This is topic Big Sky automation vs. Neumade Maxi-12 in forum Film Handlers' Forum at Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE.


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Posted by Ken Layton (Member # 133) on 01-14-2003, 12:44 PM:
 
Why do the Big Sky Series 1 and Neumade Maxi-12 automations look alike? Who actually makes them??? Same question has been haunting me on the Big Sky lamphouse electronic display meter panel and Neumade's version also. Is there actually any difference in these units?

I would like to see Neumade put a section on their website describing their automation units and cue detectors.
 
Posted by Steve Guttag (Member # 268) on 01-14-2003, 04:47 PM:
 
The Big Sky and Neumade stuff are so similar they are interchangable! The Big Sky console/lamphouse panel display is a bit nicer in that it has status lights for the various interlocks.

Steve
 
Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 01-14-2003, 11:32 PM:
 
DEFINATELY...Stay away from both of them! Go with something decent like the Kelmar Deluxe, or Ultimation. They are VERY RELIABLE workhorses and have tried and true cue detectors The Strong series(made by Eprad) is also good...CNA100, 150, and 200.
Fool around with what ever you want to, but there ain't much else out there in my book cept whats listed above.
Mark
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 01-15-2003, 12:37 AM:
 
The CA21 will kill any of those you listed, Mark. [Smile]
 
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 01-15-2003, 01:45 AM:
 
Oh no, no, no, no, no Mr. Mark. The CNA-150s I've played with were the biggest nightmare I have ever had to deal with. After doing a lot of grounding work they are finally running well for about 98% of the shows...but it's that other pesky 2% that makes me still hate them dearly. They are also not very operator friendly in programming and are lacking quite a bit in features. (I'm sure the CNA-200 satisfies that need, but I don't think I'll ever give it a chance after the CNA-150 fiasco.)

Go with the CA21 if you want quality, ease and features. If you need something basic, check out Kelmar (and products made by them with other manufacturer's names on them) and Component Engineering's stuff. To hell with everything else.
 
Posted by Daryl Lund (Member # 356) on 01-15-2003, 10:02 PM:
 
I think componant ingineerings ta10 is really good.
 
Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 01-15-2003, 10:15 PM:
 
I've probably got about close to 100 CNA 100, 150, and Eprad Ultimation out there not counting all the Ultimations I installed in the Midwest. So few problems with with any of them I'd have to struggle to remember what the last problem I had with any of them was.
The build quality on Neumades stuff is horrible....the last Neumade stuff I installed in Indiana was a literal rats nest!!

Brad, I suspect that you have a major electrical issue in that building....if you have a proper ground there are never any problems. As far as the Kelmar Deluxe goes it jst good ole reliable....all electromechanical.
Joe, You can have the CA-21! It might work great, but what happens if the Aussie manufacturer goes belly up? I wouldn't sell something to a customer that hasn't been around in the field for a long time.

Darryl, I don't even classify the TA-10 as automation. You have to do so much to it to adapt it to different schemes that you may as well just build your own automation. Have you ever had to change the main board in a complicated detup....? Plan on spending ALOT of time doing that! You also have to move over any diodes and add-ons that were originally put in to make the theatre function. I've also had ALOT of failures of the power supply section in them although I do know that has been improved. The CE cue detector is quite good, and comes in 70mm size. But the FP-300 runs rings around it and has not needed any mods to work with estar film.
Mark
 
Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 01-15-2003, 10:55 PM:
 
Mark, we will have to agree to disagree. The CA21 takes the Strong stuff hands down. Let me put it this way, if you had CNA automations in a complex and they went bonkers on you, you would be flat out refusing to install them anywhere else too, regardless of any "electrical issues" that may or may not have been on that site. You know that is what would happen.

I don't think Pennywise will be going anywhere. I would be more concerned about Eprad. At least Pennywise and Christie gave full support of their product whenever questions or installation issues arose. Strong ignored most of my emails and phone messages and Eprad did not return calls at all. What a friggin' joke!

Putting product support aside, let's look at this.
I could go on and on, but even with just these few examples, Strong's automations (at least the CNA-150) sucks in feature comparison, reliability and most importantly...product support from the manufacturer.
 
Posted by Daryl C. W. O'Shea (Member # 1303) on 01-15-2003, 11:01 PM:
 
And here I thought, Brad, that you enjoyed that ever friendly programming interface of the CNA-150. [Big Grin]
 
Posted by Ken Layton (Member # 133) on 01-15-2003, 11:21 PM:
 
Did Big Sky build the automation for Neumade or did Neumade build the automation for Big Sky? They look so much alike.
 
Posted by Paul Mayer (Member # 355) on 01-16-2003, 02:16 AM:
 
My understanding is that Big Sky was started by former Neumade folks. Apparently they took ideas with them to the new company. Reminds me of Magni vis-a-vis Tektronix in the video waveform monitor world.
 
Posted by Richard Fowler (Member # 893) on 01-16-2003, 09:33 AM:
 
The Pennywise CA 21 will not belly up since Kinoton and other manufacturers, circuits such as Hoyts, and International distributors handle their product.
Richard Fowler
Kinoton America
 
Posted by Tim Reed (Member # 137) on 01-16-2003, 10:28 AM:
 
I don't know, Richard, there were a lot of Rank automations out there, too. [Smile]
 
Posted by Richard Fowler (Member # 893) on 01-16-2003, 01:59 PM:
 
The history of Rank business operations would make a good book [Wink]
 
Posted by Pat Moore (Member # 380) on 01-16-2003, 03:13 PM:
 
I'd like to think you'll see Strong and Eprad for a while as well...

Pat
 
Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 01-16-2003, 03:57 PM:
 
Yes and Cinemation is still in business in the UK
 
Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 01-16-2003, 04:22 PM:
 
Not sure why some of you would think the makers of the best automation on the planet would go away anytime soon. No other automation in the world can even hold a candle to the CA21. Plus, if you have a problem with it, the manufacturer assists until the problem is solved!
 
Posted by John T. Mellor (Member # 468) on 01-21-2003, 07:25 AM:
 
To answer Kens original question, the same person that designed the newmade automation also designed the Big Sky automation thats why they are so similar. Big Sky has always supported all of thier equipment . I find that all equipment is designed to meet certain criteria, cost , ease of instal and service , , through all the posts I have read it seems there is a difference between the west , central and eastern parts of the country as to witch equipment is better. I guess its what you get used to working with and what the theatre will buy.
 
Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 01-21-2003, 08:58 AM:
 
John said.....
"To answer Kens original question, the same person that designed the newmade automation also designed the Big Sky automation thats why they are so similar."
________________________________________________________________
So, does that mean it is also as big a rats nest as the Neumade stuff is?????
MArk
 
Posted by John T. Mellor (Member # 468) on 01-21-2003, 06:57 PM:
 
Actually its fairly easy to work on but I haven't had to do much a few small problems with the first install but since then they have been easy/ All the wires were routed and not left hanging like so others I have had the PLEASURE of working on many times
 




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