Film-Tech Forum ARCHIVE: Proj. Union/Jobs in NYC

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Posted by Aaron Distler (Member # 1444) on 02-29-2004, 08:53 PM:

I'm relocating in a few months from Evansville, IN to NYC. I've been a projectionist for a little over 8 years now and I'd like to continue to do the work when I move. I heard that all projectionists in NYC must be in the Union. If so, how does one go about that? Also, does anyone know what the average salary is for a projectionist is in the NYC area?

Any advice or input would be wonderful.

Aaron

Posted by Dennis M Dow Jr (Member # 1970) on 03-01-2004, 12:18 AM:

Contact IATSE Local 306 to find out about joining the local... Salaries for projectionist vary depending on screen count and contracts. There are a lot of split theaters (mgr/union) with the operators getting 40hrs at these theaters.

Posted by Bill Gabel (Member # 1105) on 03-01-2004, 04:56 PM:

Not many full time theatre jobs left in the city that pays well. And most of the theatres with less than 6 screens are manager/staff operated, that pay just fair. And don't forget the Motion Picture Operators License and test with the city. Manhattan only has somewhere around 7-10 plexes with over 7 screens.

Posted by Frank Angel (Member # 248) on 03-02-2004, 11:43 AM:

As Bill knows, Manhattan is only one of the five boroughs (New York's unique governing structure, not a donkey) or counties that make up New York City. Manhattanites often make the misguided mistake of thinking of their borough as "the City" while dismissing the other four "outer" boroughs. But New York City does indeed consist of three islands (Manhattan, Staten and Long) as well as a thing called THE Bronx which is attached to the mainland, with my beloved Brooklyn and Queens being part of Western Long Island (Brooklynites and Queenies often make the misguided mistake of thinking that they are not on Long Island as in, "I am taking a trip 'out to the Island,' when indeed, they are already ON the island.) But I digress.

There are a lot more than 7-10 multiplexes when looking at the entire metropolitan area of the five boroughs and then the surrounding counties on Eastern Long Island. But Bill is right, of course, finding jobs will be iffy at best. Pay is all over the map and the exhibition industry has for decades put an enormous amount of energy in trying to eliminate the professional projectionist, so it is not a profession where there is any kind of demand from the theatre owners. In such an unbalanced climate, finding a decent wage paying job will be difficult. You might actually have a better chance of finding work outside NYC.

You said: I heard that all projectionists in NYC must be in the Union. Absolutely not; never was true. In New York City (all five counties) you do NOT need to belong to the union to be able to operate a 35mm or 70mm booth. You only need to have a NY Motion Picture Operator's License, which today is mostly a vestige of a once meaningful process and which now means nothing other than that you paid a fee and took a now-bogus test.

Although the union used to boast that all NYC projectionists belonged to their ranks and they used high-pressure intimidation on young people who had just passed their NY Projectionist License test into thinking they HAD to join, it was never a requirement for getting a projectionist job. I have been an independent projectionist since 1971, the year my first license was issued (I was seven). I have consistently made a better salary and gotten better benefits than the union ever offered, by negotiating with my employers myself.

I found that many operators of specialty venues prefer to hire their own staff and do not like the bullying tactics for with the union was notorious. The union's goon mentality and strong-arming methods assured me of consistent employ and ironically, it unwittingly created a demand for a nonunion alternative for me throughout my career.

Posted by Bill Gabel (Member # 1105) on 03-02-2004, 12:57 PM:

Frank

Well said [thumbsup]

The only reason I did not include the other boroughs, was because I did not know screen counts at those plexes.

Posted by Martin Brooks (Member # 1269) on 03-02-2004, 10:28 PM:

Here are some counts for the boroughs:
I've only counted special venues (like museums) that have regular film schedules, list themselves in magazines such as Time Out and are open to the public. There are numerous others (such as Frank's) that have film facilities.

Queens: 116 screens at 18 locations + 2 special venues.
Brooklyn: 91 screens at 14 locations + 1 special venue
The Bronx: 44 screens at 4 locations.
Staten Island: 44 screens at 4 locations.
Manhattan: 217 screens at 36 locations + 25 special venues.

Posted by Bill Gabel (Member # 1105) on 03-03-2004, 09:22 AM:

Thanks Martin

But remember, its not how many locations, but how many screens at that location as to if it has a union projectionist.

Posted by Martin Brooks (Member # 1269) on 03-03-2004, 10:32 PM:

OK, so here's a fairly complete list:
(sorry for the lousy formatting and apologies if I've left off anyone's favorite special venue) (S=special venue)

Manhattan (Downtown):
R-UA BatteryPkCity 11 Vesey & West
Screening Room 2 54 Varick/Canal.
Lndmk Sunshine Cinema 5 E. Houston 2 Av
Rd/CC Angelika Film Ctr6 18WHouston/Mer
FF Film Forum 3 209 W. Houston
IFC IFC3 (under construction) 6Av 3St
LCE Loews Village VII 3Av 11st.
CC Village East 7 2Av 12 st.
Cinemt Cinema Village 12th 3 12St Eof 5Av
CC Quad 13St 5-6Av
R-UA Union Square 14 Bdy 13St
S Two Boots Pioneer 155 E3rd Av A
S Anthology FilmArch 2Av 2St
S Instituto Cervantes 53WashSqS
S NYU Cantor Film Center E8 Univ
S Cinema Classics 3 (16mm) 11st. 1-2Av
S Center for Jewish History 16th St 5-6Av

Manhattan (East Side):
LCE Loews19thSt East 6 Bdy 19St
S MOMA @ the Gramercy 23rd Lex-Pk
LCE Loews Kips Bay 15 2Av 32St
CC Sutton 57St 3Av
CC Cinema 1, 2, 3 3Av 60St
CL First & 62nd-6 1Av 62St
R-UA 64th & 2nd I, II, III 2Av 64St
CL Beekman 2Av 65St
Crown NY Twin 2Av 66St
LCE Loews Tower 72nd St East 3Av 71St
R-UA East 85th Street 1Av 85St
LCE LoewsOrpheumVII 3Av 86St
CC/Rding 86th St. East 4 86St 2-3Av
S Scandinavia House Park 37St
S Japan Society 47th 1-2Av
S YWCA Lex 53St
S French Institute 59St Mad-Pk
S Asia Society Park 70th
S Whitney Museum 945 Madison 75St
S Goethe Institut 5Av 82nd St
S Guggenheim Mus 5Av 88St
S Jewish Mus 5Av 92St
S YMCA 610 Lex 96th St

Manhattan (West Side):
CL Chelsea West Cin 2 23St 8-9Av
CL Chelsea Cin.9 23St 8Av
LCE Loew's 34th St 14 34St 8-9Av
AMC Empire 25 42St 8Av
LCE Loews E-Walk 13 42St 8Av
LCE Loews Astor Plaza 44St Bdy
LCE Loews State 4 Bdy 45St
S MOMA 1&2 53St 5-6Av
CL Ziegfield 54St 6-7Av
CE Pro Paris 58St 5Av
CL 62nd & Broadway Bdy 62St
GTM Lincoln Pl. Cin. 6 Bdy 63St
SLinCtr Walter Reade Bdy 65St
LCE Sony Lincoln Sq12 Bdy 68St

LCE Loews 84th St 6 Bdy 84St
CL Metro Bdy 99St
LCE Magic Johnson Harlem USA 9 125St FdDougB
S Mus of TV & Radio 52St 5-6Av
S NYPL@Donnell Media 53St 5-6Av
S DGA Theatre 57St 6-7Av
S Makor W67 CPW-Col
S NY Historical Society 77St CPW
S Leonard Nimoy Thalia Bdy 95St
S Columbia U Miller Bdy 116St

Queens:
S Mus of Mov Image 35Av
S Theatre in the Park Flushing Meadow Pk.
Cinemart 6 Forest Hills
NorthShoreTowers (2) Floral Park
Circuit Plaza I & II Corona
LCE Cinema 5 Fresh Meadows
LCE Fresh Meadows 7 Fresh Meadows
Creat Jackson Triplex 82nd-Roosevelt
Lester New Center Cinema 5 Qns Blvd Sunnyside
Lester New Main St. Cin 6 72-66 Main St. Flushing
Lester Kew Gardens 5 Kew Gardens
Loews Bay Terrace 6 Bell Blvd. Bayside
NA College Point (12) 28-55 Ulmer St.
R-UA Movieworld Douglaston (7) 242-02 61Av
R-UA Midway 9 QnsBlvd
R-UA Brandon Cinemas 2 Austin St.
R-UA CrossBay I (3) RockawayBlvd-Woodh
R-UA Cross Bay II (7) RockawayBlvd-93St.
R-UA Kaufman-Astoria Cinema 14 38thSt 35Av Astoria
NA Jamaica 15 Jamaica/Parsons

Brooklyn
S Brooklyn Museum of Art
BAM Rose Cinemas 4 30 Lafayette
SA Pavilion Bklyn Hts. 2 70 Henry
SA Pavillion Flatbush 2 Flatbush-7Av
Cl CobbleHill Fiveplx Court-Butler
Creat CanarsieTriplex AvL-E93St
Creat Kent Triplex CI Av-Av H
Creat Circuit Ridgewood Fiveplx Myrtle-Putnam
LCE Alpine 7 5Av-BayRidgeAv
LCE Fortway Fiveplex 68thSt-FtHamilPky
LCE Kings Plaza 6 Flatbush-AvU
NA LindenBlvdMultplx14 LindenBlvd-EldertsLa.
SA The Pavillion 8 PPW 14th St.
R-UA Sheepshead Bay 15 KnappSt
R-UA Court St. Stadium 12 Court/State

The Bronx
Epst. American 7 1450 EastAv
AMC Bay Plaza 13 2210 Bartow Av
NA ConcoursePlaza10 214E161st-GndConc.
NA WhitestoneMult.14 BrucknerBlvd-Hutch

Staten Island
R-UA HylanPlaza 5 New Dorp
R-UA SI Stadium 14 Travis
R-UA All Staten Island 16 Mariners Harbor-Forest Av.
BGS Atrium9 680 Arthur Kill RdEltingville

Posted by Matt Zeiner (Member # 1914) on 03-04-2004, 06:25 AM:

The Atrium on Staten Island closed this year unfortunately...

Posted by Aaron Distler (Member # 1444) on 03-05-2004, 09:00 AM:

thanks for all the input. basically, i'll be living in williamsburg or greenpoint brooklyn. i'd like to stick with projecting if possible. it's something that i really enjoy (as opposed to what my degree is in: advertising). i just think i'd have better luck finding a job in a theater as opposed to an ad agency.

currently, i make $7.45/hr and work 32 hours/week. they don't really offer a full time position for projectionists here. basically, if i could find anything that is better than what i have now with chances for survival, i'd be a happy, happy man. are my odds good? or should i start looking for jobs in advertising again?

Posted by Martin Brooks (Member # 1269) on 03-10-2004, 09:40 PM:

Frankly, I 'd look for a job in Advertising. Any job in Advertising is going to pay a lot more than $7.45 an hour, even a starting position. And unless you're living in Williamsburg with 12 other people, anything near $7.45 an hour isn't going to pay your rent, which probably will be at least $1000 a month.

Posted by John T. Hendrickson, Jr (Member # 849) on 03-11-2004, 07:41 AM:

Aaron-

I don't want to rain on your parade, but I have to tell you that the cost of living in the New York metropolitan area is a lot higher than in Indiana. You are in for sticker shock as far as housing costs and taxes go.

Best advice I could give is to have something lined up BEFORE you make the move.

Posted by Tim Reed (Member # 137) on 03-11-2004, 09:14 AM:

If I were you, knowing what you know, I'd go with advertising in a heartbeat. Madison Avenue! The sky's the limit, man.

The job of projectionist has no future. It has been diminishing in importance and function for at least 20 years, to such a degree that you can't even make a living at it anymore.

Please, PLEASE, find something else. This, from someone who chose crank-turning as a career nearly 30 years ago (when it was still a bonafide craft) and ended up becoming a dinosaur.

Posted by Bill Gabel (Member # 1105) on 03-11-2004, 09:22 AM:

Aaron

When I made the move from Hollywood to New York three years ago. I had a position all lined up and was just waiting for a start date. The studio sent me to New York for a week and put me up at a hotel. At the end of that week, I was told you start in two weeks. As Martin and John have said the cost of living is different from many areas in the US. I work as a projectionist and live in mid-town Manhattan and I pay $1700 a month in rent and thats without a room mate.

Posted by Frank Angel (Member # 248) on 03-11-2004, 01:58 PM:

Geez Bill, come live in Brooklyn -- you could get a really nice apartment for half that, and the subway commute isn't as bad as its reputation.

Posted by Bill Gabel (Member # 1105) on 03-11-2004, 03:05 PM:

Frank
A few people have told me that. But live one block from work and the pubs, I go to are very close too. Having come to New York on vacations, I knew what the costs were. But when friends from California come out to visit, that have never been here. They talk about how high the cost of living is here. [Eek!]

Posted by Bob Maar (Member # 763) on 03-11-2004, 03:09 PM:

Geeze Bill, where did you find such a cheap apartment. You must be in a sub basement. [Wink]

Go to the Bronx before you move to Brooklyn...at least you could root for the Yankees.

Posted by Bill Gabel (Member # 1105) on 03-11-2004, 03:12 PM:

Bob

It's in one of those water towers on top of my building. [beer]

Posted by Scott Norwood (Member # 30) on 03-11-2004, 03:16 PM:

Yankees? [puke]

(Sorry...had to. Frank is welcome to come to Boston to see a real baseball team this summer.)

Posted by Bob Maar (Member # 763) on 03-11-2004, 03:23 PM:

Scott, Is that the team that lost to the Yankees last Sunday? Besides Bill wants to root for a winner. [thumbsup]

The Red Stockings will fall [sleep]

before August.

Posted by Daryl C. W. O'Shea (Member # 1303) on 03-11-2004, 04:04 PM:

quote:
--------------------
If your Canadian..show me your beaver.

How's that going for you Bob?

Posted by Bob Maar (Member # 763) on 03-11-2004, 05:06 PM:

Daryl, Not bad...

I guess I'm the only one who smiles each time I think about it.

However I remember buying a "T" Shirt at the Canadian National Exposition in Toronto, with that saying and an extremely provocative gal on the front lifting her skirt.

Circa 1955 and I wish I still had it. I think my mother probably threw it out. [Big Grin]

I may never, recover.

Posted by Frank Angel (Member # 248) on 03-12-2004, 11:10 AM:

Well, Aaron, sorry to post even more bad news, but a CNN report came out today showing unemployment records -- New York ranked 4th from the top of the states with the worst unemployment, only bested by Washington, Michigan, Alaska and Oregon. New York has a 6.5% uemployment, whereas the country average is only 5.6 with your beloved Indiana coming in at an even 5%. South Dakota is at a low of only 2.9%.

Now these are state-wide numbers and in states like NY which have very high density urban centers as well as very rural areas, the numbers may skew quite a bit off the norm between the two, so unemployment could even be higher in a labor-rich city like NY. Neighboring Connecticut, New Jersey and Massachusetts have below average numbers at 4.7%, 5.5% and 5.6% respectively. But no matter how you cut it, it is still a bleak job market out there. And as this thread already points out, exhibition is not exactly banging down the doors of the newspaper's Want Ads departments to posts jobs for projectionists.

In related news, the Loews/Cineplex is reportedly looking to sell off an undisclosed number of theatres with screens numbering 3000.

Frank