Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: ORC 1000 acting up again

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Posted by Dan Lyons (Member # 1454) on 10-18-2003, 04:48 PM:

I got my lamp back from the repair shop for ignitor issues, I had the time to finally test it out last nite. I installed a brand new ORC 750watt xenon, and ran it at 30amps.

About 10 sec after it started, the lamp went out and blowers shut off, then restarted. Weird.

Today I turned it on and about 5 mins into running the lamp went off then re-ignited.

Just tried it again; after starting up with no problems, 3 mins into the run, the lamp went out, came back on, then 5 seconds later the lamp went out again, came back on, then 4 seconds went out, came back on. At this point, I turned the entire thing off.

I also noted that after running about 10 minutes, the outer casing of the lamp was very hot. The blowers are working well. They top blower puts out a ton of air, and it's just slightly warm.

What is wrong with this evil thing? [Mad]

Danny

Posted by Phil Hill (Member # 371) on 10-18-2003, 05:30 PM:

Danny, I would 1st call and/or go back to the "shop" that repaired it and ask them what is going on? Hopefully, they would have checked it out before returning it to you.

Any reputable firm/person would guarantee their work for any customer. If you don't get any satisfaction, post who for all of us to stay clear of. [beer]

>>> Phil

Posted by Kenneth Wuepper (Member # 1174) on 10-18-2003, 05:37 PM:

Hello Dan,

Please look into the Manuals section and find your lamphouse service manual there. On part 1.9 pages 5-7, you will see described the very type of 'demonic possession' you describe under the part about the thermal protection of the SCRs.

Either there is a thermal problem with the SCRs or the heat sensor is defective or misadjusted. The heat sink at 160 degrees is very warm to the touch. I would suggest that this area is your problem.

Is the rating for your lamp 30 Amperes? Check the current setting against your lamp tech sheet for the correct setting. Also note that the meter may be telling a tale other than the fact.

Happy troubleshooting.

Phil,
Perhaps the service shop did not have the bulb when they checked out the igniter circuitry.

Posted by Pete Lawrence (Member # 130) on 10-18-2003, 06:01 PM:

Dan,
A couple of questions. Do you have the diverging lens in the nose? If the nose is open the air flow is all messed up.

The fans shutting off sounds like an interlock problem. The fans should continue to run even if it trips off on over temp. There is one switch on the top cover and a second small microswitch in the nose if you have the flip-up nose version. I had lots of trouble with the nose switch on mine.

Make sure both fans are running. The little one on the back panel will spin by the air moved by the big fan in the top cover.

They do get warm after an hour but you can still touch the housing without any pain.

Are you venting to the booth or out a duct?

Posted by Phil Hill (Member # 371) on 10-18-2003, 07:26 PM:

Ken, that may very well be true. BUT, if they couldn't test and verify the repair, they should have bought the correct equipment/lamp/whatever, OR at the very least, passed on the repair.

I think most companies would not survive if all their ***customers*** were treated on "speculation". I know, I sure the hell could not have gotten away with that philosophy. ...Not that I would have tried!

Also, all the help & pointers here are all good info, but the bottom line is: Danny should NOT have to "troubleshoot" his "repaired" lamphouse! If he paid for the repair, he should get his $ worth!

Just my 2-cents....

>>> Phil

Posted by Gordon McLeod (Member # 33) on 10-18-2003, 08:28 PM:

1st before you work on it yourself take it back
you go inside and do anything will void any warranty from the shop that did the work
2nd there is a heat sensor that will after several trippings (could have been in the ancient history) will start to trip early

Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 10-18-2003, 08:47 PM:

Dan, definitely return it to the repair dealer! I know if I did a repair job on some equipment and for whatever reason it failed I wouldn't want anyone poking around in there until I could check it out and make good on the deal. Gordon is very much correct, you could kill your warranty by taking the cover off. Don't do it.

Posted by Dan Lyons (Member # 1454) on 10-18-2003, 11:03 PM:

Thanks guys. Let me answer a few of your questions.

Yes, the lens is in the nose.

Yes, both fans are working. However when I took off the cover and bulb out to confirm this, I turned on the lamp without bulb in, and sparks flew out of the anode connector<or somewhere near that area in front of reflector>, scared me to death!!! The anode wire wasn't touching the reflector either.

The switch in the snood is not connected so that is not an issue.

The lamp is on a table, so I'm venting to the "booth",aka family room. It was only run 10 mins max at one time, and became very hot to the touch.

AFAIK, there is no "official" warranty on the work done on this. To make matters worse, the dealer is out of state, which would mean I'd be out another $100 on shipping<both ways>.

I'm currently awaiting a reply from the dealer.
I bought the lamp in February, it was "in for repairs" till last month. Still haven't been able to have a show in my screening room, at this rate, I won't even make a Christmas show!

Danny [uhoh]

Posted by Mark Gulbrandsen (Member # 72) on 10-18-2003, 11:35 PM:

Hey guys, I am the "dealer" that repaired the lamp for Dan charging him only for parts(small caps) at my cost. I also sold him a good used reflector I had from my old lamps for next to nothing. I was basically interested in helping out someone that had an interest in learning about rebuilding projectors, etc.

When the lamphouse left our shop it worked fine. The control board, and SCR board were re-capped, all else was in passable and operable condition. I would certainly be most happy to have Dan send it back in again to see what happened. I'd ship it back the same week. I'd be willing to bet there is some sort of shipping damage inside. It may also be quite possible that the "new" ORC lamp he got is bad. Thats a pretty lousy brand of lamp to begin with. I've had my old rental Model 1000 lamps damaged in shipment quite a few times. Usually finding sheared off screws that secure things to the bottom housing.
Its certainbly possible that the thermal sensor could be bad but I doubt it has become jarred loose due to the way its mounted. Its also possible that the air duct to the heatsinks is clogged, however everything was blown out with air so thats doubtful. As for the sparking, look for a strand or two of wire from the positive lead than could be touching something up front. Its also common for the positive lead to get in the way of the dowser itself causing a fireworks display. This is also bad for the SCR board!!

Dan, Also keep in mind that this lamphouse, perhaps an ex-Disney, or some Museum unit which you bought via an E-bay seller has a zillion hours on it and the insulation on some of the wiring that is exposed to light is somewhat brittle but intact. This is very common on these lamps that have high hours. Your unit ran fine for about two days in the shop before it was shipped. Repairing just about anything that goes wrong with these lamps is an easy job. While I certainly feel bad about it not working I hardly feel guilty of anything. I did Dan a favor, however, if Dan pays shipment to me again(about 30.00 via Fed-Ex Ground) then I would be more than happy to pay shipping back to him to make it right [thumbsup]

.

Mark

P.S. As for the amount of heat up front, be sure the bulb is correctly focused and aligned(X-Y). If its way out of alignment, or focus, its possible that the light may be landing on something other than the front lens. Alignment of this particuluar small mirrored lamphouse can be quite touchy till you understand what the adjustments do, how they effect the beam, and till get used to how the adjustments behave.
Another tip.... If you're going to run the lamp for hours on end you'll need an auxillary exhaust blower to achieve long lamp life. I used a 780 cfm Dayton blower to exhaust a pair of model 1000's on location. They could run all day and barely got luke warm!! I also never had an electronic failure on any of them either. About the only problems I encountered was repeated mechanical damage from alot of back and forth shipments.