know why you think it is poorly designed. I gave reasons for my observations, if you give reasons too, I can reconsider my observations. That I find much more interesting than to read that Sony sucks. I already know that Americans generally don`t like Japanese products 
Michael
Posted by Darryl Spicer (Member # 711) on 10-13-2002, 04:42 PM:
I think the things that are stated above are good opinions and that is what they are opinions. Not everyone likes or will ever like the same things. If one thinks something sucks then that is there opinion. By the way we build Japanees cars right here in this state. Toyotas to be exact.
Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 10-13-2002, 04:46 PM:
Well I am a Canadian and I don't like them installed quite a few and most we removed and replaced with cp500's and used 65's
most were put up for sale and ended up in the dumpster
I found the eq harsh and they tended to loose settings more often than the CP500's do
Also CP200 can format mono no nr and no filter with a few diodes
Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 10-13-2002, 05:36 PM:
Buy a Panastereo Processor. Its the best one on the market right now. You WILL have to outboard a digital system into it(very easily done!)at extra cost, but then, you really do want the best sound, right? There is no other processor on the market right now in my book.John, I wonder if the units you were offered were any of the ones out of Gords dumpster??
Mark
Posted by Steve Kraus (Member # 476) on 10-13-2002, 06:14 PM:
Never a gray area with Mark, Mr. Absolute. Something is either the best or it's junk.
Posted by Michael Schaffer (Member # 1204) on 10-13-2002, 08:06 PM:
Mark, your post made me curious since I have never seen or heard a Panastereo processor in real life. They are very uncommon here. Maybe they have more of them in the UK. Please let us know more about why it is your preferred equipment.
By the way, Darryl, I have no problems whatsoever with opinions, of course, only sometimes I think it might be interesting to learn what they are based on.
Michael
Posted by Josh Jones (Member # 447) on 10-13-2002, 08:23 PM:
A link for the gents....
http://www.panalogic.com/products/CSP1200.html Josh
------------------
"Film is made of silver, video is made of rust"
'nuf said
Posted by Bob Maar (Member # 763) on 10-13-2002, 08:25 PM:
John, The Sony 1000 and the 2000's were discontinued when they came out with the Sony combination unit the SONY 3000, several years ago. Sony at that time said that they would support the older units for seven years. The people that were running the SDDS Division and made these promises are no longer around. I know that Al Barton(SDDS General Manager) reads these posts and maybe he will chime in with a response.
Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 10-13-2002, 09:09 PM:
Sonically the PanaStereo is the finest sounding analogue processor out there
It has the lowest noise and distortion of anything around and very flexable to format as well
Posted by Michael Schaffer (Member # 1204) on 10-13-2002, 09:36 PM:
How much would the Panastereo processor be approximately? Also, if wandering from the original subject is allowed, does anyone have feedback on the magnetic processor? The same theater I was writing about earlier has started looking for an alternative to the MPU1, as they are not too happy with it.
Michael
Posted by Sean McKinnon (Member # 612) on 10-13-2002, 10:57 PM:
Ok...I have worked in about 5 different theatres so far in my career, I have operated projectors at one time or another in probably close to ten I have encountered CP500's and DCP1000's in very similar rooms and hands down I always prefered the CP500. To me the DCP sounds too hollow I just do not like the way it sounds. I also hate the way the interface is designed... Yes it is just my personal opinion
Also the card for the anolog sound tends to die I had 2 die in a matter of weeks at one theatre. (I cant recall off the top of my head what card it is but I know its usually the same one every time.) Never had A dolby proccesor die on me. I expect 100% from any piece of equipment that I use. I believe that if you properly maintain and operate a piece of equipment it is very reasonable to expect it not to fail. How mnay CP55's are still in operation and working well? Will the same be said for the Sony DCP's in 10 years?
Posted by Aaron Sisemore (Member # 145) on 10-14-2002, 01:20 AM:
DO NOT waste your time or money on those Sony processors.Sony Cinema Products as we know it is GONE. All of the techs are no longer working for them (this was told to me over the phone by a Sony representative, to scotch any 'rumors'). The only remaining tech that knows anything about the cinema products seems to be flying about the country and not taking calls. All tech support for cinema products is handled by Sony National Service, and when I gave them the model number 'DFP-D2000' they replied, 'is that the MiniDV camera?' Once they figured out what I was talking about, the placed me on hold for what seemed like an eternity, then the next guy I spoke to answered and told me the story of the jet-setting technician, and I began dropping names of other Sony techs and he replies that none of them work for Sony anymore.
sorry for being 'sour' but I am reaching the end of the proverbial rope with Sony. 
-Aaron
Posted by Sean McKinnon (Member # 612) on 10-14-2002, 01:35 AM:
Aaron,Just make sure that you have that six pack from your photo with you whenever you have to tech a piece of sony equipment... You will need it!!!
Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 10-14-2002, 08:48 AM:
The Panastereo mag unit is very good check out the comments in the reviews section. It mates well with a CP500 as well
Posted by Michael Schaffer (Member # 1204) on 10-14-2002, 03:34 PM:
Thanks for pointing me to that review. It looks very interesting and I will tell my friend about it. This theater actually runs 70mm regularly, so they really care about the quality. They are the only theater that I know which has the anamorhic lens for Ultra Panavision 70 - even if they are using it only every few years.
Michael
Posted by Steve Kraus (Member # 476) on 10-14-2002, 05:36 PM:
Once every few years is probably more than just about anyone else in the world. What exists in runnable condition in UP70?BTW, I have pictures of the UP 70 optics on my web page: http://steve.filmteknik.com/unfilm.html
Posted by Jason Burroughs (Member # 68) on 10-14-2002, 10:49 PM:
When I used a DCP-1000 I never really had any issues with them. "SR" sounded pretty good for optical, and the processor had room to grow. However this was a few years go and since it has been discontinued parts will become difficult to find.
Posted by Michael Schaffer (Member # 1204) on 10-15-2002, 03:50 AM:
There are a few collectors here in Germany so most movies have survived in playable condition. Now and then we get together to watch a print when somebody organises it. Fortunately, we can use this large theater in the mornings for such occasions.
To get back to the original topic, it might be interesting to know that this theater is one of the main screening locations for the Berlin Film Festival. The Festival usually insisits on original equipment. If a movie is in Dolby SR for instance, they want it to be played back on original Dolby equipment. But they were convinced by the sound quality of the DCP-1000 to make an exception there.
Michael
Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 10-15-2002, 05:22 AM:
I'd be concerned about the kind of support that Sony will provide for older cinema processors. Even if the DCP-1000 is the best-sounding processor ever built (which it probably isn't), I'd be concerned about parts availability and technical support going forward.I've worked with most of the Dolby processors (CP-45/50/55/65/200/500) and can say nothing but good things about the support that Dolby provides for their older products. You can call them up and they will answer questions about a CP-50, for example. How many other manufacturers will provide that kind of assistance with their obsolete products?
Posted by Les Brock (Member # 1041) on 10-16-2002, 04:55 PM:
It is correct that Sony supply service and support for 7 years after equipment has been discontinued.This applies to the DCP 1000 and DFP D2000 and the Camera System DFR C2000.
The DFP D2500, DFP D3000 and Camera system DFR C3000 are still in production.
Here in Europe Sony Cinema Products is still around as is the repair centre located at Sony Business Europe near London. We have parts for DCP 1000 etc.......
In the US there are 3 technicians working for SDDS. 2 based in Los Angeles and 1 in the Eastern US.
Al Barton is also still based in Los Angeles.
As for techs jetting around the country and not taking calls, I have just spent a week with the guys in LA, we didnt leave CA all week. There is always someone in the LA office.
------------------
Les Brock
Principal Engineer
SDDS Systems.
Priestley Road Basingstoke,Hants
United Kingdom, RG24 9JP
Phone +44 1256 484924
Les.Brock@sonybpe.com
Website www.sdds.com
Posted by John T. Hendrickson, Jr (Member # 849) on 10-17-2002, 07:37 PM:
Thanks to everyone for your input and advice. I'm inclined to shy away from these units, since I now know that they are much older than the seller claims. I'm also concerned with the discontinuation issue. Time is running out on that 7 year support.Given the price the seller wants for them, I feel the money can best be spent elsewhere on new equipment.
Posted by Oscar Neundorfer (Member # 458) on 10-17-2002, 09:16 PM:
A little off the subject, but...Scott said,"How many other manufacturers will provide that kind of assistance with their obsolete products?"
SMART will, and does so regularly. We also still repair products made as long as 25 years ago as long as we can get parts.
Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 10-17-2002, 09:39 PM:
Smart has always stood behind there products no matter how old or provided a work around for an unavailable part
wish some other sompanies provided that kind of suport
Posted by John T. Hendrickson, Jr (Member # 849) on 10-19-2002, 04:50 PM:
Ditto that. Oscar has always been helpful to me in providing information and advice, and Smart has provided timely repair/exchange on their processor cards every time our dealer contacts them.
Posted by Tim Reed (Member # 137) on 10-20-2002, 03:47 PM:
"Tritto" to the Smart support. Oscar's a trouper.My now-ex territory had several DCP-1000's, and other Sony units. You will do well to stay far away from any professional equipment from Sony, unless you are prepared to buy new every few years.
Recently, I needed a CPU module for the 1000 and as much was told "good luck" by the Sony Professional parts contact. They only had one of a couple other cards on hand for that processor, and planned to keep no more after those were gone.
This did not surprise me. Somewhere on this forum, there is a post I made several years ago predicting that Sony would do this with the theatre equipment. I was well-familiar with this outfit from my broadcast days, and they did the same thing with that equipment. They'll have a piece of equipment available for a couple of years, then discontinue it and completely withdraw support. They expect you, instead, to buy their latest and greatest.
If anyone can find that original post, you'll see where I tried to warn the industry! 
------------------
Better Projection Pays!