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Posted by Shane Hoffmann (Member # 1620) on 12-03-2003, 05:00 PM:
 
I just came across this article at TheOneRing.net

I hear that New Line Cinema is out for blood over Monday's catastrophic Washington screening of its Christmas blockbuster "The Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King." I'm told that the first full-dress battle scene, more than a hour into the 3-hour, 17-minute epic, was run upside-down for some 30 critics at the Loews Georgetown. "At first I thought, 'Wow, that's a totally cool camera angle, from the perspective of someone who was felled in the battle," one witness told me yesterday. Baltimore Sun movie critic Michael Sragow said: "It was the first massing of forces, and you got these elephant creatures coming on screen upside down. Obviously, it was about the worst way to see a movie." Worse still, the influential audience had to wait 45 minutes while the projectionist re-threaded the film, only to restart it after a huge gap in the action. In due course, an upside-down Frodo appeared, and the screening was halted again for another 45 minutes. "Obviously we're upset as anyone would be, and we're in discussions with Loews," a chagrined New Line spokeswoman told me. "We want to know if Gollum was in the projection booth."
 

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Posted by Adam Martin (Member # 641) on 12-03-2003, 05:27 PM:
 
You'll have that happen when you send out a print to arrive two hours before a screening in a platter house.
 

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Posted by Mark Lensenmayer (Member # 134) on 12-03-2003, 06:24 PM:
 
I had this exact thing happen years ago at an important INDIANA JONES sneak. Ran fine until one reel popped up upsidedown. After MANY apologies from the management and ONE HOUR to reset, they ran the film again, only to pop upside down at the next reel break. I didn't want to wait another hour as this was a work night, so I just left. The management was in the lobby saying it wasn't their fault, that the film had come in only 1 hour before the screening. And this was a platter house.
 

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Posted by Per Hauberg (Member # 529) on 12-03-2003, 06:41 PM:
 
-haven't done it myself - yet...

but I do remember it happening at the Palads Theatre of Copenhagen for the presse screening of "The Shining" - the reel, that had been turned "upside down" was the labyrinth, and here too, everybody started thinking - "Well it's Kubrick...", but after about three minutes, even the projectionist got a hint...! After half an hour of waiting, the screening was cancelled. Poor guy up there.
 

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Posted by Bill Gabel (Member # 1105) on 12-03-2003, 07:35 PM:
 
A few years back at the Mann's Regent Theatre in Westwood, California. They were doing a Press Screening of a Warner film. The projectionist built the print up earlier in the day for the show. (He was a Very Good projectionist, I say that because he was) So at 8pm the Assistant Manager goes up to the booth to start the show. So now the show is running, everything is fine at the Regent. But when it hits reel 3, everything is upside down. The assistant runs up to the booth to fix the problem, before stopping the machine fully. She tries to open the gate of the AAII. That AAII was a funky machine to begin with. So now they have a cancelled show and a messed-up projector. So that is how the projector that Mann Theatres left for Landmark Theatres got all banged-up. The projectionist had all the time that day to do it right but something happened and that reel got placed in wrong.
 

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Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 12-03-2003, 07:43 PM:
 
I did that once but never before an audience. It was the horrible movie "Star Trek: Generations" and a reel came up upside down and backwards. Whoops. I went up and fixed it. That's why we pre-screened movies. The worst I ever did in front of an audience was a Dolby Aurora trailer upside down in a mad rush at the Telluride Film Festival. The trailer is short and boring, and I don't think anyone cared. Still embarrassing, though.
 

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Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 12-03-2003, 07:49 PM:
 

quote:

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You'll have that happen when you send out a print to arrive two hours before a screening in a platter house.

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EXACTLY! New Line has only themselves (and Jack Valenti) to blame for the screwup.
 

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Posted by Phil Hill (Member # 371) on 12-03-2003, 07:51 PM:
 
I hope "Triumph" the dog does interviews/comments with the people waiting in line when it opens here in the US. His bit with the Star Wars thing was hilarious!

>>> Phil
 

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Posted by Chris Hipp (Member # 1788) on 12-03-2003, 08:07 PM:
 
While I do strongly agree that prints should arrive early enought to screen, it is not hard to build up a print correctly even in a crunch.

I usually build up 7-10 prints with two people in 5-6 hours. and have never had a problem like a backwards reel. Common problems are forgetting to put on a cue or a misplice in the trailers.

If the soundtrack is away from you and the picture is to the right then it is heads out.

I just thought about this while typing that, do all rewind benches go left to right?
 

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Posted by John Pytlak (Member # 331) on 12-03-2003, 09:15 PM:
 
With standard print orientation, the analog soundtrack is outboard (toward you), the emulsion side faces the lamp, and the image is upside-down in the gate.

Another way to remember is the the "Heads are toward the Head", i.e., the top of the image is towards the head end of the print.
 

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Posted by Ian Price (Member # 14) on 12-03-2003, 09:26 PM:
 
I've done that with trailers a couple of times.
 

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Posted by Nate Lehrke (Member # 1460) on 12-04-2003, 12:58 AM:
 
I ran the ROTK on Fri morning, (Go here 1 hour 30 minutes before start, with three security personal armed with night vision goggles and metal detectors)

About 45 minutes left of the film, the 'guard' assigned to the booth came down screaming about something. I ran upstairs and saw the beginnings of a tail wrap! The magnet had been tossed and there was about three minutes of film already wrapped, but I was only off-screen for about 4 minutes to get it fixed, than back to the awesome movie!

No particular point to my post
 

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Posted by Frank Angel (Member # 248) on 12-04-2003, 01:22 AM:
 
Screw New Line. If 1) they are too cheap to PAY for a test run in advance of their own press screening and 2) if they are too stupid to send a print early enough so it can be carefully checked at buildup for this kind of mistake and 3) if ANY studio is that clue-less that they will allow a brand new print that is to play for the a press screening to be run without a trained projectionist in the booth for the ENTIRE run, then the deserve whatever failure can and will happen in a booth -- brain wrap included.

And then, of course, everyone knows that even if a reel were to hit the screen upside down, backwards, and/or soundtrack reversed, it wouldn't take more than a minute or two (not 45min) to correct the problem IF the transport were reel-to-reel and not platter. Now THERE'S a distinct advantage R-T-R transport has over the platter transport that even Brad has to admit.
 

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Posted by Chris Trainor (Member # 9) on 12-04-2003, 03:07 AM:
 
Most theaters are too cheap to pay much more than minimum wage to their projectionists, do you think they'll spring for a second projector to run reel-to-reel? Heck, a few of the theaters I know about that were RtR split their houses and split up the projectors to save money.

--Chris
 

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Posted by Tom Ruhling (Member # 1063) on 12-04-2003, 03:21 AM:
 
Well, Hey! That's what you get for $8.50 an hour. The Georgetown runs an usher operator scheme. Lets not be too harsh on New Line. They probably paid for a dedicated operator. It would not be the first time Loews pocketed the $$$ and hoped for the best. In regard to time, I run an 18plex. My last weeks print night was nine in, five out, and 16 moves. Total time--nine hours to completion, by myself, error free.
No excuse for this shoddy showmanship.

(You would think that with five booths and four levels, my theatre would have more than one operator at any given time, but that is not the case. Instead they will be cutting our hours and are hoping to put an usher to the task for 30 hours a week. Unfortunately no one seems to want to run my booth for $8.50. They even put one employee on probation for not "steeping up" to the challenge).

You get what you pay for. Unless you are New Line.
 

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Posted by Michael Schaffer (Member # 1204) on 12-04-2003, 03:24 AM:
 
A few years ago at the Berlin Film Festival, one reel of "The Thin Red Line" ran upside down. The print had been delivered just minutes before the screening, no time for inspection. Anyway, many important people were very "upset" just like those critics. The only one who remained calm was director Terence Malick. He said he didn`t mind and asked that the poor projectionist was not punished. From what I heard later, he was fired anyway because some cowardly managers wanted to cover their back. Probably the same ones who had failed to ensure that the print arrived in time for thorough inspection.
 

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Posted by Mathew Molloy (Member # 666) on 12-04-2003, 04:09 AM:
 
I just attended the trade screening of ROTK at Pacific's Galleria in Sherman Oaks. Apparently there wasn't much concern for print quality at a trade screening. The print had at least 5 lab splices and one during a very important end scene during which the digital dropped out for a few seconds.

Speaking of digital dropping out - besides happening a couple times at splices, it was obviously running at a high error rate.

I must say that the Pacific had a real nice presentation. The only time I saw splice tape was between reels 9 & 10. My only gripes would be that it was framed too low and off to the left(I could see the bottom of the picture in the top masking and there was spill on the left masking). I could be wrong but it felt and (almost) sounded like there were quite a few frames missing between reels.

On a side note - I loved the film but even though this film has some of the most amazing special fx I've ever seen (and didn't know I was seeing) it has quite a few fx that are the worst of the trilogy - all involving the hobbits & blue screen.
 

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Posted by Matthew Peters (Member # 1495) on 12-04-2003, 07:48 AM:
 
I have seen a Dolby Digital tag run through upside down just before the feature as I was checking one of our cinemas, I came hurling up to the booth to sort it out. It was just the Dolby tag that was upside down (thank god) so I didn’t have to interrupt the show (well anymore than already ).

It was the City/Broadway/Helicopter one. I had no idea the Dolby Digital Track could play in reverse .I imagine the analogue track could but for some reason I thought the digital would not, it proved me wrong!
 

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Posted by Paul Konen (Member # 41) on 12-04-2003, 09:02 AM:
 
Tom said ...

quote:

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My last weeks print night was nine in, five out, and 16 moves. Total time--nine hours to completion, by myself, error free.

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What about screening time?

Nine in would have taken about 15-18 man hours to build
5 out about 2-3 man hours
16 moves about 1-2 man hours

Don't see how you could do all that on your own. Sorry

BTW, mine arrived about 2.5 hours prior. 5 Security guards, 1 supervisor. Metal wands and night vision to check for cheats.

IMHO, You won't be disappointed.
 

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Posted by Jeff Stricker (Member # 224) on 12-04-2003, 10:09 AM:
 
I agree with Frank, the only way to run an importrant screening such as this is in a reel-to-reel house with ample time to inspect the film before the show.
 

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Posted by Jason Burroughs (Member # 68) on 12-04-2003, 10:18 AM:
 
I've only had one instance of something like this happen, and unfortunatly the public got to see it too. After recieving a print of Shawshank Redemption for its Academy run, I built it up and did my best to make sure that everything was in order, however EVERY reel change was in black it seemed, and the booth was damn near pitch black itself 2 reels ended up getting put on backwards. I had asked the manager to make sure that the print got screened, as it was previously run and its condition unknown. I came in the next morning, theaded up the show, noticing that the print wasn't screened. At about reel 3 or 4 a customer came out to notify us that the picture was up side down. Ok not a HUGE problem the reel was back on screen and in the right direction in about 15-20 minutes. About 20 minutes later they came out again, the picture was upside down again. By this time they were understandably frustrated. This would have been resolved by several things, 1 not giving me 3 pints to build up and then scheduling me to open the next morning, 2 provide adequite lighting in the booth, especially in the buildup area, 3 Screen the prints, especially if the condiditon of the print is unknown.
 

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Posted by Steve Scott (Member # 630) on 12-04-2003, 10:18 AM:
 
My manager told me that the trade screening of ROTK broke down towards the end of the trade screening in Minneapolis. Said the sound was bad too... I don't know why they still have all the trade shows at St. Louis Park up here.
 

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Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 12-04-2003, 10:26 AM:
 
I'm going to go out on a limb here and point out that a late-arriving print is no excuse for lack of print inspection. Better to start the show five minutes (or even thirty minutes) late, with an explanation to the audience that the print arrived late, and get the show properly inspected and ready to run than to rush and screw up the presentation.

And, yes, it's too bad that most of these shows run in multiplexes with platters and a projectionist who can't devote his full attention to the screening, since he needs to keep several other shows on screen.
 

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Posted by Joe Redifer (Member # 3) on 12-04-2003, 10:42 AM:
 
Steve Scott-

Check out Nate's post on page 1. I believe he works at the theater you describe and he talked about the incident.
 

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Posted by John Pytlak (Member # 331) on 12-04-2003, 10:52 AM:
 
Nate wrote:

quote:

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About 45 minutes left of the film, the 'guard' assigned to the booth came down screaming about something. I ran upstairs and saw the beginnings of a tail wrap! The magnet had been tossed and there was about three minutes of film already wrapped, but I was only off-screen for about 4 minutes to get it fixed

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quote:

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Apparently, they forgot to rewind that reel before rethreading

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How could they 'forget' to rewind it, unless they had an Academy, or SMPTE, leader on both ends of the reel?

I've been guilty of putting a reel back in the rack without rewinding, but you realise what's happened when you next lace it up and there are no numbers, and there is still time at that point to put things right. If they did have a leader on both ends of the reel, then that's just asking for trouble.
 

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Posted by Christopher Seo (Member # 7) on 12-04-2003, 11:51 AM:
 
One quick check that I have found useful after making a splice: checking the optical soundtrack on the emulsion side. If the soundtracks meet together (obviously), and if both are emulsion on the same side, I at least know I've joined a head to a tail.
 

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Posted by Tom Ruhling (Member # 1063) on 12-04-2003, 12:00 PM:
 
Hey Paul.

I wish I had 18 hours for a print night. Lowes would fire me so fast if I took that long. Funny thing is that I have been accused of milking the payroll. Could you give my Managers a call so I could get a break? Come check us out some time. Lowes Cineplex Rio 18 in Gaithersburg MD. (Prints are 35min a piece with four tables going at once. Breaks, 10-15 a piece.)

Screening time does not exist as we have corporate policy against
pre-screening. Apparently some manager in NY got himself into some deep water after inviting about 400 people to pre screen a film. So every DC metro lowes/cpx booth has this lovely memo, that we are required to display, which states that pre-screening will result in termination.
 

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Posted by Jason Burroughs (Member # 68) on 12-04-2003, 12:10 PM:
 

quote:

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Prints are 35min a piece with four tables going at once. Breaks, 10-15 a piece.)

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• Village
  National
  Bruin
  Crest
  Avco

• Chinese
  Egyptian
  Cinerama Dome
  Pantages
  El Capitan (use to before DLP)

 

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Posted by Paul Konen (Member # 41) on 12-04-2003, 01:55 PM:
 
Tom, here is how a day like that would go for me. (24 screens)

2 booth members running the day shift. Each builds 1 print
2 booth members running the night shift. Only running the side.
(They might break down a print if it is done early)

2 booth members dedicated to building prints.

1-2 more booth members come in at 10:00 pm to help screen in addition to the 4 already on duty, plus myself, plus my GM.

After screenings all screeners, except GM, move prints, break down, etc and still won't leave until 2:30 am generally.

Along with what Jason said, I think you may have just been lucky.

Also, are you referring to that you had 4 prints building directly to platter at the same time?

Paul
 

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Posted by John Pytlak (Member # 331) on 12-04-2003, 02:07 PM:
 
It's always a good idea to evaluate the print by projection after it is made-up, and before you have a paying audience. The primary purpose of the pre-screening is NOT to entertain the staff and their friends, but to find any defects missed during bench-inspection and make-up. All sound formats for that theatre should be checked, and rechecked if the print is moved to a theatre using a different digital sound format.
 

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Posted by Tom Ruhling (Member # 1063) on 12-04-2003, 06:27 PM:
 
Hey Paul.

I want to work at your theatre! It is poor to expect that work be done in such a short period of time. I have been running at this pace for three years at this location. I build on the rewind tables then spin one up while building the next. I alternate between the two rewind tables for each print. My point was that they are pretty cheap in my district. (The same as the Georgetown) I am not happy about the pace. As for luck, seems to have held out for 20 years. (My craft is only capable of warp 4.9)
 

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Posted by Jack Ondracek (Member # 1466) on 12-04-2003, 06:53 PM:
 
After a quick look through here, it seems one explanation might be missed... if I didn't see it... sorry!

Adam's observation that this kind of thing is easily blamed on nonexistent makeup times might have been right on in this case. I've never understood why the studios, ETS or Technicolor insist on shipping a feature out with reels that aren't consistently heads or tails out, but that's been happening a lot over the past few years.

Not that it's any excuse, but I wouldn't be surprised if the operator just lopped all the "leaders" off, lined up the reels in order & spliced them together on the quick. He got screwed because he didn't notice that a couple of the reels were tails out.
 

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Posted by Steve Kraus (Member # 476) on 12-04-2003, 08:17 PM:
 
As this was a new print (not one where some idiot flip flopped the leaders) there is no excuse to make up a reel backwards. How stupid must someone be to not know the difference between a head leader and a tail?

And this business about some reels one way or some the other seem ridiculous. As a changeover operator who inspects heads and tails of everything I naturally prefer the old standard of receiving a film tails out and I send it on that way too. If I was a platter user whose "inspection" consisted of watching the film wind onto the platter I would naturally prefer all the reels to be heads up. But if some are going to be wound one way and some the other way I think I would be glad for those that would be on heads, not wishing that they were all tails out just for sake of consistency. Just like right now I am glad if a few are tails out, not wishing all were heads up just so they are all the same. Are people really so mindless that they would prefer all the way opposite of what they want just so it's consistent?

Why does that report only talk about an upside down image and no mention of it running backwards?
 

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Posted by Nate Lehrke (Member # 1460) on 12-05-2003, 02:43 AM:
 
Steve - Ask your manager what the problem with the sound was. I didn't get a single complaint about the sound during or after the screening, but if he has a suggestion or observation, I'd love to hear it

Haven't determined what caused the tail be come 'un-tucked'. The security personal assigned to the print was suppose to be watching the print and NOT the feature but, of course, who wouldn't want to see a new LOTR's ? Learned my lesson about trusting someone to watch over the booth. Next time, Ill be sitting next to the platters for the whole show, regardless.
 

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Posted by Carl Martin (Member # 1146) on 12-05-2003, 03:25 AM:
 

quote:

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I had no idea the Dolby Digital Track could play in reverse .I imagine the analogue track could but for some reason I thought the digital would not, it proved me wrong!

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i'm pretty darn sure that it can't, at the very least not intelligibly. it would have to be painstakingly designed to do so. since it was on the other side of the film from normal it would not have been read anyways, and what you heard was the optical track in reverse.

as for heads/tails consistency, it all depends on how they're grouped. HHTHTT is easier than all heads. THHTTH is not.

carl
 

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Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 12-05-2003, 04:40 AM:
 
Wow. This film must be cursed or something.

Word on the street is that Thursday's press screening in Boston had sound problems (digital dropouts and weirdness throughout), though nothing as serious as others have posted in this thread.
 

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Posted by John Pytlak (Member # 331) on 12-05-2003, 07:50 AM:
 
Orientation of a brand new reel will depend on whether the lab uses loop-type printers or bi-directional panel printers. Normal orientation during printing is heads-to-tails, so after processing, the reels are oriented heads first. On a bi-directional printer, the film is printed both heads-to-tails, and tails-to-heads. A percentage of reels are inspected by high speed projection or inspection machines after processing, which would reverse the orientation.

My personal preference would be for prints to be shipped tails out, so the required rewinding would at least encourage some hands-on inspection in the theatres during make-up.
 

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Posted by Bill Gabel (Member # 1105) on 12-05-2003, 09:58 AM:
 
We have had no problems with the prints on any of the screenings here in New York City.
 

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Posted by Steve Kraus (Member # 476) on 12-05-2003, 11:27 AM:
 
No problem with mine last Saturday here in Chicago either. 1 hour arrival time for a changeover screening. All reels were inspected heads and tails prior to projection and for added fun I was simultaneously setting up for an unexpected unmarried film subsequent to LOTR which would have to run without any sort of on-screen test run due to lack of time and guests already seating.
 

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Posted by Adrian Steiner (Member # 1527) on 12-05-2003, 01:35 PM:
 
About playing SRD backwards:

We screened last week the trailer of "Avalon" backwards so that the sound still played. I was down in the auditorium, watching tanks running bottom up and bombs falling up, but friends told me, SRD always reverted to SR. The funny part was, Polish sounded like Russian.

Before that, we showed "Irréversible". It's opening credits get shifted ~30 degrees to the right, like someone plays with the anamorphotic lens during the opening credits. It's trailer is nice, too: Starts with a woman lying on the grass - but the picture is upside down. Made me nearly banging my head on the wall because I thought it was "film done wrong".

Adi

P.S.:
Offtopic:
Don't watch Irréversible if you
-are epilleptic
-have a weak stomach
 

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Posted by Paul Konen (Member # 41) on 12-05-2003, 01:37 PM:
 
Mine went well too. Tuesday Dec 2

Tom, I'd take you, but I don't think I can get you what you get now.
 

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Posted by Jack Ondracek (Member # 1466) on 12-05-2003, 01:55 PM:
 
..from Steve:

quote:

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...there is no excuse to make up a reel backwards. How stupid must someone be to not know the difference between a head leader and a tail?

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quote:

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It all goes back to the 'piracy' crap. They want to insure that no-one videotapes the film, so they get the print there an hour before showtime - with a guard.

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I don't quite understand how it makes any difference if they send the print four hours before the public screening or one hour -- their security guard is still with the print and can do whatever the hell he does to insure that it will not be pirated while in his perview. How much extra can it cost the studio...what are they paying this guy....8 bucks an hour? Surely they can afford that miniscule added expense to insure that their press screening or opening with the director and/or major stars, plays without a hitch.

And talk about putting blame where blame belongs, I heard a story about a projectionist in NYC at either the Ziegfeld or the Astor Plaza (can't recall which only that it was a premiere house) who ran a press screening of one of the first STAR TREK movies. Turns out a reel was not backwards but I believe a reel was out of sequence and the show had to be stopped and everyone went home. The story as I heard it from the union guys was that both Paramount and the theatre management insisted that projectionist be fired, although the studio was not concerned enough about insuring no mishaps by paying for a test screening. The worse thing about it is that the day guy didn't even make up the print -- the closing guy the night before did. And the stalwart defenders of the poor working stiffs at local 306 caved in to the theatre's demand and fired the day guy, not the one who made up the print. Then again, he wasn't a friend of the union leadership and the evening guy was. Everything is politics.
 

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Posted by Dennis M Dow Jr (Member # 1970) on 12-07-2003, 07:00 PM:
 
Frank,
I know at the Astor they messed up the 70mm and 35mm print of 2001.
Yes everything is politics esp in 306 and if you were an FoS(friend of Steve) you did not have to worry about anything... there was always a home somewhere for you.
But getting back to the security and prints and piracy, New Line is very paranoid about this movie. Guess Valenti has everyone worried that someone is going to get past security during the tech.
 

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Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 12-07-2003, 07:33 PM:
 
I'm surprised that New Line is so worried about ROTK, since all the buzz (including comments from someone I know who saw the press screening) is very positive. I would tend to think that the big concern for piracy is that if the movie is bad, people will watch pirated copies, realize that it's bad, and then not go see it at a theatre. On the other hand, for something like ROTK, assuming that it actually _is_ good, one would expect that anyone watching a pirated copy would enjoy it and have a desire to see it on the big screen.

Regardless, if I were a theatre owner who wanted to rent out the theatre for press screenings, I would simply tell the customer that a test screening (optionally, with a representative of the film distributor present, and, preferably, several days in advance of the scheduled show) would be required to ensure a perfect presentation, and that it would cost $X for this screening, without which I (the theatre owner) would refuse liability for presentation problems. Obviously, there's no excuse for showing a reel backwards, but the blame should go on the customer for not requesting a test screening.
 

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Posted by Mark J. Marshall (Member # 1409) on 12-07-2003, 09:28 PM:
 
There is absolutely no excuse for this, and it's clearly operator error. There are other problems in this industry that lead to this madness like paying kids $6.50 an hour to run the shows, having prints arrive without ample time for a kid making $6.50 to put it together right, etc. But for a properly trained operator, this should have been no problem.
 

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Posted by Dennis Benjamin (Member # 1137) on 12-08-2003, 02:25 AM:
 
Actually...

We had a press screening of "Looney Toons' not to long ago. They dropped the print off the night before. A guard came in the next morning to 'stay with the print'. A lot of sense that made...

Someone mentioned earlier that the press screening of ROTK in Minneapolis had a problem - do we know which theatre that occured at?
 

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Posted by John Hawkinson (Member # 1135) on 12-08-2003, 10:43 AM:
 
Scott suggests requiring test screenings for press screenings.

I don't think that's very reasonable, at least not for most press screenings that are attended by only a few people and only run once. Remember Steve K.'s comments last year about his AMPAS screenings where no one showed up? Why waste all that effort?

I think we can agree that a competant professional operator should not get reels out of order or backwards or half-twisted. Studios should be able to expect that degree of professionalism.

Obviously many flaws in prints cannot be detected, but many screening prints are circuitted, and ought to have been previously test-run.

If a single theatre were to make such a statement, I expect the studios would just go elsewhere for their press screenings, and rightly so. Competant operators are a competitive advantage (or should be!).

As a small example, we have high standards for the test screenings of films we run at MIT, but we don't test-screen sneak previews, we take them as they come. We find that's a reasonable accomodation and we have not been bitten by it (err, except for 2 minor instances of final DTS discs and non-final edit reels).

--jhawk
 

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Posted by Steve Kraus (Member # 476) on 12-08-2003, 01:07 PM:
 
I'd be more than happy to test run all films. Normal rates would apply.

While this represents extreme carelessness (or know-nothing-ness) if they were plattering a new print where the leaders would be the primary thing they should have noticed it's interesting to think about how many of us pay attention to image orientation in the event the leaders had been cut and put on reversed head to tail. For me, I would probably be puzzling over the lack of C/O dots (during my inspection) when they were present on the other reels. If the orientation didn't jump out at me right then it certainly would if I tried to scribe dots because all other things being equal attempting to place dots on the wrong end would have the film on the rewind bench base side up which would certainly have sirens going off even if it took a moment to figure out what was up. Obviously, mismatched "ID" frames would call attention even faster than C/O dots or image orientation.
 

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Posted by Bill Gabel (Member # 1105) on 12-08-2003, 01:09 PM:
 
As Mark Marshall said

quote:

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There is absolutely no excuse for this, and clearly operator error.

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In replying to Scotts post on requiring test screenings for press screenings. I don't think that's very reasonable, at least not for most press screenings that are attended by only a few people and only run once.

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I run a lot of press screenings from brand new prints to ones that have been circuitted from other theatres or screening rooms. Some of them that have never been plattered to ones that the last operator should go back to selling popcorn downstairs.
About 90% of the time the prints have no problems the other 5% is from lazy operators. The only times we ever did a pre-screening of a print was on a premiere or an main all media press screening. Like right now I'm running a press screening of "ROTK", the print came in at 11am. My prep time was 11:30am and I have 4 more press and academy screenings set for today. I run reel to reel. So this is not a reel to reel vs. platter debate. Because I've been there with late delivered prints for a platter screening. So I know the problems of just getting it on the screen on time.
 

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Posted by Steve Kraus (Member # 476) on 12-08-2003, 01:26 PM:
 
I feel that I take responsibility for each reel coming up in frame and focus and for the changeover that will get me out of the reel successfully. Over the course of the reel I am concerned with focus and keeping any fibers or debris blown out should they cling to the aperture. (Obviously brightness, steadiness, quality of sound, etc. and many other things are part and parcel of a quality screening but I'm speaking now only of things applying to an individual screening.)

Beyond these things if something unusual happens over the course of a reel (lets say a bad lab splice caused the printer to jump a perf and it goes out of frame) obviously one deals with it the best one can and fix it if possible for the next person (or note it and call whoever is responsible for that print). But I won't feel like I have committed an error by not having caught it before it went on screen. Heads and tails is all there is really time to check on. Even so I would say about 75% of my work is inspecting & repair prints and only about 15% the actual running. Very often I am inspecting reels just keeping ahead of their being projected.
 

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Posted by John Pytlak (Member # 331) on 12-08-2003, 01:41 PM:
 
The lack of time for a proper film inspection is the real issue.

When I worked at the Grandview Drive-In (1967-1970), we were EXPECTED and paid to inspect every foot of every reel on the rewind before putting the film on "house reels" for showing. This included checking the film for bad splices and perforation damage that could cause a film break or misframing, as well as for the proper cue marks (we ran 2000-foot changeovers), reel sequence/continuity, and image orientation. We also noted unusual dirt or scratches, ordering a replacement reel if the damage was significant.

Admittedly, many of the second-run triacetate prints we ran NEEDED inspection to avoid problems. But even if the chances of a new print problem are one reel in a hundred, do you want to risk that over 5% of your first showings will have a problem?
 

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Posted by Steve Kraus (Member # 476) on 12-08-2003, 02:53 PM:
 
Fortunately the percentages of significant problem reels is much lower than that which is a good thing since there are limits to what one can detect on even a slow bench inspection and if you are inspecting slower than real time you might as well just test run it since the bench isn't going to inform you of, say, a picture jumping up and down with each turn of the printer sprocket, digital dropouts, and a myriad other things.
 

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Posted by John Pytlak (Member # 331) on 12-08-2003, 03:04 PM:
 
That's why I also feel "Film Done Right" ideally includes a pre-screening.

Obviously, flipped orientation would have easily been caught with proper bench inspection.
 

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Posted by Christian Appelt (Member # 1067) on 12-08-2003, 03:38 PM:
 
If distributors fear piracy when prints are delivered in advance, why don`t they send all reels except the last?
Then, maybe an hour or two before the screening starts, the projectionist would just have to put one more reel to the platter, and which pirate would want to bootleg an incomplete feature?
 

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Posted by Bill Gabel (Member # 1105) on 12-08-2003, 03:40 PM:
 

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Obviously, flipped orientation would have easily been caught with proper bench inspection.

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And seeing the words Head or Tail on the leader would have help too..
 

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Posted by Dennis Benjamin (Member # 1137) on 12-08-2003, 05:57 PM:
 
I would have to agree on the reel handling. I was originally trained to build movies directly onto the platter. When I went to work for National Amusements they taught me the importance of carefully inspecting each reel and using the rewind bench to actually build the films onto hour-reels. That was the best training that I had recieved. They used to have a very rigorous two-week training seminar for all their management.
 

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Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 12-09-2003, 12:48 AM:
 
Well, two more ROTK screenings went off without a hitch locally today. Lots of customers were rudly probed and insulted (you should've seen the look on a couple of their faces!), and of course we had the token guy who has no friggin' clue as to what he is doing "watching the print". Allow me to vent.

So the prints are sitting between #5 and 6, I walk down into the next booth toward #2 to get a center ring...the guy leaves the prints and follows me in another part of the building. I head to another booth to get a splicer, the guy leaves the prints and follows me. I go to another booth to get a MUT, the guy leaves the prints and follows me. I leave to go to the bathroom, the guy actually tries to follow me!!! (This was up until he saw I was actually entering the bathroom and was about to get a beating had he continued.)

Really now, if the studios are going to send people to stay with and protect their prints, THEN STAY WITH THE FUCKING PRINT YOU IDIOT! DON'T WALK AWAY FROM IT! I certainly did not appreciate every time I walked by one of the machines running the screening how he stood up and started following me as I went to another auditorium to thread up something else. After awhile we started messing with the guy, by taking one step into the next booth and then turning around...just enough to make him get his butt out of the chair to "do his duty". Nothing beats being treated as if we are criminals.

Next time this happens, I think I'll set up a tag team to have someone intentionally go into the booth and take the print into the back of the concession stand while I am being followed in another booth. Think that would teach them a lesson about not leaving the print that they are supposed to be protecting?

On another note, Deluxe did a LOVELY job in putting a lab splice in reels 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 AND reel 10 in the ten reel print. Just marvelous! And how they managed to get 5 out of the 10 reels tails out is beyond me. A perfect 50%!

And whatever mastermind decided to pack a 10 reel movie in two 7 slot "Fox boxes" should lose his job. 2/3 of the reels came in broken and one reel had it's core almost completely popped out of the center of the film roll. You know, when a print is delivered at the last minute for an important screening, I really don't have time to play fuck-around with broken reels! (I did replace all the broken reels with good ones and found that the reels could be placed in the box horizontally instead of vertically. It gave a perfect fit and will protect the reels from getting broken for the next theater.)

And one last thing, New Line specified the second auditorium to be played in dts (since there was no Dolby Digital in there). Sure, no problem...if you'll send some discs.

Regardless, the shows went smoothly to the audience.. If only Jack Valenti and Deluxe hadn't have been involved, it would've gone smoothly for the upstairs operation too.
 

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Posted by Bill Gabel (Member # 1105) on 12-09-2003, 10:26 AM:
 
On all my screenings of the picture, I have had 3 security people checking people in and one person watching the print. The security people check bags and backpacks and they also check bags from stores like Macy's. Another thing they were asking was about Cell phones (like the ones that send pictures). Out of all the four people assigned to this screening. No one was allowed in the booth. The person assigned to watch the print had two chooses to sit outside of the booth or watch the movie. And the other 3 sat in the lobby, making sure the lobby was safe.

I can't wait till the BIG PICTURES for next summer.

Brad
The guy assigned to watch the print misunderstood, he thought they said watch the projectionist. Remember they both start with P. Because the people that we have had had really no clue of what to do.
 

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Posted by Rich Ferrando (Member # 2056) on 12-09-2003, 10:37 AM:
 
That has got to be annoying. I can't imagine being tailed at work. It's bad enough being followed by plainclothes officers at a department store.

I'm glad I work in an arthouse theater - haven't yet had a print that the studio felt compelled to protect with armed guards (or at least was "important" enough to protect), and we always have at least 24 hours with which to pre-screen, sometimes more (we received our print of "Porn Theatre" over a week ago, and it doesn't open until Friday.)

Splicing a reel in upside-down is one thing I have great fear of. Luckily, thusfar, the worst things I've done are the occasional bad splice during trailers, and once starting a film without a lens in the projector (which was just a stupid mistake on my part.) I guess I've lucked out thusfar - still haven't had a tail wrap or thrown a print (yet). I know that these will happen eventually, but for now I'll hold my breath and try not to panic when they do happen.

The strangest thing I've seen occurred during a pre-screening of "The Hills Have Eyes," which we had for a Halloween Midnight movie. We got a brand-new print of it, and for some reason, in the middle of Reel 4, there were two copies of the SAME SCENE. Basically, two characters are talking to someone on a CB radio, they get close to the end of their conversation, and then POOF! back it cuts to the beginning of the scene! And it was actually like that in the print - no splices near it. Very weird.
 

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Posted by Dennis M Dow Jr (Member # 1970) on 12-09-2003, 04:56 PM:
 
John said

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checking the film for bad splices and perforation damage that could cause a film break

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When making print up onto 6000' reels one should have been trained to detect these. Wearing white glove and just letting fingers ride over edge you can detect perf damage, lab splices, clear splices and any other damage on the print. If the chains can not train the operators correctly they deserve whatever they get.

But no matter the Fuck Up still belongs to the operator and no amount of excuses can change that.
 

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Posted by Adam Martin (Member # 641) on 12-09-2003, 07:20 PM:
 
Since no one else has mentioned it, I'll bring up the fact that it does no good for management to hover around the projectionist when a film gets delivered late doing a grammar school "I've gotta pee" dance and incessantly asking "Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet? Is it ready yet?" This only further distracts from the assembly/inspection process.
 

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Posted by Jack Ondracek (Member # 1466) on 12-09-2003, 09:18 PM:
 
Just an aside, but somewhat topical:
At a recent exhibitor screening of a film, the name and distributor of which shall not be divluged (looney, isn't it?) we were stopped inside the theatre and asked if we had cell phones with us. Those of us who did were required to return them to our cars... 4 floors down and a healthy walk from where we were. The theater would not hold them for us or allow us to turn them off and continue. Several of us headed for our cars, muchly miffed. Upon returning, we had discussed the advantage of just lying to the dweeb at the door. However, we were again accosted at the auditorium door, where the show had already begun, and were wanded and asked by yet another dweeb if we had any contriband cell phones on our person. Sheesh.

Apparently, quite a few of us griped about it. The studio, in a world-class demonstration of face-saving technique, advised that the cell phone "ban" was only supposed to apply to those phones with BUILT-IN CAMERAS!, apparently fearing the result of the high-definition full-length images such attachments could record.

But hey, I guess I can understand the paranoia. Team the output of a modern-day cell phone with an un-protected DTS disk & you've got instant Chinese-quality pirate copies...

.... I guess...

(Last Samurai Review):
 

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Posted by Daryl C. W. O'Shea (Member # 1303) on 12-09-2003, 10:43 PM:
 
The next exhibitor screening I go to, I think I'll wrap myself in tinfoil before I go.

Now if I could only find real tin foil...
 

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Posted by Jack Ondracek (Member # 1466) on 12-09-2003, 11:01 PM:
 

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I think I'll wrap myself in tinfoil before I go

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They'll let you in.

Just don't take a cell phone with a camera with you!
 

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Posted by Daryl C. W. O'Shea (Member # 1303) on 12-09-2003, 11:06 PM:
 
Noted.
 

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Posted by Brad Miller (Member # 2) on 12-10-2003, 12:22 AM:
 
Just show up butt naked. If anyone says anything, just start complaining about how the guards are going to do a full body search anyway, so you figured you would just save everybody the time.
 

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Posted by Carl Martin (Member # 1146) on 12-10-2003, 02:52 AM:
 

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Those of us who did were required to return them to our cars.

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There was an early critics' screening of "Return of the King" in Washington, D.C., and right before the first big battle sequence the movie started playing upside down. Did you hear about that? And did it cause your blood pressure to fluctuate?
Jackson: [Laughs] Well, yeah. I just thought the projectionist was a complete moron. There's no other explanation, because it happened twice in the screening, as I understand. The first time it happened, they rethreaded it all, which takes about 20 minutes. They started it up again, it played—and then a couple of reels later it was upside down again.
Eastwood: That's a real nightmare.
Jackson: Oh, yeah.

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Not sure what consitutes an EK print on a Super 35 / digital intermediate show.

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